Ask HN: How to Focus Again?

[brainrot]

Forgive the throwaway but I'm opening up for the first time about this...

I used to be able to set myself a task and focus on it until I finished. I could imagine a product and build an MVP in a weekend, flesh it out in a month and launch it. Now I can't focus on my tasks for more than a few minutes, I'm constantly context switching, procrastination is killing all productivity even for tasks that I was looking forward to. Today I wanted to really knuckle down and make some real progress on my side project. I've updated my iPad, fixed the leg on a tripod, cut the grass, cleaned the mower, scrubbed the driveway. Guess how much progress I made on the side project?

I talked to my GP - she said it could be undiagnosed ADHD, I filled in a quiz she gave me but she said it will take 2 years to get diagnosed(!) I can't wait that long.

How do I get back to how I used to be? Focused, driven, talented? I feel like part of me has rotted away and I want it back!

[nick0garvey]

A lot of people in this thread point at motivation or mental health issues. The issue is likely not so complicated.

You have forgotten how to focus. We live in a world where we are constantly distracted. This is forced on us. The apps we use compete over our attention, our workplace expects quick replies over Slack, our free time is always accompanied by a smart phone pushing us notifications.

These effects are getting stronger. Technology evolves new attention taking techniques. Our remote work culture expects faster replies as you are, in theory, always at your desk.

You can address this focus deficiency, but it isn't easy. Put your phone always on Do Not Disturb. Use site blocking extensions to limit time wasters (yes, even Hacker News). Stop being so responsive at work.

The first few weeks will hurt. You won't instantly be able to focus, and you will feel less productive due to the lower response time. But after some time, you will be able to do work others cannot. You can complete the big work you are struggling to right now. Relearn how to focus.

[heliodor]

Huberman has an episode explaining the brain workings of procrastination. Give it a watch/listen to pick up a few tips.

https://youtube.com/watch?v=K-TW2Chpz4k

Edit: here are some summaries:

https://podcastnotes.org/huberman-lab/leverage-dopamine-to-o...

https://healthnews.com/family-health/healthy-living/andrew-h...

[tomwojcik]

Almost 2h? I can't focus that long. Let me know once it's available as a 30 seconds tiktok.

/s

[mrtobo]

You're potentially insulting the reader who was looking for answers to the question.

[joshxyz]

i need it in short little bites.

lmk if theres a twitter thread so i can unroll it with threader app and forget it.

/s

[j7ake]

My experience has been opposite of Hubermans tips.

I find dopamine spiking activities, or putting a body in a state of discomfort (eg intense work out, cold showers) make me procrastinate more.

Doing an intense work out makes me think “I’m done for the day, I have done enough, I deserve a break from whatever I’m procrastinating on”.

[nosefurhairdo]

Huberman is the man. He's also got an episode specifically on ADHD which OP may find valuable.

[oarfish]

Unless you go there for advice on health and sports performance, for which he dissminates much bullshit.

[singedproxy]

I can't believe how much BS you can spit under the name of "science" and none will call you out as long as you say you are a doctor/scientist.

He is almost on par with bro-science fitness youtubers.

[sngz]

example? everything he says seems to be well sourced or cited from other experts in their fields, or if its only few studies and not well researched enough yet he explicitly says so. I keep hearing this claim from ppl but nobody can come up with any examples.

[nosefurhairdo]

Have any examples?

[brainrot]

Thank you I'll (try to) give this a watch!

[hintymad]

> You have forgotten how to focus

It could be due to aging. As people age, it gets harder for the body to release dopamine in anticipation of getting something we done, especially for things that we are familiar with. As a result, one loses focus because of no trickling joy. "Been there done that" in a way is truly a curse.

My own cure is always finding new things to tackle, and tackle only fundamental problems. Of course, my fundamental problem can be trivial to another smarter engineer. The key is to keep myself excited and therefore focused instead of how deep the problem is.

The downside of this approach, though, is that I may have to switch jobs, and I need to work hard to keep myself healthy to have enough energy.

[brainrot]

You could be right, I'm soon to turn 40 so maybe my brain is just slowing down and I can't ask as much of it as I used to. Hopefully a better diet and more exercise can counteract that to some degree.

[brainrot]

This makes a lot of sense, thank you. The expectation to always be available on teams, to reply to email quickly is very strong at my workplace. My apple watch means that even if I'm making a cup of tea, or using the restroom I still see when people are trying to contact me, or when one of the systems sends an alert so I'm never truly offline.

[rtuin]

For this reason I don’t wear a smart watch, but wear a smart ring to monitor vitals and heart/sleep trends. Just FYI.

[eloisius]

Don’t sleep with your phone in the bedroom.

[charred_patina]

@keikobadthebad already gave a good answer, but I'd like to expand upon it a bit.

> Sounds like the work might not lead somewhere you really judge is useful, or judge will be painful.

As someone with ADHD I have realized that my executive function goes to zero if I think doing something isn't worthwhile. Not if I consciously think it's worthwhile, but if I know deep down that it's pretty much pointless. Thankfully my brain is a pretty good judge of what is worthwhile. The value of doing something doesn't have to be intrinsic, it can be extrinsic. Right now I am thinking about a potential architectures I could implement at work, even though I'd like to enjoy the weekend. But it's easy to hyperfixate on because it delivers immediate value and gives me a consistent hit of dopamine. Before this job I was unemployed for 6 months, and became unproductive after 3 months and just started wasting the days. I was concerned that I would come back into this job and be unproductive. Nothing could be further from the truth. My brain just quickly learned that there was no carrot at the end of the stick (no impact of my software) as long as I was unemployed.

All that to say, it sounds like whatever you have been doing has been fruitless, or at least appears this way to the man in charge of your brain. Either you haven't been hitting consistent milestones, or the payoff isn't really rewarding.

A practice that has helped me determine which tasks are going to be easy for me to do is to think about how measurable a success metric is. If the success metric is just "learn a new skill" then I probably wont do it. If the success metric is to make something that will make my life or the lives of others easier, or something really kick-ass, then it becomes really easy to do.

You probably should sit down and think about what constitutes "success" or "completion" for each of these projects and think about why you think you want to do them in the first place.

[boomskats]

> I have realized that my executive function goes to zero if I think doing something isn't worthwhile. Not if I consciously think it's worthwhile, but if I know deep down that it's pretty much pointless. Thankfully my brain is a pretty good judge of what is worthwhile.

Thank you for putting this in writing in the way that you did. As someone who went undiagnosed for the first 37 years of their life, this is almost the exact wording I used to use to explain my executive (dys)function to my family, teachers, colleagues and friends.

Most of my teachers disliked me throughout my academic life, because while they could see the 'potential', my overall academic achievements were only ever good enough to level up to where I needed to be. However, I would win competitions and had a very high ceiling for the things I was into. As an adult I've struggled with myself a lot, but in the last 10 years I have built and sold a software company and successfully helped raise a family.

The ADHD label really made me question a lot of things for a couple of years, but I've now come back round to trusting and really appreciating that ability to subconsciously, intrinsically 'know' what is worth investing my time into and what is not. Rather than the hyperfocus people often cite, I consider that ability to be my real, true ADHD superpower.

[boredtofears]

Isn’t that constantly a thorn in your side though? Life is full of things that can feel intrinsically useless.

I’m constantly having to convince myself of the worth of things in order to finish them even when I may innately disagree with them. It feels like a never ending struggle.

[howenterprisey]

I'm the same way, and can answer: lots of things feel sort of useless, but so long as they have a deeper purpose I'm all for them. Like I usually don't have a problem with motivation for taxes, even though they feel sort of useless, because I know they're important in general. Although this isn't totally reliable... you're right, sometimes something feels too useless and I have trouble starting it. But usually it's fine.

[CuriouslyC]

To expand upon this, even if something will make the lives of others easier or could be a profitable product, that's still probably not worth doing since once you've built the thing you still have to market it, which is frustrating if you're not the sort of person who's into that (and then you probably wouldn't be a developer). There are a lot of excellent things (software, art, music, games, etc) that end up languishing in obscurity because they didn't get marketed correctly or enough, and that can be incredibly frustrating.

[xeckr]

>Not if I consciously think it's worthwhile, but if I know deep down that it's pretty much pointless.

This could be true, or it could be a self-serving bias. It's something to think about. Presumably, there was a point in time when you thought that the thing that you now think isn't worthwhile felt very much so.

[brainrot]

> All that to say, it sounds like whatever you have been doing has been fruitless, or at least appears this way to the man in charge of your brain. Either you haven't been hitting consistent milestones, or the payoff isn't really rewarding.

You know, this really hit home. I have very much failed to set milestones, or even properly break down the project into smaller chunks - in my mind it's just "the project" and sometimes it seems huge. I'm going to map it all out, then tackle it in smaller chunks. I'll hit the easy, quick tasks first - maybe those small wins will give me the motivation to tackle the bigger tasks. Thank you.

[charred_patina]

> I'm going to map it all out, then tackle it in smaller chunks. I'll hit the easy, quick tasks first

I didn't even get into coping mechanisms, but breaking things down into lists helps a lot. I am a one-man team at work but I still do stories and tasks and epics just to give a sense of progression.

I taught at a summer camp over the summer helping kids make games and all of the boys had serious attention issues, using a physical task board with sticky notes helped keep them on track and prevented them from losing morale.

> maybe those small wins will give me the motivation to tackle the bigger tasks

It sounds like you know exactly what to do. Usually I find starting is the hardest part, once I'm deep in the task it becomes effortless.

Finally, I wanna say that introspection is really helpful. I got diagnosed as a kid and never got medicated or anything, I never gave ADHD any thought until recently when I did some introspection and tried to understand /why/ I operated the way that I did, and how I could work around that. Asking why X was so easy but Y seems so hard is usually a good place to start. Good luck!

[idlewords]

Any prolonged pattern of distracted behavior will get you an ADHD diagnosis, provided you say it's (1) part of a pattern dating back to childhood and (2) affects multiple areas of your life. That in turn will get you a prescription for powerful stimulants, and it's up to you to decide whether the artificial focus those provide is a solution to your problem, or a cop-out from it. (I personally don't believe there's such a thing as 'ADHD', though I don't doubt the existence of the constellation of feelings and behaviors that cause people to seek out that label.)

Have you considered taking a vacation, maybe one without any use of computers or cell phones? It's not a cure-all, but stepping away like that will give you a fresh perspective once you get back to your day to day, and that in turn might bring insight into what has gone wrong. And if the real issue you're facing is burnout, then it will go a long way to fixing the problem.

[vcxy]

That's interesting. I thought it was obvious that ADHD does exist because it's just a constellation of behaviors that some people indeed do exhibit. I feel like we agree completely on the base facts and somehow have arrived at opposite conclusions.

[nosefurhairdo]

That's more a semantic disagreement than an opposite conclusion, considering you both agree the constellation of behaviors exists.

The degree to which any medical diagnosis exists is on a spectrum. A cancerous tumor obviously exists, high blood pressure exists but is relative, schizophrenia - and psychiatric diagnoses generally - exist but can be more difficult to observe externally.

The behaviors associated with ADHD are so common and relatable to most folks that the diagnosis seems less legitimate. To my knowledge, you cannot scan the brain of someone with ADHD and point out an abnormality associated with the disorder. Yet we give 8 year old boys stimulant medication because they can't sit still in a classroom for hours a day.

Fwiw I have ADHD and take stimulant medication daily. But I also understand folks' resistance to accept ADHD as being as legitimate as other medical diagnoses.

[iamflimflam1]

The behaviors associated with ADHD are so common and relatable to most folks that the diagnosis seems less legitimate.

There’s nothing more annoying when people respond to you with “yeah, well, everyone feels/behaves/think like that”

[DigitalBison]

> To my knowledge, you cannot scan the brain of someone with ADHD and point out an abnormality associated with the disorder. Yet we give 8 year old boys stimulant medication because they can't sit still in a classroom for hours a day.

I'm not well-versed in the risks of stimulants given to children so I'm not commenting on that specifically, but I want to push back on the insinuation (if I understood you correctly) that ADHD or its treatments are any less legitimate because we haven't yet figured out if we can use brain imaging to diagnose and measure treatment efficacy.

It would be great if all medical disorders could be externally measured and quantified objectively, but when they're not, we often rely on evaluating and diagnosing them based on the (often somewhat more subjective) impact of their symptoms. That's not ideal, but it seems better than nothing to me.

Full disclosure: I'm also diagnosed with ADHD and take daily stimulants. Apologies if I came off as combative, I'm relatively new to my ADHD journey and genuinely curious to learn more about the medical/scientific aspects.

[nosefurhairdo]

> ...but I want to push back on the insinuation (if I understood you correctly) that ADHD or its treatments are any less legitimate because we haven't yet figured out if we can use brain imaging to diagnose and measure treatment efficacy.

I was playing devil's advocate to explain why someone might feel that way. My personal opinion is that every adult should have the right to assess for themselves whether they feel stimulants can improve their quality of life. The question of whether ADHD is "real" or legitimate is totally unimportant to me. And I agree with your take: if we can identify symptoms and effectively treat them, that is more important than uncovering some underlying "legitimacy" of the treated condition.

Congratulations on getting diagnosed. ADHD has the highest treatment success rate among psychiatric conditions. Be sure to keep up with all the other healthy habits for improving focus (sleep, exercise, nutrition, hydration, etc.).

[idlewords]

It doesn't follow from the constituent behaviors being real that a concept is real. Take neurasthenia as an example; it was a popular American diagnosis in its day, and I don't think anyone argues that millions of people were faking it. But we draw different lines around these constituent symptoms today, and no longer see it as a coherent condition.

The search term "culturally-bound syndrome" makes for interesting reading in this area.

[pyr0hu]

Feeling the same as OP and I've tried the vacation/detox thingy and I just came back worse. First I passed it as "just still in vacation mode", but as the days kept passing by, it did not get better. Might have to look up a doc too :|

[DigitalBison]

Please don't be hard on yourself for a vacation not "fixing" whatever is ailing you. If you're depressed or have ADHD or similar, you should consider seeking professional help (e.g. therapy and/or medication, if appropriate), and "just take a vacation and turn off your phone" is about as helpful as telling a diabetic to "just produce more insulin".

[moltar]

I’m sort of aligned on your ADHD view and would love to hear more from your point of view. Any book rec’s? Blogs? Podcasts?

[idlewords]

So far I've been too distractible and absent-minded to do a proper nerd-out on the topic. :-) But I found section I of this blog post to be pretty interesting: https://slatestarcodex.com/2017/12/28/adderall-risks-much-mo...

[DigitalBison]

I genuinely don't understand what point you think this article is making that backs up what you've said here -- would you mind elaborating?

Full disclosure, I am diagnosed with ADHD and take stimulants daily, and initially felt pretty defensive when reading your comments here and starting to read that article. I have some problems with the article and generally find that author pretty insufferable, but the article concludes that the risks of medically-supervised stimulant use are low enough that the author personally finds stimulants worth prescribing to patients who benefit from them.

Even Section 1 which you specifically referenced, and which admittedly made me pretty annoyed until I read it a few times, and even though the author certainly seems to be trying to insinuate that ADHD isn't real, doesn't really seem to be actually backing up that point. His main point or objection seems to be that ADHD is diagnosed using arbitrary subjective criteria rather than objective measurements like other spectrum disorders (isn't blood pressure also a normally distributed trait, where we* "arbitrarily" draw a line and say people on the wrong side of that line have hypertension and should be prescribed beta blockers?).

I'll admit to feeling a little argumentative after reading some of the comments here but I do genuinely want to understand these points better, and I feel like I must be missing some fundamental context or point that the article is making.

*for various definitions of "we", since different countries and organizations define hypertension differently.

[idlewords]

I don't much like the author either, but this is his area of expertise and I think his perspective is valuable.

In my reading, his main points are that (1) ADHD diagnosis is very wooly and (2) amphetamines have a similar effect on everyone, whether or not they believe themselves to suffer from ADHD. The second point in particular is one that is always disputed on internet forums, where it's held as gospel that stimulants have some kind of paradoxical calming effect on the neurodivergent, and that this is one way to distinguish 'real' ADHD sufferers from people who just want better focus.

So the upshot is, there's a powerful focus-enhancing drug that is available to anyone provided they believe in the existence of a condition called ADHD and know how to tell the right stories about it to gatekeepers.

[nosefurhairdo]

Brilliant article. I came to similar conclusions in many months of research culminating in my seeking out and receiving an ADHD diagnosis.

[peyton]

> I personally don't believe there's such a thing as 'ADHD'

There’s a lot of evidence and some decent work on neural circuits. What’s your take on autism? Just a label?

[galaxybrain25]

I agree without doubt to this. It's just an excuse for settling down with your 'temporary' problem and not actually working on fixing it. From what i think, like previously mentioned, rigorous practice of eliminating any kinds of distractions and focusing on what you actually intended to do with the right diet and proper intake of water should be the ideal way to look at it.

[smodo]

I’m super productive when I’m relaxed, happy and working on something I value. When I’m feeling depressed, I just can’t. It took me a while (10+ years) to learn how to feel my emotions and take them into account when trying to understand my own behavior.

[loa_in_]

Could you clarify if you mean 10+ years of life or 10+ years of experience in business for example?

[lnsru]

Not a parent. It’s 10+ years in business. Can’t do anything except read Wikipedia in a toxic place with boss bullying me. Luckily I am counting my last days there. With a happy client who values my work I can code endlessly.

[ordinaryalice]

It could be ADHD, or just your regular brain on years of "cheap dopamine" (or vitamin deficiency, or under-stimulating goals, or a dozen other things).

Exercise and periods of extreme boredom followed by some mellow stimulation (a good book, a conversation with an interesting person) never fail me.

I start with "extreme silence mode" - no music in the car, no podcasts, no checking social media. Just silently moving about my day. Tackling tasks if I can and giving myself silent rest in between.

From there, small achievements stack up and start an upwards spiral.

[swah]

HealthyGamerGG has a similar recommendation when it comes to studying. If you're not feeling it, you've got two options: go to sleep (rest) or embrace the boredom and sit still. Before you know it, studying will become way more interesting...

[hammock]

Dopamine detox. Cut caffeine, porn, social media, unnecessary screen time, etc cold Turkey for 7 days. Hard - and temporary- but will give you a glimpse of what your focus COULD look like if you change your lifestyle.

[marcusverus]

100% this. You can’t pump your brain up with high-dopamine inputs for hours each day and then expect it to settle for relatively low-dopamine tasks like reading, hobbies or work. Your subconscious knows there are high-dopamine alternatives and will constantly scan for/switch focus to them, foiling your efforts to focus on anything else. This isn’t internet bro science—read Dopamine Nation for the empirical foundation of this line of thinking.

[badpun]

So, it means I have to make my life so boring that even work will seem appealing? I think I might prefer to stick to my entertaining distractions then...

[MollyRealized]

Jessica McCabe is very good about helping people with it. [1] America's experiencing a ADHD medication shortage (perhaps it's global) and some of her work involves how to address things without medication. [2]

I also would suggesting trying to adopt the concept of monotasking / unitasking wherever you can. Multitasking is a myth. [3]

[1] - https://www.youtube.com/c/howtoadhd [1] - https://howtoadhd.com/ [2] - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rD9qK8-sMGQ [3] - https://www.google.com/search?q=multitasking+v+unitasking

[nosefurhairdo]

The shortage isn't global; it's an artificial shortage caused by production limits set by the DEA not being adjusted to accommodate the sharp increase in ADHD diagnoses since the start of the Covid-19 pandemic.

[mrwizrd]

Just to mention if you're in the UK (I'm assuming so) you can exercise the Right To Choose to ask for a referral to an external organisation like Psychiatry UK. RTC is still "free at the point of use", you're just making the elective choice to be referred there.

https://psychiatry-uk.com/right-to-choose/

(It can be easy to misread because you can also approach PUK and pay for assessment. However, that doesn't affect where you'd end up in "the queue" - just how you enter it.)

Full disclosure: I used their service, but am otherwise unaffiliated.

Unfortunately it appears they've stopped accepting new ones for now, but the information is still valid.

[brainrot]

Thank you, I am in the UK and I'll follow up on this.

[mrwizrd]

Glad to see it might prove useful for you. I wasn't in a position to write a longer reply before, but I wanted to come back and add a little more here :)

This is probably going to end up a big jumble and all of it is based on my personal experience only, I am not a doctor, and I have other neurological conditions that likely interact with/cause some of these, so take it all with a grain of salt.

It can be helpful to do as much as you can to rule out external causes and really nail down conceptualising the kinds of things that you are struggling with. With that in mind, HowToAdhd[1] is a great channel with a variety of relatively digestible information.

Burnout could be an issue - if (like me at the moment) you have a lot of workplace-related stress, it's going to make all of this a thousand times harder and lead to worsening symptoms. Youtube Shorts and Instagram are absolutely positively toxic to me (especially without medication) and I avoid them like the plague because they are the _worst_ iteration of attention-stealing, engagement-metric pumping skinner box mechanics yet. It's absolutely critical that we do as much as we can to arrange our environments to encourage positive opportunities. No phones in the bedroom or first thing in the morning - it'll just make you anxious if you check your calendar when you first wake up. Good, consistent sleep is really important. A blackout blind. Stay hydrated.

I am in my thirties and have Cerebral Palsy and an ADHD (predominantly innatentive) diagnosis. It's a very unhelpful name for what is fundamentally thought to be a difference in executive function in the brain. It's not really a deficit of attention, and people hear the hyperactive part and think, "well, I don't bounce off the walls, so I must not have it". It's closer to think of it as impaired control of your executive function, the processes in your mind which prompt you, help you decide to change task, stay on task - to the point where it seriously impairs your daily life.

Getting stuck scrolling on your phone, past the point where you're doing anything meaningful, you're not even enjoying it any more, but you can't really stop, until you realise it's five minutes past 9 and you're late. Finish work. Sitting on the sofa knowing you _should_ get up and do the pots, but you just _can't_. You go get some food. Leaving the fridge open in the kitchen you then go to another room to put something in a drawer. Now your brain doesn't prompt you to go back and close the fridge, but instead you find yourself rabbit-holed into cleaning out a junk drawer. You're finding things you lost in there months ago. Your partner comes home, hours have passed. You forgot about the fridge. And the half-clean kitchen. And the laundry that's sitting wet in the tumble drier. You're surrounded by crap from the drawer.

In my case, people were so focused on the physical problems I had with Cerebral Palsy, and they simply lumped the executive function difficulties I had in with "oh, he is disabled, it's just that", and weren't noticing that multiple constellations of symptoms existed that weren't present in or reasonably explained by it. I'm now also strongly considering the possibility that I may be on the autistic spectrum as well. To be diagnosed with ADHD, it must have been present during your whole life as it's a neurodevelopmental disorder, but it can manifest quite differently as you get through school and the demands of life become greater. You may have done just about okay in school and then (for example) found working life more and more and more difficult as jobs became more and more demanding. Working yourself to the bone out of hours just to "keep up". Multiple burnouts and comorbid depression are not uncommon.

Looking through the replies, there's disagreement and doubt about ADHD, and people can read a list of symptoms and reject it with statements like "but everyone gets distracted or doesn't want to do things sometimes". I'm not saying this isn't ever true - of course there are some people who will try to obtain these medications illicitly. Likewise, our modern world has made all of these attention stealing issues much worse. And yes, if you go to a psychiatrist and have symptoms that fit a consistent pattern from childhood, you can get treatment. But don't be dissuaded by these voices until you've been fully evaluated. Proper assessment isn't something that can be done quickly, so you shouldn't take snap judgements or dismissals as fact either!

If the situation is, you have a history of struggling with behaviours X Y Z, that fits this thing we call ADHD, statistically speaking these medications help more often than not. How some people behave and whether or not what we model as ADHD is accurate or not is irrelevant if the treatments help you, IMHO.

Anyway, it's 2am. I really ought to take my own advice! Feel free to get in touch if you want :)

[1]: https://www.youtube.com/c/howtoadhd

[brainrot]

Thank you for taking the time to come back and write this. There's a lot here to digest so i'm going to take some time to do that but i'll try to come back and reply properly when I've had chance to do that. I'll drop you a message via your keybase profile, too. Hope you're doing ok and managed to get some sleep last night!

[coffeefirst]

Question: did anything happen between now and when you had this capability?

Because to me it sounds a lot like how I experienced burnout, and it sounds like you’re the sort of person who tends to work extremely hard.

[alcaide-mor]

That's what happened to me. I had a few health issues and surgeries, and suddenly some of my life goals weren't possible anymore. My brain knew about it and got demotivated. Never completely recovered. I might try to self brainwash into the "it's still possible" mindset, but my rational layer is stubborn and keeps saying to myself "I have to face the truth", even if the truth means less productivity. :/

[CuriouslyC]

I used to get excited by side projects, but at this point I can't get motivated unless I'm 100% sure it'll have a payoff. That could mean scratching my own itch, or doing a proof of concept for a major change at work that already has buy-in, but side projects that are just to learn a tech stack, pad my Github or a "maybe" side hustle are non-starters.

Part of that is mild depression and part of it is early burnout, but the majority of it is recognizing that most side projects are a waste of time, and if I'm going to "waste" time I'd rather it be hanging out with my kid or playing video games.

[YujinkoToys]

There is the countervailing influence of social media upon attention. One area we overlook, however, is the affect of maturity on available attention. We mature, we assume the responsibilities of profession or parenting or homeownership or elder care… it adds up. Many of the “distractions” you mentioned were tasks that somebody needed to tend to. You’re probably just as capable of focus when you have available time, but now you have more to be accountable for.

[GTP]

> Today I wanted to really knuckle down and make some real progress on my side project. I've updated my iPad, fixed the leg on a tripod, cut the grass, cleaned the mower, scrubbed the driveway. Guess how much progress I made on the side project?

It seems to me that, instead of working on a side project, you did many things you still had to do anyway. This could be an issue if you have an hard deadline approaching, but if you don't have one, is it really that bad? If it also significantly affects your work then sure, maybe you have to do something about it, but if you just procrastinate side projects by doing chores, then I don't see much of an issue. Doing other useful things instead of working on your main task is what I heard called "productive procrastination". I would say this can be an issue only if it really prevents you from working on what you would like to work on, but if you're just procrastinating every now and then by giving priority to other tasks on your to-do list, maybe it's a non-issue.

[lylejantzi3rd]

> is it really that bad?

Yes. Anything you do repeatedly becomes a habit, ie: becomes the default behavior. If you procrastinate enough for it to become a habit, then the next time you try to do something you need to do, you'll instinctively procrastinate instead. You can try to make the bad habit work for you (ie: "productive procrastination"), but it's better not to let the habit develop in the first place and if it's already in place to replace it with a more productive habit.

[mckravchyk]

At the most basic level, distraction is the opposite of focus. If you want to do deep work, you must eliminate all distraction and just focus on that one thing you are working on. So no HN while working for instance and even something as seemingly innoncent as grabbing a snack randomly can mess with it big time and start a distraction loop. Other than that you can practice focus deliberately, like for example zen meditation of counting exhales 1 to 10 - you will notice how easily distracted you get, but it's normal - you just get yourself back to focus on the most boring thing. And make sure you get good sleep, it's easy to become chronically sleep depleted and live in denial that no more sleep is needed, but it actually is needed badly - and it's very difficult to focus, if I get worse sleep I especially pay attention I do not have anything distracting around and usually choose to work on one big thing as multiple smaller tasks can prove to be too distracting to handle well.

[Zathu]

Don’t rely on your GP for mental health. Look for a local clinic with a PMHNP-BC who can diagnose and treat you without a delay. There are telemedicine options for this as well.

[jamal-kumar]

I think it's worth asking at this point if you can't find the focus or motivation to do the side project to really meditate on whether or not there's something deep inside you telling you that you shouldn't be bothering? Like you need to have what actually motivates you to do it front and centre in mind as a sort of guiding light to see what it is you need to do next, if that's not on then where are you even going with it?

ADHD meds won't help you there. You'll just end up cleaning the house way harder. Think about what motivated you in the past to get those MVPs you did out the door and think about what you can modify in whatever it is you're doing now to get that back. If that motivation from days yore is forgotten or lost somehow then it's time to sort out what you can be excited about next.

[gabereiser]

Have you had Covid? Long-Covid can manifest as brain fog or the inability to focus, get frustrated, or become panic about it. I’ve known a few people who had Covid and the following year suffer from undiagnosed long-covid brain fog and anhedonia.

[marginalia_nu]

To be fair, this could also be the effects of Covid isolation. Getting cut off from socialization and physical activity for years on end is a surefire way to induce a depressive episode in the healthiest of minds. Not everyone's made out to tend a lighthouse.

[gabereiser]

This very well may be an effect of isolation. Or loneliness. It can manifest as a depression or an attention deficit because the body isn't getting what it needs. Connection with others. We are a social species afterall.

[jareklupinski]

> I've updated my iPad, fixed the leg on a tripod, cut the grass, cleaned the mower, scrubbed the driveway. Guess how much progress I made on the side project?

Hal fixes a light bulb: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AbSehcT19u0

a huge cold brew with extra espresso helps me focus

i guess the focus comes about because the caffeine helps me realize that the little 'side-side quests' are actually meaningless, making the 'real quest' actually attainable (since now there's no 'worthless' things to occupy my time)

[lylejantzi3rd]

Caffeine helps you focus because it's a stimulant and it increases dopamine and norepinephrine levels in the brain. It's similar to how Ritalin and Adderall work, just weaker.

[keikobadthebad]

Sounds like the work might not lead somewhere you really judge is useful, or judge will be painful.

You don't mention a life partner.

[imachine1980_]

i have ADHD, you have a different life than before (you have more responsibility, less free time, and are older(less energy)), interesting new things make easy to stay focus now life is more stressfull and static than when we were 18

some of my tool belt (some of them are from professionals), but is maybe a good starting point, some of this won't work on you.

select space for work and space from leisure, and place for meetings, set time to reply, i replay twice a day and the rest of the day is close.

meditations help me a little i also like it.

do exercise this is more important than you think, you will have more thinks done at the end of the day, even if loos this time.

set low number quantifiable thinks, i read at least 3% of the book a day.

if you can shorter task, read short books, if you can make project whit small scopes and short time, this isn't as easy at it sounds, but you can negotiete this, and split objectives.

use calendar (i use google, or paper, i'dont reccommend both)

simplify process ( use single source of truth even if isn't as practical as using two (yes if you want to have paper calendar over you all day, or stop the meeting to add it in google calendar)

create stimulus for what you need to do each time i open my browser the first thing that apear is my calendar

like other say reduce stimulus, go to Coffe shops work for me, don't hear music whit lyrics(in langues that you understand), i cant have full silence, i need constant noise(totally personal) while working, not podcast or radio.

have nice day

[brainrot]

Thank you. Lot's of great advice here, thanks for taking the time to write this all out.

[barrysteve]

Focus used to mean buckling down and adding a lot of effort and output to a task. Push big rock hard to build pyramid, or smash hard thing with hammer, means adding a lot of energy to the task.

Focus means now to subtract out everything that isn't.

Everything that isn't the answer to your task.

And don't hold the stuff you got rid of.

Find the valley where the answer to your question fits.

As soon as you feel the desire to add things, or feel any desire really, you'll be back onto tasks that categorically can absorb additional energy. Cleaning the mower, cutting grass, tripod'ed the iPad while talking off your gf's ear (or whatever).

Descend the mountain, get to the bottom of all relationships, use critical thinking to lighten your workload, not add more analysis. Let go of having a full working map of your code in your 'mind' as you go... or at least your process for finding a code answer is along the same path as letting go of juggling multiple concepts in your mind until there's just one left.

Complete opposite of how I grew up working.

Oh gosh I'm doing it now by over explaining this. Good luck!

[geswit2x]

Motivation. You are aiming to money or productivity, instead of what is moving you forward.

MVP is a term from a decanter Western world that is only governed by production and mercantile values, completely forgetting its spiritual part. Then you will wonder why you are lost and you will have to resort to drugs because no sentient being could be subjected to such torture organically.

[moltar]

If you really want to get a diagnosis from a professional, you don’t need to wait two years. That’s absurd. I just had a call with a licensed professional in Portugal for a €90 fee out of pocket. It took one hour session over Zoom to get an answer. I’m not a Portuguese resident. Just a country I was in at the moment.

[phito]

In my country (Belgium), I've been told there is a 10+ years waiting list for adult autism diagnosis. 2 years for ADHD doesn't sound implausible to me. It sucks.

[pbhjpbhj]

If moltar's Portuguese professional speaks a language that you speak (or you can hire an interpreter) seems like you can get a diagnosis sooner?

[DashAnimal]

Consider getting a blood test if you haven't already. At the very least, it'll help you knock off any possibilities that you may be low in iron, vitamin D, or vitamin B12. For me, that turned out to be the case and taking supplements fixed the issue.

And this goes without saying but have you tried, and I mean REALLY tried the following (be honest with yourself):

- Cut down on your phone time. Delete your apps for at least a month. Cut down on news. Cut down on distractions. Even your normal apps you find useful, turn off any notification sounds or popups.

- Exercise regularly.

- Eat a healthy diet, nothing that spikes your blood sugar like sugar-heavy or processed food.

I'm not saying this is the solution for every one and the solution for everything, but there have been multiple times in my life I haven't felt like myself and returning to these "basics" really helped me.

[icodestuff]

Are you burnt out? I watched that happen. They also have ADHD, but once they burned out, even interesting worthwhile things couldn’t hold their focus for more than a few minutes, and they were constantly procrastinating several levels deep. That lasted months.

[89vision]

I lived almost 40 years with undiagnosed ADHD inattentive type. I had terrible grades, I couldn't organize anything in my life, terrible rejection sensitive dysphoria. Luckily, programming and computers have always been a consistent source of dopamine for me to hyperfocus on so I've done reasonably well in my career. It started impacting my marriage so I recently decided to talk to a mental health professional and got a diagnosis. I started a low dose of adderall which has helped a bit with some of those things, but it also sometimes has the side effect of making me hyperfocus on the wrong things. My diagnosis took one visit, maybe the laws are different in your state

[nicbou]

As commented a minute ago, I spent a year aggressively muting distractions (then kept doing it when they pop up): https://nicolasbouliane.com/blog/silence

This helped a lot, although a lot is left to discipline.

Another aspect is creating the right conditions for focused work. That means a quiet environment, a well-rested and fed body, and possibly an advance planning of meals and other necessary distractions.

If you want to stay in the zone, make the zone a comfortable place.

[smallerfish]

Turn off slack & email for solid blocks of time (4+ hours) during working hours. Build back the ability to focus during work, and your weekend time becomes easier, because you're more in the habit.

[nosefurhairdo]

If you're in the United States you can get an ADHD diagnosis in under a month. There are many online psychiatry services which can provide an ADHD diagnosis and stimulant prescription following a 30 minute zoom call.

Stimulants are a mixed bag. For me, Adderall provided a sense of agency I've never felt before, and I'm willing to live with the side effects and potential long-term consequences.

Be kind to yourself regardless of the path forward. Self-flagellation is common and unhelpful when feeling unproductive.

[Mouintaineer]

Stop working.

It's amazing how much of a brain drain the modern workplace is!

[KenArrari]

A big one is to just remove the option to be distracted at all. Use an extension to block time-wasting websites on your browser while working. Keep your phone out of reach. Set breaks and try not to pollute your thoughts during breaks (and try to keep a schedule like Pomadoro or such).

[BeetleB]

If procrastination is the problem, I suggest the book The Now Habit:

https://www.amazon.com/Now-Habit-Overcoming-Procrastination-...

[gdwhther]

Everything in America is a health and mental health issue, please consult your nearest expert and get a prescription for some drugs. We dont want you to go through normal human emotions, that's such a "weak" thing to do.

[rg111]

I had this problem. But I bounced back and doing as expected in my life:

1. Read "Deep Work" by Cal Newport. Follow the guidelines as much as you can.

2. Exercising and meditating made me focus much better. Read "Mind Illuminated" by Culadasa.

I can really vouch for the books and the methods as they worked.

[gardenhedge]

1) Disable notifications on your phone

2) Delete apps that steal your focus like TikTok and Instagram

3) Stop playing online multiplayer games that require lots of attention (e.g. league of legends, overwatch) and never "end"

4) Stop listening to podcasts passively

5) Stop multitasking - even listening to music while doing a task

[nonameiguess]

I'm not sure I see the problem here. You hoped to accomplish one thing and instead accomplished five things. Having a well-maintained, clean living space is important. This doesn't sound like ADHD to me. My wife has ADHD. She stays in bed falling down YouTube rabbit holes more often than and I do virtually all of the cleaning and fixing of what we own. She needs amphetamines to do chores, not to avoid doing chores.

It sounds like you may have just gotten bored with launching products and found other things are important, too. It's good to switch it up. Given these are side projects, that implies you're already doing the same thing professionally as a W2 employee. Long-term, I don't think you want to base your entire life around doing your job also as your hobby, at least not permanently. Most likely, the drive to do this one specific thing will come back on its own, but you can't force it.

[Void_]

I recommend using FocusMate.

Start with manageable # of sessions per day. 2 or 3.

Repeat every day. If you’re able to focus for the full hour each session, increase number of session.

Stay consistent and you will improve.

[theusus]

You might be simply fatigued or a bit depressed. 1. Try to meditate for some time. 2. Go out on a trip. Try something new.

ADHD is a big something. Don't be stupid.

[eurekin]

I have no answer, but if anything worked for you in the end, I would greatly appreciate to share what that was

[ted_bunny]

Are you getting easy dopamine fixes? Read up on supernormal stimuli and the hedonic treadmill.

[nathias]

focus is a muscle, you have to retrain it

I suggest you shift your time off to more focus building activities, like reading long narratives etc.

[pizzaknife]

theres no replacement for a cougar in the back seat. take more risks and put yourself in uncomfortable situations

[pbhjpbhj]

That probably works if you don't have dependents and you do have a good support network.

If someone is going to fall into poverty when you don't make it home, get out and walk (ie avoid the cougar at all costs) might be the best option? If you've no-one to come and pick you up if you crash into a tree ...?

[Racing0461]

where do you live (country)? I am in the USA and was able to get prescribed/diag in 1 meeting.

[hotdogscout]

Did you get ill between these two states? COVID perhaps?

[danmarsh01]

Regaining focus involves a few simple steps. First, identify distractions and eliminate them or create a conducive environment. Prioritize tasks by setting clear goals and breaking them into smaller, manageable segments. Use techniques like the Pomodoro method, which involves working in focused bursts with short breaks. Practice mindfulness through meditation or deep breathing exercises to calm your mind. Ensure adequate sleep and maintain a balanced diet for optimal brain function. Lastly, stay organized with to-do lists and schedules to reduce mental clutter. With discipline and consistency, you can effectively refocus and enhance productivity in both work and daily life.

[hammock]

Chatgpt?

[swah]

Love this game too :)

[danmarsh01]

yes