[eamonnsullivan]

I worry about all of this labelling that we apply to various ends of the "normal" spectrum. Where does it lead us? Is it actually helping?

I easily score as ADHD, but I'm in my 60s now and have never been diagnosed or treated. I have muddled through all my life. Yes, I often self-medicated unhealthily (cigarettes, various over-the-counter uppers), but also relatively healthily (I've been practicing meditation for decades). I managed to have two, long, fruitful careers (20 years of journalism, coming up to 20 years of software engineering) that (I'm betting) was at least partly attributable to me being on the outer edges of normal.

I think that's OK. I'm not looking to be "treated" because I'm a bit different.

[cybrox]

I think there is value in knowing a term for the symptoms one might experience because it provides the ability to connect with like-minded people and potentially look into useful strategies to mitigate those symptoms, if they become problematic.

However, I do strongly agree with you that setting a boundary to "normal" and therefore implying these states to be abnormal and something that needs to be fixed is not helpful. We should be able to label a wide spectrum of neurological wiring quirks without nudging people towards changing them, unless it actually negatively impacts their ability to live a fulfilling life.

[shalmanese]

> However, I do strongly agree with you that setting a boundary to "normal" and therefore implying these states to be abnormal and something that needs to be fixed is not helpful. We should be able to label a wide spectrum of neurological wiring quirks without nudging people towards changing them, unless it actually negatively impacts their ability to live a fulfilling life.

Except I don't buy this framing that the two are in conflict. The more general awareness there is in the general population around neurodiversity, simultaneously the less shame there is about medicating and also, the greater willingness there is to accommodate each person's individual diversity.

Accomodations initially rolled out for diagnosed neurodiverse people: Like being able to control the lighting in your workspace, or being issued noise cancelling headphones no questions asked, also benefit neurotypical people who are also on the further end of the bell curve for things like that.

[matheusmoreira]

> We should be able to label a wide spectrum of neurological wiring quirks without nudging people towards changing them, unless it actually negatively impacts their ability to live a fulfilling life.

This is already the case. Maladaptation is a fundamental diagnostic criteria of essentially every neuropsychiatric condition. There is no reason to treat something if it's not causing you harm.

[teekert]

Sounds familiar. I've been quite successful professionally, I have accomplished many nice things. But always in the final days/hours and under extreme pressure (ie 2 nights of no sleep to finish PhD thesis in time for print for defense, etc, very difficult for people around me also. I'm currently working on our old house. Also not nice for me, and people around me. The results are pretty nice and technically fully correct though.)

I've had the same comment about being chaotic, and not being able to see the bigger picture during performance reviews my whole life. But I've always felt unable to see the bigger picture if not understanding the details. Although recently I've gotten better at letting go, trusting my mental models etc, but also at finding great, structured project leads (or assistants if I'm in the lead). Such people are invaluable to me, although I must say that I also start to find it easier and easier to just copy their behaviour (ie things like "Start project with timeline, not important if it's 100% accurate, its more about the order of things" - etc... At least you will appear very structured which radiates confidence!).

I've also had a manager at one point in my career that said: We really just want you to start many things, you are in research not in development. It's great that you start with so much enthusiasm, let de development people determine the fit for product later... (But perhaps a bit more "eye on the market" would be nice!)

That was somewhat of an eye opener, at 35 (42 now).

[eamonnsullivan]

This is an important point that I missed and didn't mention: My work and school life were really hard and chaotic. This is so intrinsically part of me that I didn't even notice, but has generated a lot of stress on me and my family. I guess getting treatment would have saved me a lot of that. I wonder if it is worth it, as a 62-year-old and probably within 5/6-ish years of retirement?

[teekert]

I wonder the same thing (but with ~25 years to go). It would probably be better for my relationships.

But I've heard from people doing some tests with certain medications that indeed they were able to focus and plan like never before. But also loose some passion and creativity. I've heard from yet others that they should have started way earlier, before essentially wrecking their life.

I think for me at times medication would help me. But it feels like a big step and I'm not "ill", I'm not wrecking my life, my life is ok. I also feel like "this is me, I'm learning about the good and the bad." Idk, maybe I'm overly sentimental about it. I'm also to lazy to go to the doctor.

[naruhodo]

From what I have been seeing about ADHD lately, using the adrenaline of last-minute time pressure to get things done is a common ADHD coping mechanism.

[RobotToaster]

My pet theory is that one of the reasons for an increase in the diagnosis of ADHD is that fewer people smoke today. Nicotine as a stimulant likely treated a lot of undiagnosed cases of ADHD.

[fatbird]

My ADHD became screamingly obvious when I quit smoking, about a year after seriously reducing my coffee drinking from a couple pots a day to a cup or two.

[protocolture]

Yeah I think this was my mother tbh. She smoked like a chimney for 30 years.

[JSR_FDED]

Does caffeine work?

[fragmede]

Where it leads us, is to people with ADHD suffering less. Which, I don't know about you, but making fewer people suffer and for people to suffer less are basically the two driving motivations for life, so I'm in favor of it.

You're older, so you grew up in a different time, and you found your place in the world. The treatment means finishing projects, not needing to wait until the last minute to do something in order to do it. It means less stress and unecessary anxiety. It's helping people reach their potential, and not fall into the cracks.

[normaler]

My mother is very similar to what you have described and mimicks some reponses of her to her ADHD situation pre-diagnosis/post-diagnosis.

She is also ~60 and accomplished in her professional,social and family life.

Pre-diagnosis she would reject suggestsions going into the direction of an ADHD diagnosis, due to her accomplishments being above average --> not possible to have a disability/neuro-divergence.

The achievements are her achievements, but the expense in the context of her capabilities was very high and quite taxing on her.

A diagnosis or even treatment is not making the person normal, but it can help provide that person with options to alleviate the expense of operating differently to the baseline.

I am very happy that you managed to have this success in your life so far and you made that happen.

But under your assumption that you have ADHD you might have made that happen against odds that would have been in part optional if you had access to treatment options.

[danparsonson]

On the other hand for me, these discussions help me to frame my challenges in a productive way that gives me a chance to make useful changes to my life to accomodate them, instead of blaming myself when I struggle to do something that seems like it should be easy. So I guess the answer is, YMMV.

[dxdm]

The article doesn't do a good job of highlighting that there is help beyond medication, and that the personal "size" of the problem should be taken inro account. I mean, "answering 6 questions -> yay, stimulants" is a bit of a shortcut, isn't it.

Recognizing that one's problems with being organized (and other executive functions) have a reason, and are not just a result of "being lazy" or "not trying enough" can be powerful and liberating. It allows acceptance and a systematic approach at addressing them. Of course, medication can help a lot while learning how to make things easier for oneself in other ways, but this should be decided with a professional who has experience with diagnosing and treating ADHD in adults, ideally one that does not simply want to push pills.

In any case, it's good to seek out more information or consult a professional IF you think you're being held back. If not, then that's great! For others, articles like this might provide the initial nudge for a noticeable improvement in their lives.

[simonask]

It's interesting to read this from someone who more at a more advanced stage of life, but I also wonder if there is a built-in assumption around diagnoses and treatments being potentially negative.

I think people seek out these diagnoses because they are struggling to cope with modern life in one way or another. I don't think its only a matter of attitudes ("everything must be treated"), but also the fact that the world is different. In other words, there could be two solutions: Medication/treatment to make life easier for the individual, or fix the world such that it can accommodate the arguably natural variance among individuals.

We're choosing the former, because the latter is just so, so difficult. But I think a world exists where the needs of currently medicated people with mild degrees of ADHD could thrive without any medication, and it sounds like a softer, more colorful world.

[anuramat]

I believe ADHD might be neutral/beneficial in some environments, and I also am not a big fan of labels; if it has a non-negative impact on your life -- sure, you don't need the meds

but

Until I started doing stims, I was regularly forgetting about food/water until I could barely move, and at one occasion I procrastinated from replying to an email with the offer of my life until the deadline was over. There's a lot that you can explain with "not motivated enough", but these just don't make any sense, right?

You do need some sort of a label to prescribe controlled substances. Even if you forget about the meds, just knowing that it's a pretty common thing and you're not alone is pretty helpful.

[shalmanese]

Would you say the same if it were as physical disability? If you were born without hands and had slowly learnt how to do everything required in everyday life via an adaptation, would you reject a prosthetic if it were available?

We know people with ADHD are able to manage. The real test is always, after they try medication, is their life easier or not. A lot of people who were adamant they were managing just fine before the meds report afterwards they didn't realize how much effort they were putting in on a day to day basis just to manage themselves.

And this is not some general trend towards overmedicalization. As the article pointed out, there are precisely two psychiatric drugs that have this statistically significant an effect.

[protocolture]

>I worry about all of this labelling that we apply to various ends of the "normal" spectrum. Where does it lead us? Is it actually helping?

People develop taxonomy to help understand the world and themselves. Knowing what you have helps you seek treatment.

> I have muddled through all my life.

Part of the journey for a lot of ADHD sufferers is getting experience what non muddled life is like.

> I think that's OK. I'm not looking to be "treated" because I'm a bit different.

Cool, I am glad that worked for you. But keep in mind that lots of people, myself included, experience extremely negative aspects of ADHD.

>meditation

Much less effective than the treatments the article mentions.

[throwaway152021]

Isn't it a bit of a non sequitur? The fact that you choose not to be treated (with a history of unhealthy self-medication) doesn't imply that someone else would not benefit from changing some healthy(-ier) medication specifically targeted at ADHD.

So to answer your questions: 1. it leads us to people getting treated (or at least having the choice) for stuff that makes their life harder 2. Yes, it is helping.

[coldtea]

If you suspected you had hypertension, would you be as confident to say we don't need to label and track those because you got old, worked and lived just fine thus far with no major episodes?

You might have been fine because you just have something like 140 mm Hg, whereas others with 180-190 might not be so lucky....

[edding4500]

Getting treatment or not is a decision. It is linked to pressure of suffering. You write that you did well and managed your life well. Awesome. Other people feel extensive pressure of suffering and are not able to manage their lifes like you did. For those, professional treatment can be life saving.

[pfortuny]

No, it is not just “being treated”, although learning some techniques to control anxiety has helped me a lot (meditation, in my case). Just “know thyself”, and realizing that your struggles have a root different from “laziness” helps with self-esteem.

[jstanley]

Knowing the name of a thing is different from knowing the thing.

You can "know thyself" perfectly well without having labels.

[mcphage]

> Is it actually helping?

Yes. And it if it doesn’t, then just stop refilling your meds.