| HN Mirror

https://www.hindawi.com/journals/omcl/2020/5732956/#

Our bodies are quite capable of dealing with when we have the right nutrition and we don’t create too much oxidative stress. I can’t believe how little understanding there is of the impact of distress.

Just being deficient in manganese, zinc and copper could increase superoxides to a point that starts creating DNA damage.

And it’s funny that you don’t think reactive oxygen species damage heart muscles. If there’s too much of them that is. If there’s an imbalance that is.

If you’re not exactly sure what reactive oxygen species are, then, why don’t you look them up before you make comments of what you know nothing about. If you’re making fun, about a stupid comma that Siri placed in my sentence then well, that’s just childish. And you’re not serious at all.

Strength training isn't the same as chronic distress though. Activity that uses muscles above current baseline leads to inflammation, which leads to hypertrophy and growth, which results in downregulation of inflammatory markers in the long term. The body upregulates anti-oxidant species in response to normal increases in oxidative stress. Yes, acute/extreme spikes in ROS generation is bad, but that's not what actually occurs in regular exercise.

Tomes of papers support the connection between physical activity, reduced inflammation markers, and decreased all-cause mortality.

Maybe you should actually take some courses in molecular biology, instead of googling some very basic high-level articles and over-generalizing to support your misguided point.

> Tomes of papers support the connection between physical activity, reduced inflammation markers, and decreased all-cause mortality

Correlation, not causation.

What the hell is muscle use above a curent baseline? What does that even mean? I’m pretty sure you’ve never taken a science class in your life.

> What the hell is muscle use above a curent baseline? What does that even mean?

Meaning, a conservative increase over your current training regimen, as opposed to over-training. If you go from couch potato to running several miles a day, that's going to be way more stressful than gradual ramp-up. I made that caveat because intense over-training can cause really bad things such as rhabdomyolysis at the extreme.

>I’m pretty sure you’ve never taken a science class in your life.

I'm pretty sure I have a BS in chemistry and worked as a synthetic chemist for years, and you are talking out your ass.

Maybe get another degree in biology and nutritional genomics before saying anything else about human health then.

malfist 900 days ago

Gentle reminder that personal attacks are not permitted here.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7892233/

Further, whole-body resistance exercise increased oxidative damage. For example, resistance exercise at a 10-repetition maximum load increases the MDA level in the blood [19]. Furthermore, local resistance exercise, which is a single type of resistance training in a specific muscle group, can increase oxidative damage.

> Although initial investigations reported the negative effect of ROS, recent studies have shown that exercise-induced ROS can upregulate several enzymatic and nonenzymatic antioxidants in the biological system [7, 8], and exercise could be an optimizer of ROS in negating oxidative damage in the cells, while ROS can regulate signaling or act as a signaling molecule to muscular adaption.

Did you even read your own link, or are you just googling keywords and linking papers with a title that superficially supports your thesis?

https://journals.physiology.org/doi/full/10.1152/ajpcell.003...

Yes I did, thank you for continuing the conversation.

Those enzymes that it unregulated, those genes that they upregulate… do you know what they are? Let’s talk about one…mnSOD or SOD2.

Do you know that enzyme needs a co-factor and that co-factor is manganese. What do you think happens when you keep exercising, but do not replenish your manganese? mnSOD does not work as fast and this leads to a buildup of superoxides and disease.

Up regulating these enzymes because we’re exercising is not decreasing oxidative stress, it’s getting rid of the oxidative stress that we created. And all that results is that we deplete ourselves in manganese.

Does this happen for everyone? No does this happen for people who might have polymorphisms in there SOD2 genetics? Probably.

Ok, so make sure you get enough dietary manganese?

RDA for Mn is 1.8-2.3 mg/day. Tolerable upper limit is 11mg/day. Mn ions are highly conserved in the body and mostly cycle through redox states and various complexes.

That's actually a pretty narrow therapeutic window, again because it's a trace mineral and biology has evolved to recycle it very efficiently.

https://www.efsa.europa.eu/en/efsajournal/pub/3419

Yeah, that’s what I thought until I had my hair and serum levels of manganese tested. Which were both low. And taking manganese cured not only my chronic fatigue, but my insomnia and anxiety as well.

Also, there’s a study at Stamford going on right now, looking at manganese levels and illness and they’re finding that these ranges are old and arbitrary.

And that tolerable upper limit is a joke since I had to take 30 mg a day.

Just do a little research and find out where they got those limits and ranges from.

But, regardless, it proves my point, that exercise depletes manganese and that could cause disease in people who don’t have sufficient manganese. So just telling everyone to work out and you’ll live longer is a false statement.

Adding

There are no reliable and validated biomarkers of manganese intake or status and data on manganese intakes versus health outcomes are not available for DRVs for manganese. As there is insufficient evidence available to derive an average requirement or a population reference intake, an Adequate Intake (AI) is proposed.

Reactive oxygen species (ROS) is loosely synonymous with "free radicals", which is more of an older term. ROS include free radical oxygen, but also other energetic non-radical species such as singlet oxygen and peroxide ions.

But yeah, your broad point is correct. Biology has several billions of years of evolutionary experience dealing with ROS and upregulates antioxidant biomolecules in response, it's way more complex than "ROS bad".

https://scholar.google.com/scholar?as_ylo=2023&q=reactive+Ox...

I didn’t say reactive oxygen species were bad, I said that oxidative stress is bad. And reactive Oxygen species is not an old term but nice try it in an attempt to make me look stupid.

Here are all the papers that use the terms since 2023