[tbomb]

I think the reason is 2 part.

Part 1 being often these "junk" processed foods are cheaper to buy for more quantity. eg. a box of macaroni and cheese can feed a family of 4 on $2USD. Possibly mix in a couple hotdogs which on the cheaper end can cost under $5USD for 16. in the end your feeding a family of 4 dinner for under $5.

Part 2 being time. Typically in lower income families (I grew up on the low end of the "middle class") both parents are working. my mother didn't have the time or energy to come home from and 8-10 hour work day and then cook for the next 90 minutes. that same box of macaroni and cheese (with hotdogs) can be made in ~30 minutes with little attention to it. and once my sister and I were old enough to help out, it was something we could do for her.

Thats my anecdotal and oversimplified answer anyway :)

[simonsarris]

> Part 2 being time.

I really don't think so. All the statistics we have point to poor people having more, often much more, free time than middle class people or rich people.

https://www.statista.com/statistics/191558/average-daily-tim...

https://www.theatlantic.com/business/archive/2016/09/the-fre...

Thirteen year old children can also be taught to cook and prep reliably, as I'm sure you know.

Part 2 is probably more likely a basket of cultural issues. Sampling my middle income and lower friends, almost none of their parents taught them a thing about cooking. (Those that did of the very poor had 13 year olds cooking.)

I have seen a total lack of interest in cooking and a total lack of planning. It takes essentially zero time to soak beans overnight, and no time to simmer them in a pot with olive oil or butter or anything else you have (carrot water/cabbage water/stubs of vegetables if-you-have-any water). Many times a week I make beans and scrambled eggs this way.

[Klinky]

> It takes essentially zero time to soak beans overnight, and no time to simmer them in a pot with olive oil or butter or anything else you have (carrot water/cabbage water/stubs of vegetables if-you-have-any water).

No it doesn't. Be realistic. Beans are going to take about 90 minutes to cook tender. Soaking beans takes pre-planning the night before. It is not low-effort cooking.

You are probably right that there is a lack of planning, and probably poor decisions being made in these households, but I'd suggest volunteering your time to go teach these people how to sort their lives out, and perhaps you'll find it's not as simple as beans and rice.

[joefourier]

You don't have to buy 20kg of rice for it to be cheap. You can buy a 1kg bag of potatoes for $0.50 - $1.00, and cooking them is as easy as putting them in the microwave for ~10 minutes. A single kilo of rice can be had for under $2.00 by itself, and cooking rice is quick and easy. Add a can of beans on top, some spices and you got yourself a dirt cheap vegetarian meal.

Outside of the USA you have plenty of families surviving on less than $10 a day, they don't wait for their paycheck to accumulate to buy food.

It sounds more like a cultural issue, or perhaps such staples are not easily found in most of the USA and/or are marketed as "health foods" and suffer a corresponding price increase?

[mieseratte]

> It sounds more like a cultural issue, or perhaps such staples are not easily found in most of the USA and/or are marketed as "health foods" and suffer a corresponding price increase?

Culture definitely sounds like a component, I wouldn't be surprised to hear a crass criticism of your rice-and-beans meal as something eaten by "those starving children on TV."

There's also the issue that a lot of folks simply don't know how to cook. The benefit of a lot of those box meals is the hand-holding, instructions included nature. I buy a box, it tells me what I need to buy, and how and how long to cook each component.

I'm a bit embarrassed to admit, but if you handed me a sack of rice and beans I'd have no idea how and for how long to cook it. I simply never learned those skills. In the past several months I've realized how poor my culinary skills are, and have been working to address that deficiency, but for many folks in the US we simply pick the path of least cost and effort.

[H1Supreme]

> There's also the issue that a lot of folks simply don't know how to cook.

I think this is the "Part 3" to the list above. Rices/beans/potatoes can yield many, many different dishes. I can afford more expensive choices, but most of my meals still consist of these basic, cheap foods.

[ricardobeat]

This is amazing. Here's how you cook them: heat up some water and add salt. Put the rice / beans in the water. Remove from water. Eat. Can be done in 15 minutes and is not any harder than boxed macaroni.

You can do a big batch of this and then later get fancy by throwing it around a frying pan, maybe add eggs and spices, and still be below $1 / meal.

[mieseratte]

> heat up some water and add salt. Put the rice / beans in the water. Remove from water. Eat.

Sure, but how long? How much salt? How much water? How big of a pot? Do I put them both in together? Separate? What kinds of spices? How much of each?

Ultimately, I can just toss 'em in and wing it or go Google it real quick but most folks just don't even get past the part of realizing "Oh hey, I don't have to do the same thing I've done for years." Most folks don't question their day-to-day rudimentary tasks, especially when they don't have to.

Having "broken" from the rut, it's rather amazing how complacent we can get.

[TeMPOraL]

> Sure, but how long? How much salt? How much water? How big of a pot? Do I put them both in together? Separate? What kinds of spices? How much of each?

Like hearing myself arguing with my SO.

- "Can you cook some pasta before I come home?"

- "Sure honey, but which one? How long? How much salt? How much water? Which pot?..."

Ok, I figured that one out eventually (definitely with the help of some instructions on a box, but they're often not reliable; first pasta I made I boiled longer than the manual said, and it still came out al dente). But the point is, cooking has ridiculous amounts of complexity hidden in it, including quite a lot that can be only be understood through trial and error.

I'd argue this is the most common case of technical communication problem between humans. My SO asking me to "just" cook a "simple" dish would be like me telling her to "just" make a "simple" JS gallery page. In both cases, we'll eventually figure this out, but it will involve lots of googling and stress.

[mieseratte]

> But the point is, cooking has ridiculous amounts of complexity hidden in it, including quite a lot that can be only be understood through trial and error.

As I think about it more, it really reminds me first getting into functional programming. These simple, primitive concepts appeared so daunting at first but once you get accustomed to the mentality and lose that initial fear you can turn those primitives into complex, beautiful software.

[ufo]

Rice is a 15 minutes ordeal but beans take much longer than that.

[radicalbyte]

If you can afford it and are in a country where it's available, I can recommend using Hello Fresh or one of their competitors. It's both more cost effective for us (no waste) and they basically teach you how to cook a wide range of meals. I was a decent cook before we started but being exposed to a wider range of grains / beans etc has made me a far better cook.

[mieseratte]

Thanks for the recommendation! I'll definitely have to give one of those "Fresh in a box" services a chance. Right now, I've found a few upscale, exotic kits (just finished making chicken tika masala) at my local store. Still pre-made sauces, dehydrated veggies, etc. but it's getting me comfortable in the kitchen so "full fresh" seems like a great next step before venturing out on my own.

[thatfrenchguy]

"It sounds more like a cultural issue, or perhaps such staples are not easily found in most of the USA and/or are marketed as "health foods" and suffer a corresponding price increase? "

When I moved to the US, I was appealed by the price of vegetables. Carrots, beets, cabbage are all so expensive compared to Western/Eastern europe.

[nicholas73]

How did it compare in terms of average income?

Carrots and cabbages are about the cheapest vegetables in the store. It doesn't even make a scratch in the bankroll.

Bell peppers, now that's another story.

[philipkglass]

Staple ingredients are available to most of the USA's population, including low income populations. Food deserts are real and deplorable, but most Americans who rely on processed foods do so for convenience, not because basic ingredients are inaccessible or too expensive.

Here's a study of how (among other things) longer-acculturated immigrants to the US shift their eating toward convenience foods:

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3090681/

Study results corroborate previous research highlighting the negative impact of acculturation on diet of Latinos. Many mothers described ready access to fresh fruits and vegetables in their native countries, although availability of such foods decreased in the U.S.. Mothers further described how their lives had become increasingly busy and complex, leaving little time for preparing foods, thereby making the allure of convenience foods, often which are unhealthy, more appealing.

This study details the experiences of Latino families. A quick literature skim and anecdata from my own life indicate that it happens with other immigrant groups coming to the US.

Some low-income subgroups of the American population continue to prepare food from scratch. When I was growing up, some of my friends came from low-income fundamentalist Christian families. Fast/convenience foods were a rare treat; the typical meal plan was "find what ingredients are on sale or have good coupons this week, cook meals from them." (Also, stockpile ingredients that keep well at the lowest-cost times of the year. Buy 6 bargain turkeys around Thanksgiving.) This seems to hold regardless of specific belief; I've heard similar stories from friends who grew up in strict Mormon or Orthodox Jewish households.

Later in graduate school I noticed that students also did more of their own cooking than you might expect from their age and income level (ranging from "nonexistent" to "just above poverty line.") I certainly cooked. It would have torpedoed my budget to eat boxed dinners or fast food every day.

Maybe deep religious belief and extended education are also, in different ways, factors that make you less acculturated into the American mainstream. The irreligious recent immigrant from Belarus, the pious Catholic, and the chemistry postdoc may all be less likely to follow the American default dietary practices because they're living further from American defaults to begin with.

Another factor I've noticed is that these low-income households that cook their own meals (and otherwise make long term cost-effective decisions) tend to be low-income but stable-income. If you're on a graduate school stipend or have taken out loans, you don't have a lot of buying power but you're not juggling two jobs or wondering how many hours you'll be scheduled for this week. Likewise, in those low-income religious families where I saw meals planned around costs, they didn't have much buying power per household member but income was steady month-to-month. If you don't have a modicum of stability you can't be sure that "invest in a chest freezer, buy meat in bulk during the best sales" is actually a good financial optimization plan.

[JackFr]

I don't think that's necessarily true. Rice and beans are cheaper than mac & cheese. (Though only marginally better nutritionally.)

I think a lot of it has to do with availability. People in poverty are typically less well served by large grocery stores, and are more likely to shop in convenience stores. Convenience stores are less like to stock low margin products like bulk rice and dried beans, and more likely to stock higher margin processed foods.

I'm not an expert though, could be many factors.

[watwut]

The taste difference between rice or beans with nothing more in it (no vegetables, meat, etc) is pretty massive. Also, mac&cheese makes you more satiated then rice. Rice is mostly sacharids (no fat, no protein, no nothing) - so it gives you energy only for short time, then you are tired and need to eat again.

I know, because I cook/eat a lot of rice and beans. I have add a lot of fruits etc in between meals to feel good. The dirt cheap vegetarian foods people tend to suggest are not really foods you would eat long term without feeling hungry and tired a lot. With that in mind, I can see someone whose life generally sux to at least eat food that makes them less miserable.

Also, mac&cheese is quick cooking and beans are not when you cook them.

[Retric]

Rice and Beans needs to be mostly Beans to be filling. 30% Rice 70% Beans is tasty and filling where 70% Rice and 30% Beans is not.

It also has other health benefits: https://academic.oup.com/ajcn/article/94/3/869/4411867

[watwut]

Yeah, but I like bean soup with a lot of beans in it which has +vegetables+bacon. I did tried to make myself full from beans but mostly, but it does not really work and lasts shorter then normal meal with meat.

As in, it is ok lunch, but I am hunger in shorter time then with meat or say mac&cheese. Importantly, when I try to eat only that for 2-3 days, it does not work at all.

[Kalium]

My experience with convenience stores is that they generally do stock items like beans and rice. They sell in time, and until they do they're shelf-stable more or less forever. And you can sell in small quantities - maybe 8oz or a pound for $2 - that hide the markup behind small numbers. Especially in areas where they're staples.

It's fresh fruit and veggies that you will tend to see the least of in c-stores.