[notadoc]

I stopped using Facebook years ago and I could not recommend it more. I found it to be mental pollution at best and and a total waste of time.

If you want to 'keep in touch' with people, call or text them. Make an effort to actually interact with the people who matter to you.

[parthdesai]

So tell me, how do i replace around 5 different group chats i have on messenger which can have anywhere between 5-10 people in each chat?

Music events that i go to are exclusively promoted on facebook. How do you recommend i find out about these events so that i can get a cheaper ticket price?

if anyone wants to organize a plan that has more than 8 people, facebook groups make it much much easier.

I personally hate facebook's mobile apps and some it's policies ( Internet.org comes 1st to my mind), but it's hard to completely stop using it.

[abyssin]

I stopped using the harmful part of Facebook, ie the newsfeed, which is designed to create an addictive behaviour, using the following technique. On every single post in my newsfeed, I tell the application I no longer want to see content from the source. It takes some weeks to dry up, but you end up with an empty page. You still get notifications related to your events, group activities, and you can still use the messages. By the way, here's another tip, if you want to read and send messages on mobile without installing the app: use mbasic.fb.com instead of the default m.facebook.com URL.

[tucif]

I also adopted a similar approach, where I unfollowed ALL my firends so that none of them will show up in newsfeed.

Then I added the few ones I truly wanted to know about to the "Close friends" list which allows you to activate notifications for everything they post.

Now when I log in I only see a bunch of notifications which have a very handy "Mark all as read" link, and I only click further when I see a non-meme status update or an interesting share from them.

I can always search someone and go to their profile, or click on a firend list and see what certain group is up to. And I still find messenger useful, except for the forced "Add to your day" part, from which I daily hide any friends "day" as they post it without opening it (hold click to show that option). I'm about 1 year like this and it has been great, don't feel like I'm missing anything.

[alexman]

This is similar to what I did too but the newsfeed is still polluted with lots of "likes" (e.g. liking a page, liking a post) by my close friends which are irrelevant to me 99% of the time. I wish Facebook let me hide "likes" from my friends.

[provost]

If it really bothers you, a simple Greasemonkey script can fix that.

[mattnewton]

Or just don't visit the newsfeed ever.

[rdruxn]

There are dozens of browser extensions that just hide the newsfeed. No need to go through all that labor.

[j_s]

Make Hacker News Your Facebook Newsfeed

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=14755217

[barbs]

I made one for Firefox on Android (should work on iOS too).

https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/hide-mobile-f...

[unicornporn]

Relying on extensions on every browser on every browser I use seems cumbersome? I've unfollowed everything and everyone, and it works on every device without extension. There was a way to batch this.

[ck425]

None that work with Chrome Android though. :(

[tripzilch]

But Chrome Android doesn't let you use extensions, period. Not really sure why you'd want to use it :-)

[tarr11]

this is really cool!

FWIW - mbasic.fb.com does not work. But mbasic.facebook.com does.

[flangillion]

You don't need to do that. Simply use Adblock to block the newsfeed element (the infinite-scroll column in the middle of the page).

[billysielu]

I achieved this by unfollowing everyone and changing my browser bookmark to my most commonly used group. I never visit the news feed anymore because there's nothing on it besides adverts.

[chrisper]

Can't you just use messenger.com? It is what I do

[jackocnr]

This is amazing. Facebook messenger without the temptation of the notifications icon. Thank you for bringing this to my attention.

[Sir_Cmpwn]

It's not that hard, you've just forgotten how to do these things without Facebook.

>I personally hate facebook's mobile apps and some it's policies ( Internet.org comes 1st to my mind), but it's hard to completely stop using it.

Try it! Deactivate your account for a week. Do it again later for two weeks. Maybe for a month. When you learn how to live without it, delete it.

[johnfn]

> It's not that hard, you've just forgotten how to do these things without Facebook.

This doesn't work because the world has changed since Facebook didn't exist. Now that it does, some forms of social interaction that existed outside of FB now only exist on FB.

I have friends with whom FB is the only form of communication with them, and many more friends with whom FB is easily the primary form. You can't singlehandedly convince all of your friends to move off FB and onto a better platform. Especially since most of these friendships are kinda small.

I've often seen the argument "well if they aren't meaningful friendships, it doesn't matter" but that's just not practical. Sometimes you'll reconnect with someone who you haven't spoken with in 5 years - that's occasionally how friendships work. Friendships aren't permanent and steady in intensity: they sometimes fade in and out. Quitting FB obliterates all those transient and potential future friendships.

We can reduce you saying "When you learn how to live without it" to you saying "When you learn how to live without interacting with a decent chunk of people that you know". Does it seem so easy now?

[tripzilch]

You can and should ask your friends to adapt if FB is the only form of communication they will have with you.

First off, you're doing a terrible thing to yourself by framing it as if you have only two choices: Become FB's product or become ostracised from your social circle. The latter is a deeply-ingrained biological fear, back in our tribal hunter/gather days, this basically meant death. Advertising has been abusing this biological behavioural function since the early 80's[0] but Facebook is going to extremes by actually invading and parasitising off our current social fabric, rather than just promising a "cool" lifestyle on top, like branding does.

In addition, by letting your friends do this, you are normalising the idea of "FB as only form of communication" for everybody else, too! There's so many people out there who would love to stop using FB that won't because they, like you, deeply fear being ostracised. More than you think (you won't find them on FB). If you feel that, just maybe, a single mega-corporation shouldn't be able to do this to more than 25% of all people in the whole wide world[1], then just maybe it's worth it to take a tiny bit of a stance and have a firm talk with your friends about this abuse, no?

Then there's people that I've seen (on here) crying, "you seem to have it easy, apparently your friends+family will accept this and you have time to find other means of communication but I live far away from home and have no time, and I would be so incredibly lonely if I'd stop doing FB". If you really, really feel that way, here's a big, fat yell-out-loud piece of advice: YOU ARE ALREADY LONELY. BEING A FB USER JUST OBSCURES THIS FACT. START TAKING ACTION TO FIX THIS IN A HEALTHY WAY. You're a user, and your social network consists of users (even if many of them seem to do fine). Ask any ex-addict what that's worth.

Finally, some of my friends have gone through hard times. Money, mental health, bad times. Sometimes they drop off the radar. Damage or lose their phone, disconnect from the social networks because of anxiety, shame or worries. These are the people that need their (real) social networks the most. I (and some of my friends with me) always make a point of SMS texting them about social stuff, keeping them in the loop, hangouts going on, once I realise they no longer read a certain group-chat. Even if they don't reply 4 out of 5 times, you will find they are super-grateful the fifth time. If you love them, keep an eye out for them. And even if you don't know anyone in this kind of situation, somebody you know probably does, so for their sake, start normalising the idea of keeping people in the loop whether they are on FB or not! (same goes for other networks/means of communication, but FB is extra bad because of its ubiquity and it's actively exploiting our human behaviour in a manner that is harmful to many individuals--while to groups appearing fine).

> I've often seen the argument "well if they aren't meaningful friendships, it doesn't matter" but that's just not practical. Sometimes you'll reconnect with someone who you haven't spoken with in 5 years - that's occasionally how friendships work. Friendships aren't permanent and steady in intensity: they sometimes fade in and out. Quitting FB obliterates all those transient and potential future friendships.

Except for pointing out the fact that last line is false and this fade in/out of friendships really does happen whether you're on FB or not, I'm just going to repeat: Ask any ex-addict. There's a lot of subtle nuances and facets to this fear of losing touch with certain people or potential future social contacts if you'd really really stop being a user. Be sure to ask one instead of assuming you know what they'll tell you. If you think you don't know any ex-addicts, try asking about alcohol.

> We can reduce you saying "When you learn how to live without it" to you saying "When you learn how to live without interacting with a decent chunk of people that you know".

But are you really. How can you even say you're interacting with a decent chunk of people that you know if that interaction is forcefully mediated through a singular channel of communication and you openly admit you're unable to really connect with them otherwise.

> Does it seem so easy now?

Face it, what seems hard is actually interacting with these people more, in a way that does not involve using FB together. It's that corporate-manufactured addictiveness talking. Just like the trying-to-quit alcoholic, finding it hard to expand their interaction with their friends to include things that do not involve consuming alcohol, getting pulled back in again every time.

And if you're that far in, you have my compassion. Because that is hard. It starts with facing the facts and not making excuses, it is your social responsibility.

On the bright side, working to expand your interaction with those you care about outside FB, is wholesome and fun. Chances are you might even reconnect with someone you haven't spoken in 5 years.

[0] Naomi Klein, No Logo. With the rise of "branding", advertising shifted from "this is our product" and "it's better because it has Y" towards associating the product with a lifestyle, a social group often entirely unrelated to the product (Coca-Cola being the classic example, having gone through many lifestyle-guises, none of which having to do with consuming carbonated sugary chemical sludge).

[1] 26.1% at time of posting, https://www.wolframalpha.com/input/?i=(facebook+users)/(worl...

[johnfn]

Unfortunately I believe you have missed what I was trying to say and went on a very long post against something that doesn't have anything to do with how I use FB. Your post was fun and interesting to read, I- it- I- just... it's almost as if you responded to a completely different post.

To recap, I have a bunch of friendships that are so minor that I only have contact with them on FB. They're not serious enough to demand the other person to move off FB. (We're talking about "I randomly like one of there posts every few months" minor.) They may become more serious in the future due to the ephemeral nature of friendships. Leaving FB would sever those friendships before they get to that stage.

Hopefully that makes sense!

[compiler-guy]

This is a painfully simplistic response.

No matter what I do, several activities and groups I want to be a part of are only advertised and organized on facebook. It's not within my power to change that.

And that, in fact, _does_ makes it hard to avoid using facebook without being left out.

[__jal]

I don't use FB at all, and haven't, ever. I'm a part of two groups that do most of their business on FB, in an official role in one of them. I don't miss anything important, and find it beneficial that I miss the rest[1].

I've refused to be blackmailed into Facebook use by my family, so there's zero chance a friend or associate will get away with it. If people can't be arsed to email me about something they consider significant, I don't have time for them either.

FOMO is a condition that happens in your head, as is how you let your peers treat you. It is within your power to deal with it.

[1] I don't discount that informal bonding, chit-chat, etc.; it is an important part of a healthy lifestyle, group formation, etc. I prefer the in-person sort, and for virtual, there's a whole internet out there that is not FB.

[tdurden]

> And that, in fact, _does_ makes it hard to avoid using facebook without being left out.

I think you might mean _fear_ of being left out...friends will find other ways to contact you.

[tedunangst]

Or not. Maybe they just decide it's not worth the hassle of tracking down the outliers. I guess we can argue that anybody who's a real friend will message you using your preferred comm, though that cuts both ways. If you are a real friend, you'd message them back with their preferred system.

[michaelmrose]

Email is a system which you can assume virtually 100% of users have and doesn't force users to participate in a social network that has been shown to be harmful for a lot of users.

Further email doesn't force you to participate in any particular service at all because it is a federated service.

Assuming that someone should get a facebook to talk to you is like assuming someone should switch to sprint to call you.

Imagine how moronic the world would be if all the different phone networks were disconnected from one another.

[tripzilch]

Huh? "Preferred" doesn't cut both ways. It never does, unless it's a shared preference. Using any shared method of communication to contact each other is what real friends do.

Also a group that "just decides" outliers are not worth the hassle, are not friends. They seriously are not. Friend groups are pretty much defined as the sort of groups that do not do this. Except in cases of grave social misconduct, often destroying the "group" or "friend" aspect in the process.

They are a group, yes. And indeed, some groups will sometimes just decide to ostracise outliers if it conflicts with the group identity. Nothing inherently wrong with that, btw, this can be very useful for certain types of group. As long as it doesn't become the main type of group you identify with. Because then, as we see from all the people making excuses all over this thread, not adhering to certain rules of the group-identity becomes an existential fear of epic proportions, because it touches upon a very fundamental behavioural aspect of our biology--fear of being cast out of the tribe (which used to mean suffering followed by near-certain death).

Facebook is currently exploiting this behavioural trigger (together with an addictive cocktail of other triggers) in a quarter of the world's population.

[chrischen]

If you’re considered an outlier then you should probably start finding new friends.

Generally back when I used facebook the cloests friends I had had 0 interaction on facebook and we usually just direct message through messenger or imessage.

Fscebook at that time was just for maintaining those “outlier” relationships until I realized its better to have closer bonds with fewer people.

[komali2]

I don't think this is true. We always have that moment at parties, "Where's Kyle? Oh shit, he deleted his facebook and didn't see the invite, did anybody text him to tell him?!" No, we didn't, because 99% of our friends use the very useful party organizing app with integrated chat and picture sharing, Facebook.

[Prefinem]

Those aren't your friends buddy.

>No, we didn't, because 99% of our friends use the very useful party organizing app with integrated chat and picture sharing, Facebook.

My friends will actively invite me (I don't use facebook) to events if they want me there.

[tripzilch]

What's the actual number? Because if 99 people out of a 100 all didn't think to text Kyle, then I don't think there's even a handful of people that actually really ever wanted him to be there.

It takes a very particular size of group for that to happen. If you hang out with 4-5 people you would know if you "forgot" to invite someone. If it's much more than that, that is really a lot of people who it didn't occur to whether they wanted to see Kyle there or not.

But you should really ask Kyle, about feeling left out and the quality of his friendships.

> 99% of our friends use the very useful party organizing app with integrated chat and picture sharing, Facebook

Except that is not why you are on FB while trying to defend your behaviour towards Kyle, that's only the story an alcoholic tells to himself when he's meeting his friends at the corner pub.

If FB usage was just a "party organizing app with integrated chat and picture sharing", we would not be having this discussion.

Let alone a "very useful" one, which would obviously allow to invite people transparently and easily via multiple channels of communication. FB does the exact opposite of this[0]. Now listen to yourself defending this!! Is that really your true opinion of this "organising app" speaking, or is it your dopamine-addiction, group identity and fear of ostracism?

[0] Try using FB links sent through other comm for a bit with a logged out, cookies cleared browser. Like, a day or two.

[Markoff]

sounds like Kyle got lucky not spending time with "friends" like that

[compiler-guy]

Fear has nothing to do with it. When I was not on facebook, I was getting left out of activities and events that weren't exactly with friends, but more with common interests.

[ozim]

So you are basically saying that you can be an ass and make it harder for others to contact you. Then if they are worthy enough you they will spend their time installing whatever communication tool you use. I do not get the feeling that I can be a princess and I also have to care about relation.

[Sir_Cmpwn]

>No matter what I do, several activities and groups I want to be a part of are only advertised and organized on facebook. It's not within my power to change that.

It is. You have the power to choose what you want to be a part of. And these groups have more members than yourself - people who you can ask to help you stay up to date on meetings and such.

[debaserab2]

I'm sorry, but get real. People use technology because it assists and speeds up areas of their life. For many people, facebook far and away is the most convenient way to manage their social life simply because they have the greatest adoption within their social groups.

Yes, we could "write someone a letter in the mail instead" or "ask a friend about the events on facebook" but that would defeat the point for the vast majority of us that aren't interested in spending hours managing our social contacts and calendars. You're not really giving solutions when you suggest things like that.

[Sir_Cmpwn]

The point I'm making is thus: if you acknowledge that Facebook is a bad influence on your life but you feel stuck with it, here's a low risk strategy for dipping your toes into life without it that you can try out.

I don't spend hours managing my social contacts and calendars and I still feel connected with my family and my friends without Facebook.

I'd like to point out that this thread has depressingly similar patterns compared to talking with drug addicts about their habit.

[white-flame]

The problem is that those assistance & speed-up effects are directly tangible, but the addictiveness, echo chamber, and privacy effects aren't quite so apparent.

It's not a clear net positive just because of those conveniences, and there are no current "solutions" to give as everything you list is far more relevant to network effects than technical feature set. (e.g. in the past, using Facebook made you an outlier, why not just use email lists/myspace/phone calls/etc like everyone else?) A path to an alternative would be through Facebook collapsing (unlikely on their own), another social media site out-marketing Facebook, or establishing your own small networking effect under different assumptions.

[wott]

> I'm sorry, but get real. People use technology because it assists and speeds up areas of their life.

Get real: people waste a lot more time on 'tech' than they save, compared to doing without. The goal of most of those 'techs' is to take up as much of your time as possible, that's the foundation of their business.

[compiler-guy]

I never said I didn't have the power to choose not to be a part of these groups. The point is that I want to be a part of them, and doing that without facebook is 10x the additional friction.

Yes, I could ask someone to forward me the notices, and activities, but how do you propose I participate in the discussions of what to do?

When the voting via facebook poll happens, how do you propose I make my voice heard.

Now, you could argue that facebook isn't worth it. (And that is a perfectly reasonable position to take.) But that is a different position than, "It's easy to make these things work without facebook."

[michaelmrose]

Promote giving up facebook or advertising via alternative means both to whomever organizes it and among your fellow users.

Volunteer to help with those alternative means.

[compiler-guy]

Ask everyone to sign up for different methods of communication. Pick a method for managing the lists. Avoid the additional publicity public facebook postings get you when someone likes it.

Those are real tradeoffs that many groups aren't willing to accept, regardless of how willing a single person is to shoulder the burden.

[DrScump]

  Ask everyone to sign up for different methods of communication

That's exactly what you are doing by insisting on Facebook use unnecessarily, when email is the true common denominator (doesn't everyone in your friends list have email?).

[debaserab2]

It's not really possible if the majority (or even portions) of your social life use facebook to organize events.

If you're interested in being a diligent contributor to your social group, you're either stuck trying to evangelize some other tool (usually less convenient for everyone else who doesn't mind facebook) or you're stuck asking for someone to check the FB event for you.

You can't really disconnect and easily maintain a social life in this circumstance.

[Sir_Cmpwn]

You will be surprised by how easy it is. Take the approach I suggested. Wane yourself off of it and don't quit entirely until you feel comfortable with it.

[acomjean]

I help out with an Art open studio event. Its really starting to be the case that people who are organizing events want to let members know about events and invite people via Facebook. We use that and email. Facebook is easy and somewhat effective.

Some people use it for their whole social calendar. This is different from the old evite.com days, which was more email list based.

I'm not on it so Facebook, but my Partner is so she keeps me posted on the social aspect of whats going on. If she wasn't I probably would have to be. Not being on it means stuff happens and I won't know. I'm ok with that, but it can be a bit isolating. There is only so much you can expect acquaintances to work to keep you in the loop.

People like that its free (not like the services you pay for like meetup.com)

[debaserab2]

I'm not interested in doubling or tripling the amount of time it takes to manage my social calendar and I find your comments that seem to be treating it like it's some kind of addiction to be a tad condescending for those of us who would close their account in a heartbeat if it wasn't such a necessary tool.

[tedunangst]

Perhaps you will be surprised to learn that not everybody is living the same life as you.

[unethical_ban]

I just rejoined facebook. I call it giving in again, but really, I see a lot more of what's going on in the city than I could otherwise. There are some websites that try to fill this gap (sites like Meetup or do512.com) and physical bulletin boards at the coffee shops, but FB is by FAR the easiest, and sometimes the only, way to find out about things.

And yeah, you can text, you can call, but "if" everyone is on facebook, it's a lot easier. I still have friends texting, but esp. for bigger group events, Fb is "just there" for most people. It's useful to be a part of that.

I don't like it, I don't like their views on destroying privacy or discouraging pseudonyms, and I wish there was something that was better at Facebook than Facebook, but there isn't.

[paulie_a]

Honestly I am not ready to simply delete my FB account, but I absolutely use it increasingly less. Every 3rd post is straight up an ad and generally an incredibly stupid ad. Social networks have become increasingly difficult to enjoy in my opinion because they have become insanely greedy and block the actual experience for why people want to be there.

In the past 3 months I am down an Instagram account and LinkedIn. Snapchat is probably next due to the absolutely awful interface and general pointlessness.

[Sir_Substance]

You know how when you recommend to someone that they should start going to the gym, they always have a laundry list of problems?

"It's too far away", "I don't trust them with my credit card", "I don't like exercising in front of people", "I need to be careful of my back", "I don't have time after work and I can't show up sweaty".

Ultimately, they just don't want to go to the gym. Nothing on that list is hard to solve, if you decide to go to the gym. If you don't have any drive to go to the gym, it's an unscalable and infinite wall of problems.

I can give you solution to the problems you've listed. In my experience, people will use other messenger solutions if you just ask them. Facebook users are a demographic that care nothing for installing another app on their phones. Pick one, and ask people to use it. Try wickr. There are dozens of online event organizers that can replace facebook's event RSVP, although I generally just talk to people like a human being.

If the music events you enjoy are promoted /only/ on facebook, then they're relatively niche affairs. Get involved with them. Hell, offer to be their "promotes in places that aren't facebook" guy in exchange for free tickets. Be a community builder.

But these ideas won't be acceptable to you, and even if they were you'd have a thousand other objections up your sleeve, because ultimately you don't actually want to leave facebook. I'm not going to try to frog-march you out the door, but lets not pretend there are actually any meaningful barriers there.

[kronos29296]

Replaced it with whatsapp for communication with friends (not fb friends but Friends). I just have a facebook account cuz everybody else has one but it is filled with notifications and messages that I don't reply to. All the people around me know that I don't respond to.

Viola, I am free of facebook and don't use it though I still have an account and have never deactivated it. Maybe it will not work for you.

P.S HN seems to be a bigger problem than FB for me atleast. Can't stop reading all posts and comments everyday.

[AndrewKemendo]

So you moved from Facebook to Facebook (whatsapp of course is owned by Facebook and gets the equivalent amount of information on you). Did you just want a different interface?

[thanatropism]

It's a completely different product.

As much as privacy is a legitimate concern, it's also a modern form of angst. So the existentialist mode that says "oh, you either have chicken and wait to die or have the beef and wait to die", which is demodé, gets replaced by "you either have chicken and get massacred by the social media-advertising-mass scale espionage nexus, or..."

(Angst isn't necessarily a bad thing either, but you should know...)

[kronos29296]

Less time wasted? I mean regardless of what I do, they will continue collect data about me. It is just a question of how much I personally contribute and how much they acquire from my friends. The real gain is you are less addicted to news feeds with the cursed infinite scrolling. A big gain for me.

[tonfa]

It's much more limited, WA is e2e encrypted so only metadata is accessible.

[rubidium]

Just stop. Do other things. Plenty of people seem to find a way and live great and wonderful lives without facebook. You can too.

I get what you're saying regarding the utility of facebook, but it's really not missed much once you leave.

[arkh]

> if anyone wants to organize a plan that has more than 8 people, facebook groups make it much much easier.

So, there is this thing which a little old: emails. It is wonderful to organize things. For group chats you also have some old shit like IRC. You get your beloved hashtag too.

[QAPereo]

Although beware that # does a slightly different thing.

[elorant]

So tell me, how do i replace around 5 different group chats i have on messenger which can have anywhere between 5-10 people in each chat?

You throw a party and get to talk to everyone. I mean come on, we used to socialize before social networks.

[gertef]

Many of us did not, because throwing a party is expensive and complicated.

[rhizome31]

It doesn't have to be expensive if you tell everybody to bring something to eat or drink. It does require à bit of organization but nothing very complicated. If your place is too small you can do a picnic in a public park.

[mouldysammich]

For music i find songkick https://www.songkick.com/ is very good. I usually get information for bands i like from them before i see it on facebook.

[rkul]

Fb was taking too much of my time and attention since it was super easy to scroll either mobile or desktop.

What worked for me:

1. Delete facebook app from phone (hiding it didnt work) 2. Install Newsfeed eradicator chrome extension

Result: still maintaining communication with friends via messenger app and checking facebook only once in a while for events etc. News Feed was the attention grabber.

Helped me to get back attention and time. Would recommend.

[chrischen]

The group chats are just standard messenger services that’s basically interchangeable with imessage, gchat, msn messenger, aim, whatsapp, line, wechat, or kakaotalk.

It’s ok to use that part since it’s basically a commodity feature that can be swapped if it becomes bad. That being said, they do read your messenger chats.

[aryehof]

I recommend making an entirely fake persona for Facebook and use it only for necessary groups and chats. Use the mobile web interface exclusively, and don't install any related mobile apps.

[notspanishflu]

Use Telegram groups.

https://telegram.org/faq#q-what-makes-telegram-groups-cool

[darepublic]

For me it was easy.. but then again I have few real friends, and those I keep in touch with by other means

[dalanmiller]

The Facebook API is pretty easy to use. I'd recommend writing some scripts and then PushBullet'ing them to you as necessary. The goal is to prevent yourself as much as you can from opening facebook.com.

[strathmeyer]

e mail; these technologies such as WhatsApp are derogatorily referred to as e mail-killers.

[sjg007]

Just use messenger?

[yawz]

Well... As someone who has moved to various countries and across continents a few times over the last three decades, I can hardly find another medium that allows me to keep up with friends and family across many countries and time zones easily.

Before Facebook I created and/or used e-mail aliases, e-mail groups, forums, file hosting services, etc. to share our story with friends and family. Facebook makes it much simpler.

I don't use it extensively. I don't play games on it. I don't even connect to it every day. And I would stop using it if I had a good alternative.

[jsemrau]

Well, I moved over the last years across several time-zones and continents. There are people that I knew back then and lost contact now. Do I care if they got babies, found a new job, like/dislike Trump, or are doing Toga on the beach ? No, I don't. I moved away. Having that knowledge does not make my life better or worse in any way. I can get the illusion that we are still in contact, but in reality I will never move back to these places. So why should I care?

[yawz]

Sounds like you didn't care about them in the first place. I'd like to think that friendships and love (not necessarily romantic love) survives the distance.

Having said that, I totally get that one may not necessarily want to know what a friend had for lunch, for example :).

[bduerst]

This is what I don't get about the dichotomy of either quitting facebook or letting it run your life. Can't people just use fb minimally without it absorbing everything they do?

I login probably once a week at most, and only check messenger if someone pings me on it. It's not difficult, so why are so many people advocating deleting accounts to improve their lives?

[yawz]

Totally! That's close to how I'm using Facebook normally. I don't even have Messenger on my mobile devices.

[Sir_Cmpwn]

How about letters via snail mail? It's a lot more personal, since you have to set aside some time to sit down and read/write the letters without the all of the distractions Facebook presents to you, and you're able to filter it to the subjects that are important to you rather than a constant stream of thought from everyone you know.

[bluGill]

That would work for my parents. It means my second cousin and I exchange "Christmas cards" and no more which leaves a lot out.

[Sir_Cmpwn]

You have almost 9,000 hours in a year. Surely you can find time in them to write to your second cousin.

[yawz]

How long does it take to write a 2 page letter? I'm not even talking about preparing the mail, posting, etc. I'm in software development, just like yourself, and I can probably type many times faster than I can write.

I think you're being too romantic about the good old snail mail. ;)

[Sir_Cmpwn]

You can write snail mail with a text editor on a computer and print it off...

[yawz]

(replying at this level, because HN seems to have a depth limit for nested messages)

Drew, I think I understand where you're coming from. But as stated earlier on, I don't even connect to Facebook daily, let alone spending hours on it.

[Sir_Cmpwn]

You didn't answer my question, though. I didn't expect you to write letters daily either. How does the amount of time you spend on Facebook compare to the amount of time you could see yourself spending writing letters?

[yawz]

I prefer not to repeat myself and spend that time for more happy memories ;).

[Sir_Cmpwn]

How many hours per week do you spend on Facebook instead of making "happy memories"?

[yawz]

This is hardly practical :), let alone slow and expensive with all the pictures printed etc.

[Sir_Cmpwn]

Of course it's practical! How do you think people kept in touch before the internet? How difficult is it to write up a letter, put it in an envelope with a stamp (which you can pick up at the gas station, grocery store, etc) and drop it in your mailbox?

Printing pictures is only a few bucks, and as a side effect the recipient can easily frame it and put it on their hearth!

[yawz]

Seriously?!? Would you write that letter to dozens of people in 3 different languages? Or should I pick "only one" of my aunts and uncles to share my son's first school day pictures? Or maybe we can create a human chain where one sends the letter and pictures that he/she receives to the next one in line. (hmm... maybe there's a business idea there...)

[Sir_Cmpwn]

You're used to pushing information to them with a firehose. Use a bucket instead. Send letters out infrequently, one per household.

[yawz]

Instead of writing letters, I guess I prefer to have hobbies.

[paulcole]

How many handwritten letters do you send?

[Sir_Cmpwn]

I never said handwritten. I send printed letters every month or two.

[Torwald]

You can use a blog.

[yawz]

I blog for other things: technology and book reviews. But it is too public for personal stories that I share with friends & family.

[Torwald]

you are a hacker. you can have a blog with privacy settings.

[bluGill]

Facebook is a much better way for me to share pictures of my kids to all my relatives. Sure I can text that picture to each individually, but some people want to see all pictures in full detail while some want to see just a few.

I have no way of knowing who wants to see any individual pictures. My parents want to see nearly all. What about my second cousin who I haven't seen in person in 15 years because she lives so far away? What about the running back of our high school football team? I'm not close enough that I'd send any pictures to either of them, but in fact they like that once in a while they see pictures of my kids and remember I exist.

Facebook solves a real social problem that text, and phones do not solve. (There are other solutions, but Facebook is the popular one)

What made Facebook useful for me is when I blocked all games. I'm slowly eliminating political posts as well, but since I'm active in politics some of my real friends are also active which makes this impossible.

[saimiam]

> Facebook solves a real social problem

With all due respect, until FB nominally solved this problem, you (I) never even knew this problem existed. Before it became trivial to share pictures with a long lost acquaintance using FB, we got by just fine showing pics to a tiny subset of friends.

There was literally no idea in anyone's head that they needed to show pictures of their children to some guy they last spoke to 15 years ago. This notion that FB is solving a real need is false. It's like saying cigarette companies solve the problem of nicotine cravings among smokers.

[wott]

That's the rhetoric of "the pressing 'demand' that must be satisfied". Each time I ask where the mass that actually 'demanded' something is, I get no answer.

[romwell]

Right, by a similar logic, there was never a demand for automobiles, so we can get rid of them without any loss.

[tedunangst]

Something about people wanting a faster horse.

[throwmea56]

They didn't. And, as a car obsessive, it was a mistake.

commute times are probably the same (45 minutes walking/tram with a 4~5 mi dense city core, vs 45 in the freeway and a 60 miles of low suburban development) and we don't have the infrastructure for alternatives to travel outside the city.

As to the need for speed itself. I used to like big fancy fast cars.

Then I got a motorcycle. Now cars are... boring.

[open_bear]

For every "wanting a faster horse" I give you "new iPhones every 6 months", "smart bottles that remind you to drink more water" and "Internet-connected $400 juicer that requires special cartridges to make juice".

[vaishaksuresh]

>Facebook is a much better way for me to share pictures of my kids to all my relatives

Also to Facebook's facial recognition software, without your kids ever agreeing to it and they won't have a way to undo it once they grow up, even if they want to.

[lioeters]

This is really worrying, that there's a whole generation growing up whose personal data are being gathered and exploited, without their consent. I'm already upset that my friends have tagged me in numerous photos on FB, giving them more info than I care to. I can only imagine how much worse it would have been if that had been done throughout my childhood and teenage years..

[noonshine]

I had been off facebook for 5 years. Now my kid started school and there's info in private facebook groups that is not shared any other way. I hate it but decided to rejoin.

[marpstar]

So wait...the school uses Facebook for communication? Gross. My kids' school uses something called ClassDojo, which is exactly like Facebook, but geared towards classroom settings. It works well enough.

[yawz]

I'm guessing that parents connect through Facebook groups.

Today, being the first day of school here in Colorado, my wife told me that the parents decided to organize a Facebook group to share information. My suggestion was a Whatsapp group, but I guess that's Facebook as well :).

[xtrimsky1234]

This is not a good solution. It's not about keeping in touch, it's also a way to send news to other people. I live in the US but most of my family is in Europe, how do you want me to post a picture of my daughter so that all my family views it? By texting it (which I can't really right now because Google Voice doesn't support international texting), it would require me to send the picture to at least 20 people who I think would be interested in it.

Texting and calling is mostly a 1 to 1 relationship. Which is good to wish happy birthday or such. But it sucks to actually update people about news, post pictures.

Now I could potentially open a blog, but then again a lot of the people checking my Facebook profile aren't really that into tech. I have my 97 years old grandfather that checks Facebook because we taught him how to. If I tell him to go this blog to check my news, to another blog to check my sisters news, etc... It will become very difficult.

I think Facebook is a great platform, but over the years it filled up with too many ads. They are attempting too much to maximize profit, which is a crappy goal. If I would control Facebook, I would reduce the ads to a minimum survivable. And then I would offer a premium option with no ads.

[codingdave]

I did, too. But I found that the marketing power of Facebook is just too good to ignore. I made an account again, just to have a few Pages dedicated to my projects. I didn't even reconnect with friends. Even without paid ads... just sharing my content on Facebook with related groups, my site traffic increased by 15% and my revenue by 25%.

[sooheon]

More evidence that on facebook, the user is the product. If you're buying, it's a good market.

[drukenemo]

Ah, the mandatory comment. Relevant: https://youtu.be/md4kM9AKjHs

[rhapsodic]

>I found it to be mental pollution at best and and a total waste of time.

I've tried to express the same idea to friends and family who pester me about not being on FB, but I never came up with a phrase as simple and succinct as "mental pollution." Thanks!

[ProAm]

> call or text them

There is no difference between a call or text and a message on FB, the medium doesn't change the context.

[ageitgey]

Of course the medium changes the context. It has a huge effect!

Phone calls are typically person-to-person communication where you can hear the tone of voice of the person you are talking to, so you can better read their meaning. Also, you typically call people you already know well enough to disturb. It's a very personal form of communication.

Facebook is different in all those areas. You are thrown into meaningless conversations with people you don't know where you can't hear anyone's one of voice. Some parts of facebook seem to be designed specifically to encourage more conversation instead of meaningful conversation - things like how you really have to dig to read earlier comments in a thread. They just want you to keep posting instead of following the actual discussion in a coherent way.

Likewise, posting on this site is different than having a conversation in person. You can't tell that I'm writing all this in a friendly tone. Instead, it might come across as an angry argument when I don't mean it that way. That's a disadvantage of this medium and a way in which it changes communication.

[ProAm]

You can send voice messages over facebook. [1]

[1] https://www.facebook.com/help/377884675632666

[d-sc]

A call or text is a different interaction than scrolling through an infinite newsfeed designed to keep you addicted.

[ProAm]

A facebook message doesn't force you to scroll forever. It's a message, just like a text message.

[turc1656]

yeah but only the NSA will be tracking it if you use text, not some multinational conglomerate that is using it to continually build its profile about you while simultaneously selling that information to other parties.

And if you do it right (meaning using the right app), your messages can be fully end-to-end encrypted so that no one can read them but the intended recipients.

EDIT: it is widely known that the NSA has direct lines into places like Google and Facebook so using Facebook Messenger still routes your messages through the NSA indirectly. The only logical course of action, if someone cares about that sort of thing, is to not use Facebook Messenger and limit the amount of eyes that can see your communications.

[iaml]

I find it a bit ridiculous that on HN you are damned both ways: if you rarely use fb to contact folks, you are still contributing to fb stats and still addicted (actual claims from other threads regarding fb), and if you aren't you're ignoring a (valuable) message channel.

[lovemenot]

Are you insinuating that the many commenters here might have differing even - dare I say - contradictory opinions?

[DarkTree]

I don't want to put words in your mouth, but I believe you meant, "the medium doesn't change the message". I disagree that everyone feels this way, based on evidence of how I feel when receiving a text message vs. a phone call.

Maybe it's because it personally takes me more effort to make a phone call, or the added tone of voice, or maybe it's just the instant dialogue that the call creates. Calls will always be more special to me than a facebook message. Just as a handwritten birthday letter in the mail is more special than the same message in a text.

[axus]

The medium is not the message?

[lurker10000]

Marshall McLuhan would beg to differ.