[rnprince]

This is just another form of marketing, and marketing does create value. It's true that some marketing is dishonest and harmful, but I don't have a reason to think this is one of those cases.

This person is providing a service in reviewing products for people making buying decisions. As a result, they waste less time being unsure about their decision, and less money is spent on purchases they regret.

[nudiustertian]

that would be true if they were actually reviewing these products and not doing basic feature overviews ranked often artibrarily. theyre in the business of looking legitimate not being it

[the_cat_kittles]

i really disagree that marketing creates value, at least the current state of things. to me, marketing looks like a big prisoners dilemma that i have to actively ignore and filter in order to make good decisions.

[CM30]

I wouldn't say marketing doesn't create value at all. It can make for some amazing trailers and advertisements that are entertaining on their own merits, it can bring attention to a product that genuinely is good and needs more people to realise that and in some cases it can give you lots to talk/think/dream about before the actual thing is released.

If films, TV shows or games didn't have trailers and advertisements, an awful lot of communities would lose a decent part of their activity due to their members not having much to discuss for years.

There would be no room for speculation prior to release. No feeling of excitement every time a new announcement is made or a returning character is revealed.

And some ads are basically works in themselves. Like the ones here:

http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/Advertising

Let's also not forget that while quite a lot of ads are manipulative or dishonest, a near equally large amount are pretty much spot on and give you a great rundown of the products and its strengths.

This ad Nintendo aired for Pokemon Sun and Moon for example got a great reception online and likely sold a hell of a lot of games, yet it's also 100% true to the product and illustrates exactly what you do get by buying it:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fL6QuYi3rpo

Is that manipulating people? I wouldn't say so. It's just giving them more information about a product they may have already been interested in.

Not all ads or marketing are misleading, nor something you have to ignore to make good decisions.

[the_cat_kittles]

i want to thank you for this kind of response. ive been commenting on hn more lately, and its suprised me how quick people are to ignore the nuance of something and just say its "bad" or "good". yes, i know thats essentially what i did in my original comment. but you are challenging what i said with specific examples, and that makes for interesting discussion. and i agree, not all ads are bad. and i think your point about some of them being works of art in their own right is something i strongly agree with- i've scored a couple commercials and have a bit of experience seeing the amount of thought that goes into some of them.

that being said, if were just restricting the discussion to movies- my personal strategy now is to wait until i hear from people i know that something is good before i bother. its not a strong interest of mine, so im pretty indifferent overall. the other way i decide is if i see people on twitter i follow say that something is good. or, i hear about something that has actors or directors i like. so, i think this stance leaves me highly susceptible to marketing. but the fact that marketing is influencing my movie choices is not evidence that its a good thing-

if no one marketed movies, would we still watch movies? i think so. maybe not as many, but probably with more enjoyment overall. just a guess. do you have any art / music / film interests that are too specific to be overcome with marketing? i do, and i actively seek new stuff, which i am able to find, without the "aid" of sophisticated, organized marketing. i guess thats my counterpoint to the idea that marketing is helping to find stuff in this arena. i can see how teasers and the like can generate excitement and interest in a positive way, and thats a separate point.

[JumpCrisscross]

> i really disagree that marketing creates value

Have you never found a product you wouldn't have heard about had it not been for an ad or something like it?

[BoiledCabbage]

If marketing were really about "product discovery" there would just be a yellow pages for all products and we'd call it a day.

It is a zero sum game of trying to get a manipulate a consumer to like your product over another.

[quadrangle]

spot on. Do people need McDonald's ads to inform them about McDonald's products? Maybe in a few rare cases. It's not about information, it's about manipulation.

[the_cat_kittles]

i dont dispute that theres value in clearly identifying what your selling. im saying that we are past that point and into lying and manipulative advertising in lots of cases. to put it another way, im fairly sure that "marketing" is making it harder for me to find the things i want rather than easier.

[awkward]

Marketing creates value for amazon, but it's externality is a thin layer of shit over everything else.