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by josephpmay 3900 days ago
For those who are older, Venmo is used today probably more than cash by college students (for things like paying a friend back, paying membership dues, paying to get into a party, etc.)
4 comments

I'm weird but I feel like cash is superior for those applications and doesn't require me to hand my credit card number out to yet another company.
It's pretty easy to use venmo without giving them your banking information. That's how I've been using it for years. You just have to be willing to carry a balance. What I did is went to a coworker who has venmo and gave him $50 in cash, and in return he transferred $50 to my venmo.

That wouldn't work so well if you were always receiving money or always sending it, but if you have a pretty even mix then it works great.

But it does require you to walk to the nearest ATM, withdraw the nearest round amount to the amount you need, then somehow try to get change from your friend (or just call it even) then walk around with the remainder.

I get what you're saying, but it isn't difficult to see why people find Venom a better option. What is exactly that bad about Venmo having your credit card number? You're protected from fraud anyway.

Write check, friend deposits with mobile check deposit app. Everyone has a bank of some sort, I have yet to meet anyone who is using Venmo.
It's friction. If you have two entities providing the same service (money exchange), but one is easy to use and one is much harder to use, the easier one will win (all other things being equal.

Check method:

  Needed items:
    Payer - checkbook, pen
    Payee - phone

  Steps:
    Payer        Payee
    Write check
    Give check   Receive check
                 Sign check
                 Use app to photograph and submit check
Venmo method:

  Needed items:
    Payer - phone
    Payee - phone

  Steps:
    Payer            Payee
    Send $x to Payee
A similar occurrence in the financial field, mobile banking. Depositing checks via phone is easier than going to an ATM which was easier than making it to a physical branch of the right bank during business hours.

Cash is a better equivalence to Venmo, but only works when you're physically collocated. And then requires one or both parties to carry around cash (and it's not as easy to be precise, if you care about getting it right down to the penny).

How do you handle someone who won't install Venmo and sign up for their service? Not pay them back?
Switch back to cash, check or another transfer mechanism. Or have them buy the next round at the bar and call it good.
You then have to write out a check to the right person, the amount, the other person has to sign it and then take two pictures. Venmo just reduces all of that to. Send $10 to X
Perfect example of the HN bubble.
You're the on in the bubble. Young people don't write checks. Full stop.
Yep, I bet Venmo processed $1.6 billion in transactions in the last quarter of 2014 entirely from Hacker News users.

EDIT: Oh, apparently we're going to talk about their business model now instead. Jeez, it's hard to keep up.

When you say cheque I think "fax", or "betamax" or "pager number".
Unfortunately, America hasn't reached the same level of financial sophistication as the UK regarding money transfers. It will eventually, obsoleting hacks like Venmo.
What is the sophisticated UK alternative to Venmo?
Who carries checks everywhere anymore?
> I have yet to meet anyone who is using Venmo.

And I have never written a check.

I doubt the people in Venmo's demo even know where their checkbook is, if they have one at all.

"Everyone has a bank of some sort"

I think we've had quite a few articles on HN that show that isn't true.

I don't know about all banks, but my bank has a flat fee on that service, which seems like it would make it significantly worse for paying back small sums (of which the flat fee is a greater percentage of).
I have yet to meet anyone under 30 who knows where their checkbook is.
Meet "the Venmo line":

http://qz.com/277509/read-what-happens-when-a-bunch-of-over-...

Your kid's school doesn't take Venmo for field trips. Or school lunch programs. Or extracurricular activities. That's just to name a few "adult" things Venmo doesn't support, and requires a checkbook.

Great, you can pay friends back for rent, drinks, or eating out. #millenialproblems

It seems more like #twentysomethingproblems, not #millenialproblems. As a GenXer this was stuff I dealt with far more in college and just after than I do these days. I imagine it was similar for my Boomer parents.
I think services like Venmo are the way of the future, but there's something the minimalist in me really likes about the completely analog transfer of paper money. There's an app for everything and they all require mental overhead (the least of which is remembering which silly oft-nonsensical app name translates to the real-world thing you want it to do). I'm not a Luddite, but simplicity to me is not 100 different apps for 100 different everyday tasks they handle.
It's surprisingly hard to settle a dinner bill between 8 people who only have $20 bills, and no one actually goes inside the bank branch to get other denominations (or buys anything with cash to get change).
Its not very hard to ask for change from a restaurant or get change from a bar later on in the night.

If everyone got $20 from the ATM earlier what's to stop them from using their debt card to pay the bill? I was a server for many years and splitting the bill is standard for most younger people.

Let's take a specific example, then. Last week I ordered ~$140 worth of pizza for a party at our office. I paid with my credit card on the website of the pizza joint. Everyone owed about $12-13 in the end (yeah I know, it's an expensive local pizza chain).

Getting paid back with cash would've been a nightmare. Instead I opened Venmo, put in $150, entered the names of my colleagues who were partaking, and hit request. Venmo did the math and requested each person's portion with a push notification. They each confirmed, and I was paid back in full in a few minutes, without even needing to talk directly to most of the people involved.

There are so many situations like this. "But you could do it another more inconvenient way instead" or "you could continue to deal with recouping for hours afterward" aren't especially compelling arguments once you've had the convenience.

>Its not very hard to ask for change from a restaurant or get change from a bar later on in the night.

If everyone chips in a $20 or two, but there's a wide spread in min and max spend per person, getting the correct increments of change to distribute to each diner in the party becomes an efficiency nightmare. Nevermind the fact that it's just plain stupid when reasonable alternatives (Venmo, Square Cash, etc.) exist.

>splitting the bill is standard for most younger people

There are many food and drink establishments with a "no splitting of bills, ever" policy. This is more prevalent in some cities than others.

We differ greatly in our definitions of "nightmare," "stupid," and "reasonable."

But that's ok.

We just don't carry cash much - we always have our phones
Depending on where you live, at least. In my section of the midwest, I've never met someone who uses Venmo for anything.
venmo is used more than cash by my late 20 and early 30 friends as well.
What are the 30's people using it for?
I am 37. My last couple venmo transactions:

  Paying off a bet about who would become CEO of twitter
  Paying someone for my portion of a bar tab.
  Fantasy Football league dues
  Receiving money from someone for their portion of a bar tab
  Paying someone for movie tickets
Why not use PayPal? No fees? Less friction?
Venmo is way easier to use. Hence all of my friends use it, so there is a powerful network effect.
I use it for just about everything I would have previously had to write a check to an individual for. Most of the time this ends up being some form of paying someone back for my portion of a split bill or if they purchased something on my behalf.

Even though I have had paypal for years, most people cringe when someone doesn't yet have Venmo and offers to send via paypal.

I'm in my 30s. Today is the first day I've ever heard of Venmo.

I think the reason why I never heard of it is cause of the way my friends and I handle money. One person will grab drinks one day and the next time the next person picks up lunch. If someone buys a pizza everyone just gives them whatever bill from their pocket. None of us really "keep track" in specific dollar figures. Nobody says "this is only $5, you owe me $6."

Of course this kind of thing doesn't work out for every group.

I bought concert tickets and a friend paid me for one of them. I need help moving and my friend let me use her zipcar membership. I venmo'd her money for the cost of the van. A few friends and I wanted to send flowers to a friend who had a baby. One person bought them and charged us each the split amount. etc.
Some people use it to meet minimum spends for credit card sign-up bonuses.
So is it useful in countries with good banking systems? In the UK transactions are pretty much instantaneous and only require account number/sort code.

I had never heard of it until I saw that post