Even if Lightning was possibly a nicer or smaller connector; nothing beats a true industry standard. Makes the entire “what chargers and cables to bring to connect my stuff” question so much easier.
"back in the day", you had an ericsson charger that fit in an ericsson phone and charget that ericsson phone well... and you had a nokia charger for you nokia that charged your nokia. They physically looked different, they wouldn't fit into any other device, and when you needed a charger, you'd take the one that fit the charging hole and it would charge.
Now, you have a bunch of usb C bricks, some just 5V usb, some USB PD, some QC(2, 3).... then you have a bunch of usb C cables, some with ID chips, some without, some able to carry 15 watts, some 100 watts, and then you have devices, some that can do QC, some that can do smart PD, some with just some resistors, some without even those.
Everything fits in every hole, every charger can take any cable and any device can take the other end of the cable.... but will this particular combo charge your laptop? The cable fits.. will it charge? What about those cheap earbuds that just want 5 volts? The USB-A to usb-C cable that came with them works, but the USB-C to USB-C that you bought after, doesn't. How about that smart LiPo charger, it's USB-C, but it needs at least 9 volts to charge, and not every power brick gives out that voltage. What about charging speed? Will it do fast charge? Your laptop charging light is on, but the battery percentage is going down... why? What about a powerbank, does it charge your laptop? How does it know who does the charging, and who is getting charged?
I mean sure, if you know your standards, you'll know what devices need PD and which ones use QC, you'll read the specs on the power bricks, you know how many watts your laptop needs, how to switch the current directions, which devices can't do proper handshakes, and need usbA->C cables, etc, and you'll get yourself a baggie of a few power bricks and cables for different stuff, but i had to label the cables for my mom, because while everything physically fits, many combinations won't actually charge your device. 10 years ago, this wasn't a problem, since her laptop charger didn't fit her wireless earphones, now it fits and it doesn't charge them.
In practice, this complexity means you at least have a chance. Most phones and almost all low-power devices will accept power from most chargers and cables. Probably not at a maximum level, but if you're stuck somewhere you can get by.
Power-hungry laptops are trickier, but even so... I've gone a week or more trickle charging a laptop from whatever travel charger I happened to have on hand, using it for a few hours, then putting it in standby and charging it up again until finally the mfg-blessed replacement fast charger arrived. The alternative (and one I was faced with more than once in the bad old days) was "no laptop".
Worst experience I've had to date has been a Norco jump box that will charge via one high-power charger and one cable, a car charger it came with, and ... Via careful back feeding from a benchtop power supply.
I have successfully had am M1 MacBook open and in active use (albeit not with very heavy workload, mostly text editor and web), while plugged into a Nintendo Switch 1 charger (only thing I had handy at that moment), and was watching the battery percentage slowly increasing over time. So even laptops can sometimes charge slowly while in use with a rather underpowered type C charger (Albeit still slightly better than a cheapo 5V 3A Type-C phone charger).
I've charged a Mac with the Switch cable, and a Switch with the Mac brick. Nowadays I charge everything with the same brick from a dell laptop from 2018.
Is it the most efficient? Probably not. Is it hurting the batteries of my devices? I guess?? I haven't noticed any issues with any device and that's 8 years now. Perhaps I've been lucky.
That's for charging. Data can be trickier, that's true, but often devices that use USB-C for serious stuff come with their own. Chargers from aliexpress-grade stuff I just discard to the drawer of the 1M-cables from where nothing will ever come out.
Unequivocally no, assuming your chargers are reasonably spec-compliant (e.g. not Aliexpress garbage). This is the whole point of type-C / USB-PD: chargers and devices should be more or less interchangeable. It's up to the device, not the charger, to charge its battery at an appropriate rate. The worst that can happen is plugging in an undersized charger, which may cause the device to charge slowly or not at all. If the device accepts a charge from the charger at a rate you find acceptable, then you're golden.
You may be right, and I've had to live some of that myself with docking stations, thunderbolt, and such.
But those moments are the exceptions. In my everyday life, when I need to charge _anything_, except maybe for the laptop itself, I just look for a charger with USB-C and it works. It maybe faster or slower depending on everything you just wrote, but it works.
On a side-note, when I take the charger of my laptop, it can charge absolutely everything.
> when you needed a charger, you'd take the one that fit the charging hole and it would charge.
I have three devices in my room right now that fit the "standard" barrel plug shape. One is 5V, one is 12V, one is 12V with inverted polarity. If I plug the wrong cable into the wrong device it will break permanently. They do have the decency to label somewhere on the device what kind of power it needs but that's something I need to check every time.
In contrast I bought a couple inexpensive 6' USB-C cables that do 100W charging, and a couple inexpensive bricks that support that too. Every USB-C device I own - my phone, my laptop, my earbuds, my portable batteries, my portable fans - every one of them can power/charge at full speed or at least very fast.
And more importantly, I know they aren't going to get fried if I'm tired or in a rush and I forgot to check the plugs. I made one purchase of some inexpensive good cables+bricks, and now I never need to think about it again.
> Now, you have a bunch of usb C bricks, some just 5V usb, some USB PD, some QC(2, 3).... then you have a bunch of usb C cables, some with ID chips, some without, some able to carry 15 watts, some 100 watts, and then you have devices, some that can do QC, some that can do smart PD, some with just some resistors, some without even those.
I've never seen a USB C brick that supported some alternative to PD but not PD. Do many exist? Are they still making them?
Wattage of chargers is easy enough to handle.
Every non-defective cable can do 60 watts. That's enough for the vast majority of devices. If you have defective cables just get rid of them.
> will this particular combo charge your laptop?
If your laptop doesn't have weird DRM, the answer is either "every charger and every cable works" or "every 60W or higher charger and every cable works".
> How about that smart LiPo charger, it's USB-C, but it needs at least 9 volts to charge, and not every power brick gives out that voltage.
I think that's violating the standard so you'd have similar problems even without this kind of standard. But that's basically just a 30 watt requirement in practice which goes back to being easy.
> The USB-A to usb-C cable that came with them works, but the USB-C to USB-C that you bought after, doesn't.
That one's definitely violating the standard.
> What about charging speed? Will it do fast charge?
For anything under 60 watts, just read the number on the charger.
This is the same as with other kinds of plug, which can also vary in charging speed even when they're compatible.
For higher wattage laptops in particular you might care about cable choice. That's an annoyance but also easily solved by getting only high wattage cables.
> What about a powerbank, does it charge your laptop?
You've lost me. Without USB C a laptop power bank basically wouldn't exist. Weren't we comparing to back in the day?
> I've never seen a USB C brick that supported some alternative to PD but not PD. Do many exist? Are they still making them?
They existed not that long ago, before usb c pd was a stanard, many samsung phones supported it (and not PD), and those powerbricks with those usb c cables still exist and still fit into PD phones.
> Wattage of chargers is easy enough to handle.
How? Explain that to my mom, she picks up a cable that fits her phone/laptop and plugs it in. Here's the charger: https://www.ikea.com/si/sl/p/sjoess-usb-polnilnik-z-2-vrati-... It says 45 watts, will that charge her laptop? Why won't her laptop charge if she's charging a phone too? That didn't happen with her old laptop charger.
> If your laptop doesn't have weird DRM, the answer is either "every charger and every cable works" or "every 60W or higher charger and every cable works".
Will this one work? It won't, no usb PD support, but it fits into my moms PC, explain that to her. The cable is on her nightstand, she plugs it in, doesn't charge.
> I think that's violating the standard so you'd have similar problems even without this kind of standard. But that's basically just a 30 watt requirement in practice which goes back to being easy.
I have a charger and a soldering iron that just says voltage too low and doesn't work. The cable fits, but it doesn't work. I know why not, now explain it to my mom.
> That one's definitely violating the standard.
Sure, but she bought such a device, the cable fits but it doesn't charge.
> This is the same as with other kinds of plug, which can also vary in charging speed even when they're compatible.
What plug? Ericsson plug fit and charged the ericsson, same for nokia... usb C fits and doesn't charge.
> For higher wattage laptops in particular you might care about cable choice. That's an annoyance but also easily solved by getting only high wattage cables.
Again, explain that to my mom. how many watts? Is 60 enough? Ikea only has 45 watts, will that work? What is a watt? Why is it only 22 watts if she's also charging a phone?
> You've lost me. Without USB C a laptop power bank basically wouldn't exist. Weren't we comparing to back in the day?
Of course laptop powerbanks existed before USB C, they gave out usually 19 volts and the guy at the store would install a proper connector to fit your laptop and you'd lose the others. You'd charge it with a charger that fit that powerbank and charged it, then charge the laptop with it.
Now you buy this: https://www.ikea.com/si/sl/p/varmfront-prenosni-polnilnik-te... 18 watts.. will it charge the laptop? Won't it? Who knows. Will the power go from the laptop to the powerbank instead? Who knows! You have to read the goddamn manual for that to see, and the manual says:
> Charging power bank
> • Connect the USB-C cable to the USB-C port of the power bank first and
then connect the USB cable to a USB-charger or USB-outlet that can
provide sufficient power to charge the power bank. The LED indicators
will display the charging status.
> Supply power to devices
> • Connect the USB cable to USB-C or USB-A port of the power bank first
and then connect the USB-cable to your device that you want to charge.
> • The power bank will detect a connected device and start charging
automatically.
> • The LED indicators will display the remaining charge in the power bank
during discharging.
Now explain that to my mom. The cables fit.
Yes, i know i'm complaining, but i live just far away from my parents, that it's a pain to sit into a car and drive all the way there to swap some adapters or chargers, or cables and label what goes where and for what it can be used... and debugging that over the phone is a pain.
> They existed not that long ago, before usb c pd was a stanard, many samsung phones supported it (and not PD), and those powerbricks with those usb c cables still exist and still fit into PD phones.
The PD 2.0 spec came out two and a half years before samsung's first USB C phone. And the power brick that came with it wasn't USB C.
> It says 45 watts, will that charge her laptop?
I'm not sure, but a 65 watt charger definitely would. "Get 65W for a laptop" isn't any harder than any other third party power supply for a laptop. Which is optional, you don't have to get a third party supply.
> Why won't her laptop charge if she's charging a phone too? That didn't happen with her old laptop charger.
Her old laptop charger didn't have a second phone plug. If you don't want the complexity then don't use it.
> Will this one work? It won't, no usb PD support, but it fits into my moms PC, explain that to her.
Okay. To your mom: Every 60 watt or higher charger will work. That super cheap one is only 5. It can't do it.
> I have a charger and a soldering iron that just says voltage too low and doesn't work. The cable fits, but it doesn't work. I know why not, now explain it to my mom.
Every 60 watt or higher charger will work. That one's too low.
> Sure, but she bought such a device, the cable fits but it doesn't charge.
This could have happened without USB C too. If it used a barrel plug it would also be more likely to catch fire if you used the wrong one that fits.
> Again, explain that to my mom. how many watts? Is 60 enough? Ikea only has 45 watts, will that work? What is a watt? Why is it only 22 watts if she's also charging a phone?
60 is enough. 45 might work, but it might not, so only buy it if you can return it easily. [Note: Buying a third party non-USB charger for your laptop has the same flaws.] Watt is how much electricity. If you put two things on the same charger, they have to share.
> Of course laptop powerbanks existed before USB C, they gave out usually 19 volts and the guy at the store would install a proper connector to fit your laptop and you'd lose the others. You'd charge it with a charger that fit that powerbank and charged it, then charge the laptop with it.
I saw one ever in an ad. They were very niche and the average person didn't know they existed, at least around here.
> 18 watts.. will it charge the laptop? Won't it? Who knows.
If you want to be sure then go for 60.
> Now explain that to my mom.
It says to use the same order for either direction so I really doubt that actually matters. So here's the instructions for your mom: Plug it into a charger to charge it. Plug it into a phone or laptop to use it. The lights show how full it is.
> Yes, i know i'm complaining, but i live just far away from my parents, that it's a pain to sit into a car and drive all the way there to swap some adapters or chargers, or cables and label what goes where and for what it can be used... and debugging that over the phone is a pain.
And what I'm saying is that a lot of these issues are not unique to USB at all. And most of the rest can be solved by either using the chargers that came with a device or hiding/trashing the e-waste chargers you have and only using the good ones.
> The PD 2.0 spec came out two and a half years before samsung's first USB C phone. And the power brick that came with it wasn't USB C.
So what, there's a brick that does qc, and there a usb c connector on the other end. My mom plugs it in, it fits, and it doesn't charge.
> I'm not sure, but a 65 watt charger definitely would. "Get 65W for a laptop" isn't any harder than any other third party power supply for a laptop. Which is optional, you don't have to get a third party supply.
How would my mom know that? The cable fits.
> Her old laptop charger didn't have a second phone plug. If you don't want the complexity then don't use it.
So why does it fit if it doesn't work then? Why is the other plug there if it makes the first one stop working? Again, if you know what PD is, if you know what current is needed for what device, if you know the power needed to power and charge that device, and if you clearly mark everything so you don't use the wrong cable for the wrong device (since the bricks are behind the nightstand), "it just works". Normal people don't do that. Normal people buy something that fits. 45W, 65W who cares, ikea advertises it can charge a laptop, why would a phone prevent it from charging a laptop?
> Okay. To your mom: Every 60 watt or higher charger will work. That super cheap one is only 5. It can't do it.
SO which ones are 60W? There are 3 similarly looking ones behind the nightsand, they all fit. So she must buy different colored cables now too, or move the nightstand every night to check which cable goes where?
> If you want to be sure then go for 60.
But my powerbank has only 18watts. I already have it. Will it charge the laptop? Or won't it? Or will the laptop charge the powerbank and drain the internal battery even faster?
> And what I'm saying is that a lot of these issues are not unique to USB at all. And most of the rest can be solved by either using the chargers that came with a device or hiding/trashing the e-waste chargers you have and only using the good ones.
Those troubles didn't exist before usb C, because every device had a custom plug that only fit that device and charged it properly, there was basically no way to mess them up. Something like this ( https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/1/10/So... ) would only fit inside an ericsson phone and charge it.
And then everyone said "we're going usb C, one cable for everything", and my mom is happy! But hey, that old charger with usbA->C cable gives her a warning that her phone is charging slowly... it fits, but it doesn't work properly. Her earbuds charge on that cable but not on the ikea charger. Her ikea charger charges her laptop and her phone, but if her phone is plugged in, her laptop still shows the charging light, but the battery percentage is going down. The phone charger that she got with her new phone will charge her phone but won't charge her laptop. Her powerbank will charge from her old phone charger and her new phone charger, the led will be on, but it will take ages to charge from the old charger. Her powerbank will sometimes charge her laptop and sometimes her laptop will charge her powerbank, who knows when and how, the manual is in the trash.
Want to add data to this? Which of her existing usb-c cables will do data at what speed? usb2? usb3? Will it work for video? Thunderbolt?
Yes i know, I should go there, throw all the powerbricks in the trash, buy only 65 watt ones, buy only proper thunderbolt capable usb c cables, and mark have her charge her earphones on the pc with her usbA->C cable, but that's a waste of money and a lot of electronics in the trash for no good reason. If i did that a few years ago when PD became a thing, she'd have 18W chargers everywhere and i'd have to replace them again when she bought a laptop with usb C charging. And again, I could do that, because I know the tech behind all that, and can read voltages and currents... if i didn't, i wouldn't even know what to buy, i'd just go to ikea (she likes white powerbricks for some reason), and get whichever was available, probably the 45W one, because it has two ports instead of one on the 65 watt one.
Yep, we gained nothing from moving laptops and other high power devices into USB, instead of finishing the standardization of the barrel connector. Laptops chargers were already almost all compatible, and there is no reason to mix them with the low power devices.
Apple was a key developer of USB C and used its experience from developing lightning. They were also one of the first (if not the first) to sell USB C devices (2016 MacBook, then across the whole Mac line). I don’t know how much the EU affected their timeline; it’s unsurprising they moved to USB C on their biggest volume product last. And the lifespan of 30-pin and lightning were about the same.
This was a repeat for Apple: the first iMac was the first production USB computer and they were pilloried for that too.
And I have to say, the lightning connector itself is better than the usb-c connect in my opinion. I get that having the pins on the male* plug is a theoretical advantage in durability but that has not been my experience with usb-c connector durability on either end.
EDIT: usb-c has pins on the male plug. Which is what I meant. So female -> male.
> the lightning connector itself is better than the usb-c connect in my opinion. I get that having the pins on the male* plug is a theoretical advantage in durability but that has not been my experience with usb-c connector durability on either end.
I always end up picking a lot of dust out of my usb-c ports on my phones; or otherwise the port wears out and disconnects before charging completes. (Right after my wife entered the hospital in labor, I needed to scrounge around for something to clean out my phone's port because the "go" bag only had a wired charger and my phone wouldn't charge on it.)
It's why I went to a wireless charger for daily use.
---
I'm real curious why lightning never became the standard. Was Apple trying to keep it proprietary? Was there a half-hearted attempt to open it up or otherwise convince the Android ecosystem to use it?
> I'm real curious why lightning never became the standard.
Because it is bad. In any connection there are springs that keep the tension, which will eventually wear out. They can either be on the cheap replaceable cable, or in the receptacle that is hardwired into your expensive device.
> Why Micro types offer better durability? Accomplished by moving leaf-spring from the PCB receptacle to plug, the most-stressed part is now on the cable side of the connection. Inexpensive cable bears most wear instead of the µUSB device.
Definitely had an iPhone where the port was worn out and getting it to connect was difficult.
One reason is that Lightning couldn't do the faster speeds or extra modes like USB-C. There were USB3 and display adapters but they were sort of hacks. USB-C was used for MacBooks and iPad Pros. USB-C allows passive adapters to USB2 and USB3.
The advantage of Lightning here is there is a totally open port, so picking lint out of the port is substantially easier. With Type C you have to work around the 'tab' and it requires much much smaller tools.
I have not used lightning but I have found USB C to be much more fragile than USB A, although better than mini and micro. I would really rather have had evey thing be a few mm bigger and stick with A.
A USB-C successor (USB-D?) that's USB-A sized but with the added pins, reversibility, and bidirectionality of USB-C would be neat. But USB-C is “good enough” as a one-standard-to-rule-them-all that I don't think it'd be worth it unless there was a massive benefit (faster data transfer? beefier power lines? optical data lines?).
I've also had basically zero issue with Lightning connectors, but had a constant battle with USB-C of every kind to figure out what's charging, what's data, what's PD, and so much more hassle.
I don't get why Apple was forced to colonize by the EU when they had the market-leading connector in place for significantly longer than USB-C even existed.
"It's only USB2!" Does it have to support the faster USB3 speeds? Not really... we don't have to keep forcing everything to include the latest kitchen sink support.
If apple had made lightning an actual standard everyone was using then the eu might have chosen that instead.
But they didn't. Every single other company/device was using usb(c) and it probably wasn't because of some kind if irrational dislike of words starting with the letter L.
It was only 2.5 years between Apple's first device with Lightning (iPhone 5 in September 2012) and their first device with USB-C (12" Macbook in April 2015). It's not like Lightning had a huge track record at that point they just made a decision that they had switched connectors once and didn't want to turn around and do it again. Kind of understandable, but I'm glad to not have Lightning anymore.
Failure to have clear cable capability marking from the start is too bad though, if I needed a high speed USB cable longer than 6" (probably included with a hard drive enclosure or similar) I'm not sure if I own one, and if I do I have no idea which cable it is.
honestly, the lightning CONNECTOR was far better, but man, I really appreciate the standardization. We have one device on the house left using lightning (my wife's iPhone 13 mini) and .. well, I just wish they'd release a new mini, that's all.
