[andybak]

> For a $1T org like Amazon, these are distractions.

Until it creates enough bad press that it does move the dial.

That might sound unlikely but it can be death by 1000 cuts. I believe the groundswell of dislike for Google among the tech literate had it's roots in the Reader shutdown.

The tech literate advise friends and family - so their influence is higher than the raw numbers suggest.

You can burn good will but it's very difficult to get it back. Amazon are being criticized from multiple angles and it all adds up.

[iLoveOncall]

> I believe the groundswell of dislike for Google among the tech literate

You are in an echo-chamber.

There isn't much negative opinion of Google, Paypal, Stripe and other companies hated by HN commenters outside of HN, even in technical communities.

[frognumber]

Microsoft's stock price from 2000 to 2014 flat-lined. I believe much of that was due to Microsoft hatred. The tactics worked well when Microsoft had no real competition, and crushed fledgling competition early.

As soon as there was an alternative, everyone piled on.

There was an army trying to passively-aggressively harm Microsoft in everything it did, and it mattered. If there was ever a gray area where Microsoft wasn't the obvious choice, people decided the opposite way.

Google is gradually becoming the next Microsoft.

It's not even dislike, so much as well-founded distrust. Each time I've done business with Google, I came out behind for it at the end, because I was treated as a statistic. Google would gladly take out my business for their convenience if it didn't impact their bottom line. It wasn't malicious, like Microsoft, but just apathetic.

At this point, it's left behind enough victims among decision-makers that GCP is permanently kneecapped in the race with AWS, Azure, etc.

[iLoveOncall]

There is nothing in common to what you mention with Microsoft and Google.

Microsoft was the butt of the joke of literally everyone that had every used a computer. There were countless memes about how bad Windows was, made by people with 0 technical literacy. Your grandma had probably heard about Windows Vista sucking, despite not knowing what it was.

Almost nobody outside of HN has a similar experience with Google products.

You are in the same echo-chamber as the original commenter.

[heavyset_go]

> Almost nobody outside of HN has a similar experience with Google products.

YouTube's algorithm and recommendations are both memes and well analyzed in popular media, and people who have only ever used phones and iPads know to add "reddit" to their search terms to sort through the garbage Google would show them otherwise.

There are also office workers and consumers who have been burned by adopting Google services, like workplaces that adopted Google products for chat and voice/video, or by buying Nest products or investing in Stadia.

[frognumber]

> Almost nobody outside of HN has a similar experience with Google products.

This statement is imprecise. Youtube creators, for example, hold a similar view.

Grandma doesn't make decisions about what cloud platform to use, or where to host content. Among key decision-makers, distrust of Google is widespread.

Google will do fine in search (at least until / unless it's disrupted by Bing or DDG), Android, email, and in other consumer products. Where this will eventually kill Google is in B2B: GCP, Google Workspace, etc.

[iLoveOncall]

> Youtube creators, for example, hold a similar view

I think the fact that they are called "Youtube creators" and not "Video creators" highlights how weak the argument is.

[DougN7]

You seem to be a Google apologist. Just because a platform is currently the biggest and most dominant hardly means it has trust and love. YouTube is the Windows of video platforms.

[buran77]

Yes but an echo chamber as defined by GP, of tech literate people. So I lean towards agreeing with them that tech literate people are mostly starting to see the problem with "big tech", not just Google. The chamber is not just as small as HN. Regular users care less about this because they see the free service but even they are starting to be pushed away by hostile moves like retiring even paid services and products without reasonable justification or advance notice.

But there's no single problem that's a trigger for all, not everyone is upset about the same thing and I don't agree that Reader, or the NSA, or any other single issue singlehandedly turned everyone against Google or other tech companies. It's the whole environment, and different straws broke different camels' backs.

[7to2]

> You are in an echo-chamber.

Doesn't matter. An echo-chamber that your target demographic frequents can be just as damaging to your overall reputation if not more.

Source: Someone currently working in government IT procurement who is literally in charge of evaluating cloud-based products (hi, google!).

Also funny you mention Paypal and Stripe: At my last job, we chose to go with traditional payment processors in large part because of how frequent stories about Paypal and Stripe screwing legitimate companies pop up.

[anoncow]

The echo chamber can have an external impact at (sometimes) crucial times. For e.g. There can be a future scenario where Google struggles with its search business and other companies/general public do not invest in a new Google product just because people from this echo chamber advise them not to and highlight Google’s poor reputation in handling non-search products.

[b3lvedere]

I think the average consumer does not know and/or does not (have the time to) care about it. It's almost impossible for an average consumer to own a device where some huge corporation does not have its influences. Just like it is almost impossible not to use any Unilever product.

[heavyset_go]

Look at the consensus about Google when it comes up in the news or other articles posted to Reddit's most popular subreddits. It's not good. Then look at how technical subreddits talk about Google. It's even worse.

Even popular science and tech press is highly critical of Google, and no longer just publishes the company's press releases with gushing endorsement.

Back in like 2014, I agreed with your sentiment and even said the same thing myself. Back then, popular sentiment towards Google was very positive and there was a lot of excitement, but generally, the nerdier someone was when it came to computers, the more likely they were to be at least critical of Google if not hostile towards them.

Now it's different and people are looking at Google like they look at Facebook or Comcast.

[spaniard89277]

IDK in the US, here in Europe I have already a bunch of non tech friends who use Brave Browser, and/or some alternative to google search.

[sneak]

> I believe the groundswell of dislike for Google among the tech literate had it's roots in the Reader shutdown.

I disagree. I believe it was the "SSL added and removed here" NSA slide that showed that nothing stored with cloud providers is safe from government snooping without a warrant. It's not so much directed at Google as it is everything that is big enough to be on the tip of the surveillance state's tongue.

Nothing we store non-e2ee in the big public cloud services is safe from illegal warrantless wiretapping. It's not strictly Google's fault per se.

[slaw]

I don't think people care that much about privacy. Google started to encrypt traffic between data centers in 2013. Nobody cared.

[tsujamin]

It’s not as if their network architecture or threat models were put on billboards prior to that..

[slaw]

It was on white hat conference in 2004. For 9 years nobody cared.