[StevenWaterman]

There is one benefit - you can update the UI of a car with a touchscreen but not one with buttons. Tesla's first touchscreen [1] now looks slightly dated, but they're able to just update the entire fleet.

No doubt it'll get to the point where you can't update it any more - either due to hardware incompatibility, lack of processing power, or some new technology being added. But it has meant that a 2013 Model S looks more modern today than it would have otherwise.

Equally, tech tends to look dated much faster than physical buttons do. It's too early to really say which has more long-lasting appeal.

[1] https://youtu.be/TZ0HsN-tblo?t=124

[grishka]

Updatability is not a good thing. I want my UIs to never change without a good reason, and there can't be a good reason to change car controls.

[jrockway]

The change is important during product development, though. I think touch screens are a reaction to PMs at car companies wanting to make last-minute changes, and being told "no, we already spent 10 million dollars on the injection molds". Put it in software, then your lazy engineers just have to stay late for a month. And if they don't finish in time, hey, just fake it in Photoshop for the ads and update the UI later!

[grishka]

I feel like the contribution of project managers to the humanity is net negative. UIs, whether on screens or as hardware controls, need to be built to suit the human body and to not require thinking to operate once one develops muscle memory. Every other concern — including aesthetics — is secondary. Touchscreens in cars are very contrary to that because they require visual feedback.

[twic]

> there can't be a good reason to change car controls

"UI revision 1.23: move the Passenger Seat Blender switch further away from the air conditioning controls"

[HidyBush]

>you can update the UI of a car with a touchscreen but not one with buttons

A car is a dependable tool. Changing the UI during a car's lifetime is dangerous and unprofessional. I'd say the same is true for smartphones and computers but I guess the majority of people think of them as simple "cool entertainment devices"

[jen20]

Speak for yourself. My car gained the ability to display directions from CarPlay in the heads-up display overnight, while parked in my garage, increasing the value to me massively.

[rad_gruchalski]

A feature has been added. Has anything changed, though...

[jen20]

Sure, lots of things. No regressions I’ve noticed…

[throwaway98797]

let’s never improve, let’s bifurcate development to support old systems

this is a unproductive conservative attitude

no I won’t get off your lawn

I’ve been burned by changing UIs but it’s the price we pay for progress

[HidyBush]

>unproductive

tell me more about how updating your car's UI overnight can make you more productive

[throwaway98797]

my point was broader, any one update won’t make you productive it will be likely be regressive

all updates taking together will allow for progress

[donatj]

Progress for progress sake is worse than worthless, and in the case here it’s distracting and dangerous. If it ain’t broke don’t fix it.

[WickyNilliams]

Not all movement is progress

[Silhouette]

There is one benefit - you can update the UI of a car with a touchscreen but not one with buttons.

This is a bug, not a feature.

If I'm driving then I'm driving. I want any non-driving controls to be as simple, consistent and reliable as possible. I don't want any non-essential controls at all. I don't want anything I might want to use while driving that requires me to take my eyes off the road at all. I couldn't care less what some flashy touchscreen UI looks like because I should never have to look at it.

The physical controls on the dash of every vehicle I drive regularly still work as well and feel as comfortable to use as they ever did. In some cases those vehicles are over a decade old. I'll take that over the modern touchscreen junk any day.

[dncornholio]

I've never been in my car and thought the buttons could use an update.. It's hardly something that you should trade safety for.

[mizzack]

Just waiting for the day some enterprising MBA decides it's a good idea to add ads.

[Cthulhu_]

I've seen ads show up on a (analog) radio's display a long time ago already, it'll be coming soon enough.

[datavirtue]

Already in the works.

[kylecordes]

It's interesting to see a parade of people object to the updatability.

Sure, on a minute-to-minute timescale, anyone must obviously agree.

But over the long term of owning a car, it is an immensely valuable feature. My 2018 car still feels quite new and fresh - much less reason to replace it than if it were falling behind.

[bsagdiyev]

It absolutely is not. I do not want my 2 ton moving vehicle updated on a whim. My 2019 has a screen I can never really turn off that is bright at night, my 2008 has a slow laggy UI that an update will never fix. The 2000 Miata sitting in my garage has the best interface of them all. Push buttons and dials for climate control, two window switches in the middle tombstone area and that's really it outside the typical steering wheel controls for signals, lights and windshield wipers. It's amazingly simple and should continue working even when my newer cars are dead and gone.

[bsagdiyev]

Since I cannot directly reply to you (ajconway) -- this is thoroughly untrue. Tesla does it at the very least and I'm aware that is becoming a "feature" offered in other vehicles now too.

[macintux]

If you click/tap on the time stamp next to a message you reach a dedicated page where you can reply (same thing I had to do to reply to yours at this conversation depth).

[bsagdiyev]

Well what do you know, TIL. Thank you!

[datavirtue]

I always marveled at the competence and refinement of automotive interfaces...they killed that shit.

[ajconway]

> I do not want my 2 ton moving vehicle updated on a whim.

The car won't update itself, so:

1. Ignore any updates as they become available.

2. Problem solved.

[MereInterest]

For devices that connect to the internet, such as for updating maps and real-time traffic data, does the lack of security updates mean that your 2-ton moving vehicle is now somebody else's 2-ton moving vehicle?

[pjmorris]

Which is actually an argument for non-updatability.

[MereInterest]

Completely agreed. Mainly, I wanted to make a distinction between "cannot be updated" and "can be updated but isn't". The former is a design choice that removes entire classes of vulnerabilities. The latter is a usage choice that keeps vulnerabilities open.

[darkwater]

I'm with you on this, I do understand people not wanting the extra cognitive load to learn new changes in the UX but as a tinkerer I really love that my car can get OTA updates that add/changes features. Actually many (most of?) Tesla owners have a Tesla also for this reason. Source: lurking in Tesla owners forums/groups.

[gjm11]

You'd buy a new car because the UI feels a bit dated?

[nordsieck]

> You'd buy a new car because the UI feels a bit dated?

There's a substantial group of people who lease cars, and just get a new car after the lease is up. For that group of people, that's probably a substantial reason along with the exterior styling.

[lupire]

The main reason for leasing cars is (a) wanting to prove how rich they are, and (b) being irrationally afraid of maintenance.

[kylecordes]

Not with any urgency of course; it's one factor among many. We have a 2015 car that feels like 2005, and a 2018 car that feels like 2022. The terrible map/etc. experience will certainly be a motivator when replacing - and makes old car worth much less on the used market than one that updates.