[grog454]

I agreed with your first sentence but not the rest. It's not a problem because pain is not inherently a problem.

Yes it's going to hurt to find out someone doesn't want to go through with plans. It's going to hurt even more to find out they really don't enjoy your company as much as you thought they did, or as much as you do theirs. But how is keeping your head buried in the sand going to be more beneficial in the long run?

[thrwy_ywrht]

>It's going to hurt even more to find out they really don't enjoy your company as much as you thought they did

This is the crux of the issue. There are many people who often feel like cancelling on plans, but it is absolutely not because they don't enjoy their friends' company. It might be because they have a mood disorder, or chronic fatigue, or social anxiety, etc etc. The whole reason someone might want an app that lets you cancel on plans, but only if the other person also wants to cancel, is because it's almost impossible to express this feeling to someone without that person drawing the conclusion, to some degree, that you enjoy their company less than they thought.

If you genuinely don't enjoy spending time with someone, that's a much easier problem to solve.

[jonahx]

>is because it's almost impossible to express this feeling to someone without that person drawing the conclusion, to some degree, that you enjoy their company less than they thought.

Not only is it not "almost impossible" -- it's easy. Especially if you have a reputation for being honest.

"Listen, I am feeling like shit right now, and won't have fun if we go out. It's got nothing to do with you. Can we reschedule?"

[mitchdoogle]

By the author's metric, I think this statement would be "Active" if it were an honest statement, i.e. you're actually sick, but it would be "Avoidant" if it is deceptive

[librish]

The problem is that this is what people say even when it does have something to do with you.

[jonahx]

I mean, in the same sense that it's "a problem" when a con man gives the same pitch as a trustworthy salesman.

The solution isn't for the trustworthy to stop honestly describing their products. It's to gain a reputation for honesty.

Also, you'll the know the truth from the context of your overall relationship, or, if that is thin, when they do actually reschedule.

[librish]

Yes but empirically the chance of someone rescheduling is low.

[mgfist]

So? It's not your responsibility for someone else's insecurity - and in fact, if you stop to assume that they think this way, you'll find that they 9/10 times do not.

[librish]

I'm not sure how responsibility plays in. Being bluntly honest lowers your chance of making friends, in my experience.

[nkrisc]

You can't control what other people think about you. Better to just tell the truth instead of trying to shape their opinion of you.

[bumby]

>The whole reason someone might want an app that lets you cancel on plans

I know this is HN where we are probably all biased towards creating software solutions, but do you really think software is the right lever to this problem?

The root cause is that people don't feel psychologically safe enough to voice their wish to cancel. I don't know that an app really helps that, it just provides an escape hatch. I'd much rather a person say to me, "Look, it's nothing about you, but I struggle with social anxiety and it's getting the best of me right now and need to cancel." Not only would that give me greater compassion for what they're going through, it would also help tailor future outings to alleviate that. Just having a "cancel matching" app won't do anything to foster that kind of growth.

To me this feels like one of those distinctions between "can" and "should" in tech.

[Dylan16807]

> I know this is HN where we are probably all biased towards creating software solutions, but do you really think software is the right lever to this problem?

I'm not sure how you got that impression from that sentence, especially because the word "want" was emphasized.

[bumby]

I'm sorry, I'm not following. I'm assuming someone would want something because they feel like it's a solution to their problem. In this case, I'm saying I think software is the wrong "solution" because it just treats the symptom (get me out of this obligation) and not the underlying cause (provide psychological trust). Did you interpret the sentence differently?

[Dylan16807]

They want the supposed benefit. That doesn't mean they think the mechanism is correct, or even that any mechanism could actually do it in a non-abstract way.

[bumby]

That's kinda the point of the last sentence in the my original comment. People may desire an app that optimizes their ability to connect with drug dealers. It's certainly possible from a technical standpoint. It doesn't mean it's a good idea.

Likewise an app that allows you easily bail on social engagements guilt-free through minimized interactions is probably not a good idea because those interactions are exactly how you build the trust that's the root cause of the guilt in the first place.

Maybe we're miscommunicating. I'm not implying the software solution exists, just that that desire for such an app may be misplaced.

[em-bee]

if you cancel without telling me why then i am even more likely to draw the (wrong) conclusion. and if you, and if i wanted to cancel too, then i am still going to wonder why you wanted to cancel. the only way to avoid misinterpretation is to state the reason outright.

[Dylan16807]

Giving a reason could be part of the process.

[steinuil]

I'm depressive and have social anxiety and I still found that forcing myself to attend these social situations instead of bailing and staying home for "self-care" almost always improved my mood and made me feel happy that I went at the end. If you have a more serious medical condition that makes you physically unable to go anywhere that's another matter, but I'm guessing lots of people (just as I did) use less serious mood disorders as excuses to, as the OP put it, be a baby.

[alar44]

> It might be because they have a mood disorder, or chronic fatigue, or social anxiety, etc etc.

This is a babies excuse. If you're an adult, you should be actively dealing with this. However, it has become fashionable to wear a psychological condition on your sleeve. People who use this as an excuse have likely never been diagnosed and probably aren't even trying to deal with it. Either way, those are their battles, and if it means they are flaky, we just won't be friends. I've done the hard work to get myself out of a social anxiety disorder and can easily tell who actually has similar issues and those who are just lazy flakes.

[neogodless]

I always found the "Boundaries" (Henry Cloud) distinction here very useful.

It's OK to "hurt" someone - that is, if you are communicating the truth, your boundaries, your needs, you may hurt someone.

It's not OK to "harm" someone - that is, you do intentional/lasting damage to them through your actions. (My wording is not nearly as on point as the original author, but I hope you get the gist.)

Here's a snippet:

https://www.goodreads.com/quotes/654449-there-is-a-big-diffe...

[jonahx]

We're saying the same thing.