[niyazpk]

IMO while Microsoft and Google should work together to solve this as soon as possible, the longer term solution should not involve Microsoft. This sounds like something Google should fix at their end.

No customization done by the user, including installation of apps should prevent a user from being able to call 911, period.

[derekp7]

The post said that it is also being addressed in a platform update on Jan 4th..

[ok_dad]

Awesome for people who have pixels that no longer get updates... Like me and my family. Now I have to buy new phones?!

[bb88]

That's actually a real issue that needs addressing. Any phone that makes 911 calls should still get security updates. All phones that can reach the cell network can still make 911 calls per FCC requirement.

Imagine the worse case scenario where malware infects the phone but requires a credit card to call 911.

Maybe congress will get around to this to make Google and everyone else do the right thing, but from my perspective Google should have done the right thing here.

[earthscienceman]

Worst case scenario? Sounds like best case scenario to me so long as no one is harmed.

It will take some horribly idiotic event like that to get the manufacturers to actually address that when you sell a phone you're selling hardware and software.

[Dylan16807]

> Worst case scenario? Sounds like best case scenario to me so long as no one is harmed.

It's hard to see how that wouldn't cause some ugly delays, so yes people will be harmed.

[bb88]

Sadly, yes. Though it's already happening, just not in that vile of a situation. Yet.

[onion2k]

If Google are concerned they could fix it more easily that a software update for older, unsupported phones - they could just mark every app that registers itself as a third party dialer as incompatible with older Pixel devices in the Play Store, and remotely remove them from Pixel phones presumably. It'd be a bit "user hostile" but you have to remember that you don't really control the code on your phone if you use Google services, so it's entirely possible for them to act this way.

[CuriousCosmic]

The thing I think people are missing is that the response from Google indicates that this isn't a Pixel issue. This is a "all android phones on Android 10+" issue.

Without full cooperation from manufacturers, there's really not a lot that can be done outside of blacklisting all dialer apps on the Play store and even that would do little for anything already installed.

[bb88]

I think you miss the point here. Security updates for phones need to be longer than 3 years -- for that reason.

The pixel 2 is already EOL'd 4 years after it's release, but it can still make 911 calls. I believe there are people that still depend upon that phone to make phone calls -- and therefore need 911 when they need it.

[bb88]

Yes, but I think the issue I see is that all exploits that gain root post-EOL could then interfere with dialing, right?

It's not just some bad-app on the play store (though that is one approach I believe google could use).

It's the fact that the android OS is EOL after 3 years, and the user is still using it as his main phone -- and needs 911 services.

[onion2k]

EOL does mean something. I don't believe 3 years is long enough personally, but even if it was 10 years the same problem would exist, just for older phones. Then it becomes a semantic argument about where phones should ever have an EOL date for critical fixes.

I think Google would argue that malware interfering with your phone after its EOL date is a reason why you should upgrade your phone to a newer model rather than use that as a reason to extend the life of their phone software indefinitely.

[yjftsjthsd-h]

What would you like them to do? Google couldn't retroactively make it possible to patch every phone on the planet even if they wanted to, and the phone manufacturers aren't likely to treat this as any more special than the other bugs that they aren't patching

[AlotOfReading]

Well, I'd expect them to bring the phones into compliance with the law. Quoting section 22.921:

> Mobile telephones manufactured after February 13, 2000... must incorporate a special procedure for processing 911 calls. Such procedure must recognize when a 911 call is made and, at such time, must override any programming in the mobile unit that determines the handling of a non-911 call...

If a phone can't access 911, it's not legal. Frankly, it's an indictment of the system architects that this bug is possible at all.

[eertami]

But what if I as the user install software on my phone that isn't capable of calling 911?

I own the phone and I am able to install whatever software and whatever operating system I like. I don't want it to seem like I'm defending Google here, but should manufacturers really be responsible for the software someone installs on their portable computer?

[AlotOfReading]

Moreso than most, this regulation is written in blood. The reason this and other FCC 911 rules came about was that there were numerous cases of people trying to call 911 and failing due to software "issues". The FCC said enough and mandated that if it were possible to complete a call, the phone is required to.

Installing your own OS that intentionally doesn't support 911 handling would be in the "not possible" category just like a user who cut their antenna. For anything less than that, Google (and other manufacturers) are absolutely responsible for ensuring the 911 code path can't be disrupted. People have literally died from this.

[encryptluks2]

So you are advocating to put anyone who has a rooted phone that doesn't get this dumb update to fix an issue with Microsoft Teams in jail?

Seriously, this sounds like a Teams issues. Google does by default incorporate what is required and it isn't until Teams takes permission from the phone app that an issue even occurs.

[chrisjc]

I don't think anyone is expecting google to patch every phone on the planet (assuming you mean every android device ever released). But they should be able to patch every phone of theirs including every old pixel and nexus.

And if they can't, they should make it clear to the user/owner that their phone isn't supported and that means that their lives or the lives of others could be in jeopardy as a result. In fact, perhaps their phones should have an expiration date and should just stop working after sometime. Or at least disable critical functionality that their required to be in compliance with (FCC regulations) since they've decided to no longer support the device. Moreover, this date and timeline should be clear from the point in time when you purchase the device.

Of course this could all be done by the network providers only allowing supported devices on their network, but we all know how that would end up.

This isn't just some bug, and if google wants to participate and be taken seriously in this industry, they should stand by their products and customers.

[mdoms]

If they can determine that any phone in usage today running Android software may be prone to this bug they should issue an immediate recall on all devices. That's likely to be almost every Android device purchased in the past couple of years. This scale of recall is not without precedent.

[ok_dad]

I have a Google pixel 2xl, I guess I assumed people would get that I had a Google phone from the fact that I said I had a pixel...

[yjftsjthsd-h]

Oh, sorry; I missed that and thought we were talking the general case. Yes, if Google is the OS and hardware vendor then they're out of excuses.

[vanviegen]

Isn't patching already possible through Play Services updates?

[zibzab]

Yes, Google have been able to patch some system components via the store för some years now.

And this is an app issue anyway (Microsoft teams).

[r0m4n0]

I wouldn’t jump to conclusions before we fully understand what’s happening. Maybe this issue was introduced in the latest version of android (that would be my guess seeing that it was just discovered) thus fixing it in a patch release on that version would fix it for everyone. You with an older pixel have nothing to worry about because you couldn’t update to this version anyhow.

[zibzab]

What are your talking about???

1. This is _mainly_ an app issue (Teams). It will be fixed via the store.

2. It affects very few people (installed teams but not logged in).

3. There is already a workaround (just reinstall the app)

4. Google has in past patched even older devices in case of a serious problem or vulnerability.

[kevin_thibedeau]

Not to worry. That was all solved with project Treble.

[joenathanone]

Those phones are just a little more dangerous to own

[nayaketo]

Yeah.

[millzlane]

The workaround is to uninstall teams. I'm not having the issue though.

[lvs]

Can you imagine how many millions... perhaps billions of phones will never see this update? Regulators have to take action on this.

[agilob]

It would also be quite cool is 3rd party apps didn't need and use permissions like "listen to who am I calling". Why a chat/online calling application even need that? Only to collect metadata about their users?