[bwang29]

I used to work in boutique audio retail. One of the big challenges of the business is how big and heavy good speakers are. In the old days we would need to crate the speaker to customers’ house for audition as every room has a different acoustic, and try a few different speakers with more crates with a upfront fee/credit to purchase, but it doesn’t happen nearly as often anymore. Showrooms nowadays also mostly do not have the right environment and setup for the speakers to perform well as they were before. In fact most people do not have an opportunity to listen to half decent audio from a heavy passive speaker and the type of sound they could make relative to homepods is becoming more of a myth now. And the direct implication of this is speaker makers need to make more profit per sale and the price increase for Klipsch Heresy and Forte for each revision is bananas. There are still software company making solutions to emulate speaker sounds before a purchase calibrated to common headphone models, I don’t know how they function but every customer who’d tried one of those would walk away for almost certainty as it sounds crappy.

[ninjaoxygen]

I work in high-end AV. Perceptually, in a good space, those fantastic speakers often do not make the sound people associate with "loud", no distortion, no top end becoming hissy, just the concert-level bass to clue you in to how loud it is. People who have paid a lot for their system want that "wow" factor that immediately makes anyone think it's loud. The other issue is that different listening material definitely needs different amplifier and processor settings - there is no setting that "just works". We find many customers do not wish to get engage with those settings these days.

[bayindirh]

As an audiophile (without the madness), I can understand you. On the other hand, with a pair of good speakers and a nice amplifier with bass, mid & treble knobs, you can almost dial the tone which's best for a genre.

A 2x10 band eq is better, but I prefer to listen pure-flat instead. In my setup, only vinyl needs loudness + tone circuits, the rest is happy with pure flat.

Of course music and sound is a subjective taste, but 90% of the road can be traveled with just basic, but good components IMHO.

[JohnBooty]

    but 90% of the road can be traveled with just 
    basic, but good components IMHO. 

Amen. No expert here but I've been in the hobby for a while and have demo'd some high end stuff at audio shows.

I strongly believe a really good "90% of the way there" system can be put together for well under $500 retail, or even less if going DIY or used.

[bayindirh]

High end stuff has no limits, there's always a better system in some feature/property. Also, when you start to upgrade something, there's chance of endless loops (these speakers needs better amps, which shows some defects of my DAC, etc.)

So setting a limit, reaching it and leaving it there is good IMHO.

I run an entry level HiFi CD player with iPod interface through a vintage amplifier to a pair of bookshelf style speakers (which are pretty big for their class though).

If my friend is confusing whether his phone is ringing because a similar sound is present in the playing track, then it's good enough. Similarly, if you're enjoying the sound you're getting from your system, you've accomplished your goal IMHO.

I'm neither looking for loudness, nor for that ethereal sound. If I can hear everything in relatively clear manner, and I'm enjoying it, that's it. I'd rather enjoy it instead of sweating over smallest details.

For context: I used to play in orchestras.

[growt]

Can you give an example of such a <$500 system? I'm genuinely curious.

[dagw]

Lots and lots of variations. But basically get a $250-350 pair of speakers for a decent brand (Dali Spektor 1 or 2 are a good bet) and plug them into a $100-200 second hand amp and you've got a great set up. If you don't want to go second hand then Yamaha and Sony have some decent amps in this price range.

Spend whatever you have left over on a second hand CD player or DAC for your phone, depending on what you want to use as a source.

[JohnBooty]

JBL 305 + 310S matching subwoofer will measure impeccably and play nearly full range with strong bass down to 27ish hz. Would have to catch some sale prices around black friday or some such.

Or this excellent DIY kit and basically, any solid 50-100W ish amp. Might push you up to more like $600. But you get the idea.

https://www.parts-express.com/Amiga-MT-Tower-Speaker-Kit-Wit...

I have a generally very high opinion of Wirecutter's bookshelf speaker and receiver recommendations - any recommended receiver and any recommended bookshelf speaker, basically. Although, most retail bookshelf speakers in this range might be more like an 80% experience not 90% lol.

https://www.nytimes.com/wirecutter/electronics/audio/

Another thing you can do for a very legitimate hi fi experience on a budget is to turn modest speakers into excellent performers with DSP EQ. Either automatically with a receiver that has e.g. Audyssey auto correction or with a MiniDSP etc.

Audio reproduction is, well, signal reproduction/amplification. Whether a driver produces objectively correct sound via excellence in physical driver construction and engineering, or via a DSP assist, makes little difference.

[KozmoNau7]

Mine is a bit more expensive, since I bought the speakers new (I had somewhat specific demands), but everything else was second-hand.

I've got a pair of Monitor Audio Bronze 2s, a Denon AVR-1911 receiver and two Dali SWA 12 subwoofers.

As I wrote above, I bought the speakers new, because I wanted relatively large bookshelf speakers with front ports and living room-friendly looks, and nothing presented itself second-hand. With a bit of patience, you should be able to find a solid pair of speakers in mint condition for $2-300, no problem.

The receiver has 90W per channel (for real, no tricks), Audyssey room correction and was just $80 second hand from a guy who had upgraded to a 4K-capable receiver. I have it hooked up to my TV and so on, but at that price I would be perfectly happy just using it as a stereo amp, since it has good power, digital inputs, room correction and bass management for subwoofers.

The subwoofers were ~$200 each second hand, years and years ago. I'm sure they're even less expensive now, or you can just do without subs.

[doteka]

I’m rather happy with my el cheapo Denon receiver (no idea about the model but like 220 euro new 5 years ago) and a pair of Wharfedale Diamonds 10.1 .

[antihero]

Couple of JBL 306PII active monitors

[bayindirh]

I also use HifiBerry's AMP2 to drive a pair of old Kenwood speakers with a dedicated subwoofer (it's a 2.1 set out of the box), and boy, that thing's impressive for its size.

It has a Burr Brown DAC and a Class D 2x30W amplifier on board. It has delicious sound.

[sound1]

... with a decent <100$ DAC like Khadas tone board

[newdude116]

Hm. I have a very old German Tube Amplifier (K+H) from my grandfather and some USSR made speakers (Radiotehnika Audio - GoldLine 90, 30kg each).

But this system would cost you know 1-2k. But I was lucky and bought the speakers for 100 USD not long ago.

[zadler]

Curious to know what you would recommend sub $500.

[Philip-J-Fry]

On the topic of speakers here, does anyone here feel like the Cinema does not offer the audio experience advertised? I've been to old cinemas and brand new cinemas with Dolby Atmos yet in each of them the audio is just absolute ass. Is this just my local cinemas or is this a common experience?

You'd think that a cinema would know how to tune their speaker set up correctly. Yet even at a brand new cinema the audio is just blown out in loud scenes. Like they've got the speakers turned up too high.

[KozmoNau7]

A well put-together powerful system with low distortion is quite an experience when you really crank the volume. It just gets bigger and bigger sounding but not really "loud" (ie. distorted), and loud clean sound is just a lot more satisfying and less fatiguing.

It's all about headroom, dynamics and being able to move air. Audiophiles may laugh, but a speaker like the Cerwin-Vega XLS215 one of the best choices you can make for reasonably affordable speakers, provided you have the room for them. They do look somewhat low-rent, but CV have taken some important lessons from PA speakers to heart, so they're surprisingly efficient and have large drivers that can effortlessly move significant amounts of air. Combine them with a powerful amplifier with plenty of headroom and you have a setup that can handle serious dynamics with very low distortion, better than 99% of concerts I've attended[¤].

For an actual PA speaker that can do much of the same thing, the JBL SRX835 is a similar powerhouse, but it has horn-loaded midrange and tweeter drivers, for those who prefer that sound. They are also effortlessly dynamic and I want a pair for my living room, despite the very utilitarian looks.

Unfortunately logistics and space constraints mean bookshelf speakers are the only practical setup in this apartment, so I picked ones that were as big as I could reasonably get away with, and supplement them with two reasonably well-hidden 12" subwoofers. I should have never sold my JBL 4410s, I'm sure I could have made space for them somehow.

[¤] The best sound quality I have ever heard at a concert and honestly better than most home setups, was when Opeth played in DR Koncerthuset here in Copenhagen in 2016. The sound is always insanely good there, but the combination of prog metal, an outrageously well-designed acoustic space, a seriously impressive sound system and world-class people behind the scenes, elevated everything to a completely new level.

It was the cleanest and most pristine amplified sound I have ever heard, and what really impressed me was how clean and deep the bass reproduction was, with absolutely no distortion or wooliness. It is my measuring stick that all other concerts are compared to.

[smichel17]

As a very, very casual audiophile, I don't personally feel the need for new models all that much. I don't go crazy trying to fit speakers to rooms — that's going to change over time! So I'd put the speaker in whatever location sounds the best in that house, and I'm happy with that.

I like the sound of old 60's-70's acoustic suspension speakers with large (11-12") woofers. In particular, I find them to produce a much more satisfying deep bass when played at low volumes. I won't say they're "the best", since I haven't had the chance to listen to much modern high-end equipment, but certainly they're good enough for me to be happy with. Currently listening on a pair of 1970 Advents (OLA), for the curious.

I appreciate that passive speakers are nice. I prefer listening on the Polk T15's I own over the desktop speakers I have, a logitech Z323 paired with the subwoofer from a Z-2300, despite the superior bass of the latter.

Anyway, my point is that I don't personally need all that much (expensive) innovation; I'd be pretty satisfied if these companies wanted to produce product lines that already exist (or bring back older designs, which are increasingly more expensive/difficult to find, these days. I admit to ignorance here, and I get that solid wood is expensive, but I have difficulty understanding why this type of speaker can't be manufactured and sold at a couple hundred bucks a pop, vs several thousands for the models the grandparent comment mentioned.

[Cthulhu_]

That reminds me of an Experience I had once at a former colleague. He was a bit of an audiophile, dj/producer and had e.g. added more insulation to his living room to not annoy the neighbours as much, and built his own speakers and record player.

Anyway, something was playing, it was (sounded?) really quiet but it was crystal clear at the same time; normally I feel like I have to turn the volume up to hear the whole music.

[Gauge_Irrahphe]

Bass distortion is the only big factor. Everybody knows it doesn't matter, but it's actually where distortion is the easiest to hear. Chinese manufacturers don't know, and do care, so even cheap USB speakers blow out of water the majority of even much more expensive products.

[DenTheRed]

Do you have an example of some of these cheap USB speakers please?

[Gauge_Irrahphe]

https://a.aliexpress.com/_m0XS3Zr

They are a bit underpowered, rumble with Bluetooth, and you need to turn the bass and highs quite a bit down to make them sound flat, but I bet that something like 100x times more expensive studio speakers will be the cheapest setup that matches them in the clarity.

[KozmoNau7]

I have a hard time taking your recommendation seriously, unless you have never heard a good set of speakers in person.

A pair of JBL 305P MkIIs will absolutely wipe the floor with discount speakers like those, with such a huge margin, that it's not even remotely fair.

$300 for a pair, certain a lot less than 100x price difference.

[Gauge_Irrahphe]

You have not heard those, they absolutely do sound more precise than cheap studio monitors. I think they may actually be flat with both bass and treble all the way down, but then they just don't sound like loudspeakers at all.

[StavrosK]

Speaker emulation sounds weird, it'd either make speakers useless right away, or it would be impossible to do. Sounds like a risky business.