[yazaddaruvala]

And there is nothing stopping Epic from releasing Fortnite on the iPhone (in-fact it was there for years).

The rules could be unfair[1] but this issue is just Epic not wanting to follow the rules to make some more money.

[1] We can discuss what a fair price/percentage should be. Arguably the market and Apple customers have decided 30% is fair, but we can discuss. Meanwhile, side-loading or not charging would make my iPhone experience worse.

[aaomidi]

Well the unfair part is what is being discussed. So ignoring that would be ignoring the whole point of this.

[yazaddaruvala]

My conversation with you was entirely about "the iPhone being a general purpose computer".

It seems we have both settled that either an iPhone is not general purpose, or all consoles, TVs or IOT devices with downloadable content are general purpose devices.

If you'd like we can now start discussing if the price Apple charges is fair.

I've already stated, the market decides to buy iPhones understanding (even appreciating) that the user cannot side-load non-Apple approved apps (other than through a less trusted channel i.e. the browser). As such the market through demand, has decided there is a niche ecosystem where 30% fees for in app purchases are appropriate and fair.

What are your thoughts?

[aaomidi]

Sure make them general computers too. I would rather have all of these devices give more choices to users.

However the current focus is on Apple due to their size.

[yazaddaruvala]

I'll reiterate:

I've already stated, the market decides to buy iPhones understanding (even appreciating) that the user cannot side-load non-Apple approved apps (other than through a less trusted channel i.e. the browser). As such the market through demand, has decided there is a niche ecosystem where 30% fees for in app purchases are appropriate and fair.

Why is this market dynamic an issue given there are so many games and tons of competition on and off iOS?

[bredren]

Just cause you both bridged from my comment, first thanks.

But I disagree that consumers agree to 30% because they continue to buy expecting sideloading to be relegated from relevancy.

If polled, I doubt consumers would guess the royalty is even that high. Someone should run a survey.

I am in general, very favorable toward Apple as a company. I’ve commented before that I believe in the company’s stance toward privacy. I see Apple as a benevolent dictator in its continued security restrictions on MacOS. With some exception to his deference to Trump, I admire Tim Cook as he presents himself as a person.

However, I have also sold apps through the App Store.

And there’s no real way around Apple’s massive financial success. It’s so big, if it were a person they would be burned at the stake.

There is an upper bound on reasonable net income.

This isn’t even about tax revenue, it is about any developer getting more than 70 cents on the dollar for their work.

Getting an app into the App Store barely means anything; you have to market it. Sure it is “safe” and incredibly easy to install. But good luck thinking that because you see a Ready For Sale message your app is going to be a hit.

In my experience, Apple is snobbish in interaction with developers.

At least historically, there is very little goodwill, even when Apple magically decides to “feature“ your work. Which is again self-serving because they take their cut regardless.

I am having a hard time defending Apple’s rate. Not because of Epic but because of someone like me who wants to sell software on the best (and only other serious) mobile platform.

[yazaddaruvala]

> If polled, I doubt consumers would guess the royalty is even that high. Someone should run a survey.

This is definitely the right mental model. I am fully onboard for more data.

However, to clarify my previous point when I said "customers agree" I meant customers understand and are generally accepting of "priced in" convenience. For example, in some convenience stores they offer a discount for using cash or debit. Most big stores tho, "price in the cost of credit transactions". Customers understand this and are happy for the convenience and happy for the points.

With the Apple store, digital goods are 30% more expensive, and seemingly customers are ok with it because they are making purchases, while getting the conveniences of the AppStore vetting, refunds process, permissions model, advertising model, privacy, etc.