[yoav]

The US is an oppressive surveillance state with regular police murdering minorities, rampant white supremacy, and when not in the middle of catastrophically mishandling a pandemic, has a mass shooting every day of the year.

To most people outside the US’s branding sway there’s very little difference between a USA and a Russia or China

[almost_usual]

Also a country where millions of people from different backgrounds, religions, and races will unite and march for the justice of minorities. Will outright challenge authority in the street and march until negotiations are made during a pandemic.

This does not happen in China or Russia.

[Barrin92]

>where millions of people from different backgrounds, religions, and races will unite and march for the justice of minorities

but mostly to act it out as performance art because people have been marching for decades now and yet here we are. The US is the only country that kind of lives in a permanent television version of itself, with people setting trashcans on fire for justice or throwing a window in, while a few dozen journalists capture some very authentic images[1]

People in Russia or China are realistic enough to know that this is in itself nothing but entertainment. The US is in a sense the most advanced security state on the planet, because pretty much nobody else has manged to internalize its own opposition to that degree.

[1]https://i.redd.it/xqrhsj17wb321.jpg

[yoav]

Millions of people risking their lives to beg the government to stop murdering people and police engaging in widespread violent crackdown against those people demonstrating is exactly what happens in those countries.

I don’t know how systematic police murder and beating up peaceful protestors looks different to you when it happens in the US and when it happens elsewhere.

What is it about the anthem or flag that makes you see it differently?

Look at Hong Kong protests, then look at police beating people in cities across the US it’s the same.

What are the concessions from the US government? A few minor police reforms to encourage cops to stop killing minorities on camera, qualified immunity is still here, so basically nothing.

At least China and Russia consider healthcare a human right like any developed country. The US health care system is depraved.

[hkmaxpro]

> Look at Hong Kong protests, then look at police beating people in cities across the US it’s the same.

> What are the concessions from the US government? A few minor police reforms to encourage cops to stop killing minorities on camera, qualified immunity is still here, so basically nothing.

US’s reaction is hugely different than HK’s.

Not a single HK cop was actually penalized, let alone fired or charged, for their misconducts during the year long protests. The only HK cop that was charged was the one who posted posters criticizing the police force. [1]

By contrast, numerous US cops were fired and charged. Not to mention two weeks before George Floyd was killed, a South Asian was also killed by HK cops by kneeing on his neck. [2] The victim’s name wasn’t made public, not a single HK cop was penalized, and they went on to keep doing the same to HK protesters a month later (no casualty this time) [3].

Disbanding the HK police is one of the core demands of Hong Kong protesters [4]. While US has made some police reforms, nothing like this happened in Hong Kong, except HK police just got more powerful under the new National Security Law.

And you tell me US is the same as HK?

[1] http://www.rfi.fr/tw/%E6%94%BF%E6%B2%BB/20200118-%E4%BC%91%E... (in Chinese)

[2] https://www.hk01.com/%E7%AA%81%E7%99%BC/471390/%E9%9D%9E%E8%... (in Chinese)

[3] https://hongkongfp.com/2020/06/15/i-couldnt-breathe-hong-kon...

[4] https://news.ltn.com.tw/news/world/breakingnews/2925727 (in Chinese)

[yoav]

For every cop held accountable there are hundreds more committing the same crimes who are protected by the state. While cell phones are a new invention where the protected class in the US is now seeing the oppression that many citizens have been living with, it’s not new. The state has known the whole time and intentionally hidden it.

Doing the bare minimum is just PR, eg: cops kneeling with protestors and then an hour later using chemical weapons and beating on the same peaceful protestors.

If the distinction is: China addresses challenges to oppression with censorship while the US addresses it with marketing and ineffectual “concessions” then we’re saying the same thing.

[hkmaxpro]

Please see my reply to https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=23695111

[boomboomsubban]

>And you tell me US is the same as HK?

You are comparing what happened in one city against what happened across the entire country. Look at the actions of the NYPD during these protests. They have also received virtually no punishment despite their range of heinous acts.

An occasional incident nationwide that drives up enough outrage to force a punishment doesn't grant us some moral high ground.

[hkmaxpro]

The parent comment compared the US to HK, so did I.

Now I just focus on NYPD: NYPD charged an officer for using a chokehold. [1]

No officer was charged in HK after the year long protests for their misconducts and brutality.

Side note: Numerous HK protesters were also victims of sexual harassment or sexual violence during arrest or detention. A 19-year-old girl was gangraped by police officers in a police station and got pregnant, and the police threatened to arrest her for “making false statements”. She defended her claims and had to flee to Taiwan. [2][3]

Any similar incident in NYC?

[1] https://www.nytimes.com/2020/06/25/nyregion/nypd-officer-cho...

[2] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SQ3-OZaEcCA

[3] https://hongkongfp.com/2020/05/13/hong-kong-woman-who-accuse...

[boomboomsubban]

>Any similar incident in NYC?

Yes

https://theintercept.com/2019/08/30/nypd-anna-chambers-rape-...

[raverbashing]

Some people really need to step out of their bubble and go see what it really is out there.

Not saying the US doesn't have problems, but this laundry list is mild for let's say 70% of the world's population.

And to be fair the "woke" press (including some national "unbiased" news sources) just make the problem worse.

But I guess the grass is always greener

> To most people outside the US’s branding sway there’s very little difference between a USA and a Russia or China

Only if they ignore how things happen on this countries or is sheltered.

Now, about "mishandling a pandemic", yes, it could have been done better, but I think a lot of countries are not handling it better, they just didn't get the check yet and/or are putting the problem under the table.

[creato]

Would you rather live in North Korea or South Korea? Hong Kong or Taiwan? West Germany or East Germany?

[obiye]

Right. That’s why millions of people clamor every year to immigrate to Russia for a better life. Get a grip. The world is not black and white.

[freeone3000]

Here's immigration stats for Russia: https://www.macrotrends.net/countries/RUS/russia/immigration....

Of course millions are clamoring to immigrate to Russia for a better life - it's a rich, stable country!

[_-___________-_]

> That’s why millions of people clamor every year to immigrate to Russia for a better life

They literally do.