[whizzkid]

This whole setup doesnt make sense for me. Flying as a whole is not that comfy even if you are flying first class. Pack + taxi + controls + wait in lounge + wait boarding and etc.

I believe not needing to fly is more luxurious life than flying. If your job requires you to fly, than business class is there just for that purpose :) (company pays)

[eganist]

¯\_(ツ)_/¯ I just finished a mileage run. It made sense for me because I already had the status this year (not from a prior mileage run), which meant I ended up being upgraded on every flight and e.g. flying overnight and showering in airport lounges rather than burning time in hotels. I used it as an opportunity to catch up with old friends in far away places.

Worked out pretty well.

[not_a_moth]

Ha I have United Platinum status and I rarely get upgraded to business. My typical flights are international or fully booked coast-to-coast, where being in business would actually be nice to lie down. I almost always end up having to purchase the upgrades outright if prices aren't jacked up.

Really the only value I care about from the status is premier check in desks across star alliance, which isn't that enviable.

More than signifying anything enviable, top airline status basically just means you get a crap ton of extra radiation exposure every year (e.g. SFO to Tokyo is a chest x-ray per hour, 20 microSv, if you didn't know). Really not worth going out of your way to get.

[rasz]

About the radiation - pretty anecdotal, but Arthur “Art” Astrin (rip http://ewh.ieee.org/r6/scv/its/MtgSum/Astrin.html) was responsible for Wireless part of Apple revival product range ~1999 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tj5NNxVwNwQ He spend couple of years flying weekly SF-Shenezhen. Ended up with severe metastatic melanoma. "Incidence of cancer among licenced commercial pilots flying North Atlantic routes" put 10% higher rick of malignant melanoma on frequent flyers.

[chrisseaton]

> Ha I have 100k United status and I almost never get upgraded to business.

I get upgraded transatlantic with just Gold occasionally so not sure why you are being so unlucky.

[asciimike]

You must be sweet talking the gate agent, because UA CPU's aren't applied for transatlantic flights: https://www.united.com/ual/en/us/fly/mileageplus/awards/upgr...

I'll shill caniupgrade.flights which has info on which flights can be upgraded using various instruments. I need to update it for PlusPoints, but otherwise it's accurate.

[thr0w__4w4y]

Your comment is warranted, but I think I know at least one contributing factor (normally fly around 200K / yr on United)

I'm making up an extreme case to make the point, but let's say the plane's business / first cabin is 100% empty / unbooked, and the economy cabin is full (even overbooked) and the standby list is 30 deep.

Even though UA is reluctant to give out free INT upgrades, if it means they can put 30 more people on that plane and collect the revenue, they'll do it. There's more to it than that, I'm sure there's a heuristic, in fact one day I hope there will be an AMA "I code the conditional logic for airline XYZ's algorithm <for Global Services> <for INT upgrades> <for domestic upgrades>" but until that time, we can only discuss what we've observed and speculate on the rationale.

Me, I'm still wondering why when I'm first on the ugprade list and there are 8 unsold first class seats, why do I have to board (in my economy seat), settle in, unpack and decompress before some gate agent comes waddling down the aisle 30 seconds before the door closes to tell me I've been upgraded. It was clear 30 minutes ago that was the case. First world problems, I know.

[chrisseaton]

No idea then - but it's happened at bag-drop at least twice. Just after I achieved status each time I think so I thought it was a thing they did to make you think it was really worth having achieved it.

[asciimike]

I've gotten it once (HND to SFO), so it's not unheard of, it's just not official policy. 24 hours before the flight departs, the upgrade list gets transferred from the online waitlist to the airport, and check-in staff and gate agents have full control at that point (this is why UA doesn't let you use upgrades within a 24 hour window). Occasionally, you can get someone at the airport to put the upgrade through (though I've found it burns goodwill, so don't do it too often).

[skolsuper]

Are you above average height? I'm 6'4" and get upgraded often. Seems to be more likely if I check in at the airport quite early.

[not_a_moth]

You won't get upgraded if it's a full flight and most biz seats are paid for, even with GPU. With gold especially unlikely, that will put you in the middle of a usually 50 person waitlist for 3 or 4 available seats.

All depends on how busy chosen routes are.

[asciimike]

Can confirm (1k with 125k+ BIS miles). My GPUs rarely clear on any reasonable route.

[yibg]

When I fly from SFO to Canada I get upgraded pretty regularly on gold status. Of course these are domestic first, so while better they still aren’t great.

[chrischen]

Do you have a source on that figure, because a cursory google search says that a chest xray is 0.1 mSv, and a 7 hour flight is 0.02 mSv.

[not_a_moth]

From the FAA, >.02 mSv per hour measured for LA to Tokyo [1]

From Wikipedia, .02 mSv for chest x-ray [2]

[1] https://www.faa.gov/data_research/research/med_humanfacs/oam...

[2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Banana_equivalent_dose#/media/...

[chrischen]

I'm not sure that banana chart from wikipedia is up-to-date:

https://www.radiologyinfo.org/en/info.cfm?pg=safety-xray https://www.health.harvard.edu/cancer/radiation-risk-from-me...

Most sources seem to put it at 0.1 mSv for a chest x-ray.

The FAA link for a Tokyo to LA 9 hour flight would be about 0.0206 mSv, or approximately 2 chest x-rays for the total flight.

However the FAA research you linked would put a New York to Seattle flight at a total of 0.112 mSv, whereas this CDC link says a trans-continental flight is only at the order of mangnitude of 0.035 mSv...

https://hps.org/publicinformation/ate/faqs/commercialflights... - summarizes more sources that contradict the raw FAA numbers.

This FAA calculator also seems to give numbers that agree with the lower radiation levels: http://jag.cami.jccbi.gov/cariresults.asp

[rburhum]

With United Gold I got upgraded to business my last 7 flights in a row to south america.

[toomuchtodo]

I think it's one of those things that you have to be "in the know" to understand and experience the benefits, and why a mileage run or other status qualifying event is worth the time and effort. Same reason some folks have no value getting Global Entry, but for a frequent traveler, being saved from one missed flight due to border control time deltas (looking at your YYZ!) makes the $100 fee and the interview worth it.

[yibg]

Nexus is probably one of the best investments I’ve ever made. The amount of time saved from that one little card has been incredible.

[asciimike]

I don't live on the border so I had to stick with Global Entry, but I totally agree that Nexus is the way to go if you can swing it. I also got the APEC Business Travel Card ($70 addon to Global Entry) that gets you the diplomatic line in ~20 countries while on business travel. Has literally saved me hours in line in Tokyo, Taipei, and Hong Kong.

[wenc]

Agreed. Nexus also bundles access to Global Entry and TSA precheck at no extra cost -- a good investment for $50 over 5 years (works out to $10/yr!).

It's the best deal ever, not only for travel between U.S. and Canada, but also from any other destination to/from U.S. and Canada and within the U.S. and Canada domestically.

I travel regularly from U.S. to Europe and I get full GE and Precheck privileges through Nexus. I usually clear customs in less than 5 minutes as opposed to 1.5 hr line at larger airports like ATL.

[eganist]

I think you're largely right. I derive pretty good value from the programs I'm enrolled in, so a mileage run makes sense to keep doing the things I'd like to do next year at a relative discount.

[JumpCrisscross]

> Flying as a whole is not that comfy

To each their own. A lay-flat seat is like a mini-vacation strapped onto work trips. I’ve never done a mileage run, but I’ve certainly increased spend on a route (e.g. buy buying a nicer ticket upfront) to hit thresholds because those thresholds are meaningful to me.

[asciimike]

Flying up front is vastly different from being in the back, especially on a premium fist product (Lufthansa or ANA in *A, or Cathay, Emirates, Qatar, etc.). I used to fly to India for business and I could always score a first upgrade BLR -> FRA, which meant I could use the LH first class terminal (separate building) during the layover back to the states. 200+ bottles of whisky, a cigar room, an entire leg of jamon iberico, bathtubs where you could grab a bottle of champagne off the wall and drink while you lounged, dedicated customs, and a Porsche to drive you directly to your departing aircraft. I wouldn't pay O(10k) for a ticket, but it's a pretty good time when you can upgrade it.

[ethbro]

It seems like there are two divergent characteristics that lead to the differences of opinions on this.

1) Has someone ever flown in a premium class on a non-US carrier?

2) Has someone taken advantage of the end-to-end amenities? E.g. premium lounges, etc.

Personally, first class on American is an order of magnitude worse service than business on ANA or Cathay. So I could see someone saying "What's the point?" if they primarily fly domestics.

[yibg]

Big difference between domestic and international too. United international business class is pretty good (not Cathay, Ana etc first class good but on par with day Cathay business class) lounge and all are pretty up to par I think.

[asciimike]

Definitely. Domestic is generally meh. UA Polaris has stepped up their game for sure. Bedding is A+, lie flats in 1-2-1 are better than LH (which is still 2-2-2 or 2-3-2, though if you're stuck on a 2-4-2 772, I'd take the LH flight), and the Polaris lounges offer premium alcohol and decent food. Inflight food and beverages (same liquor as the rest of the plane) aren't as good, and service is still a joke compared to any non-US carrier though.

[morsch]

The world we live in is really fucked up.

[FDSGSG]

Why?

[esoterica]

A lay-flat seat tops out at being slightly less comfortable than sitting in your couch at home. I wouldn’t consider it a vacation-tier experience (unless you count it as a mini-vacation every time you plop yourself down in front of the tv after work).

[umanwizard]

Nobody is bringing me hot food and as many of whatever drinks I want while I sit in my couch at home.

[rainyMammoth]

To each its own, but I will take going surfing or hiking outdoor (what I would call a mini vacation) over being in a unhealthy metallic cage with recycled sick air. It is amazing to me that Airlines marketing is that good that they convinced some people that it's enjoyable to be in a plane. I fly business transpacific all the time for work and I hate it.

[CydeWeys]

Fun fact: The air in a plane isn't recycled. It comes from outside. The air in planes is fresher on average than your typical building.

What the air on a plane is is less dense and less humid, which has its own problems, but it's not stale.

[asciimike]

I have to fly to go do some of those activities (or for work), and I'd sure as hell be up front with amenities than hugging my knees in the back.

I assume the marketing is really just to convince you they're less terrible than the (at most one) other competitor for the direct route, and aspirational for a bunch of leisure travelers who aren't going to spring for it anyways.

[CydeWeys]

It's pretty easy to just go to the kitchen where I have all that stuff though.

I'd still rather just be at home, and have to provide my own food and drinks, than on a plane being waited on.

[supercommand]

Sounds like you’re in America.

Elsewhere the ride to the airport is a quick cheap train. Electronic boarding so no need to checkin. But even if you do you’ve got a dedicated counter with someone waiting for you. Controls are under 2 minutes. Less than that if you have status you essentially walk through. (Fuck the American tsa those incompetent fools). And lounges overseas at a decent airline are like high end spas or better.

Checkout cathays first class lounge in hk. Or Singapore’s lounge for pps.

Then again, status at airlines that are not American come with some pretty excellent perks that are not found in America.

I’d take a long haul to retain status. The routes I fly and the frequency makes it a necessity. Taking a hot shower the minute you step off a plane before you meet a client is worth every dollar.

[yibg]

While not exactly a mileage run I did pick United over an alternative cheaper flight just to get to the next status tier. I agree flying sucks even in business / first, but if I’m gonna fly (which for sure I’ll have to next year), might as well make it a bit more comfortable.

[rolltiide]

Learn how to pack and its not a chore. A woman taught me some techniques to optimize packing and space, and ironically other women say its only possible because I am a man.

When you have preauthorization from the government for security the controls are not time consuming, and means less variance in how long you need to get to your plane

So that means much less waiting, but if you wish to wait then you typically have several lounge options to choose from if you desire

And with status you board earlier which also means less drama regarding getting on or whats going to happen to your carryon bag

It requires some finesse but its a much more parallel experience to casual travelers subject to the full stress of air travel

Also with the points you are more frequently booking convenient flights that would otherwise be economically irrational

[ghaff]

With Pre-Check, I'm usually through security in the US pretty quickly. But I hate feeling rushed or worrying about being late so I still normally leave plenty of time and, as you say, can usually hang out in a lounge and/or get a meal so it's pretty comfortable.

I worked for a guy once and when we traveled together (pre-9/11) he'd get a cab from our downtown location to the airport planning to arrive 30 minutes or whatever before the flight. Drove me crazy.

[Scoundreller]

> And with status you board earlier which also means less drama regarding getting on or whats going to happen to your carryon bag

But then you have to deal with once-yearly flyers in Zone 72 bashing their rollon over your feet and into your chair.

Personally, I fear the day airlines force me to board first. I'll enjoy the gate while everyone else boards a plane that will depart at the same time for everyone.

[Aloha]

I'm on the road 150+ nights a year.

Packing can be easy. For example, I roll everything, makes it much easier to tetris them into the bag and they don't come out as wrinkled on the other end, they also compress a little better.

Similarly TSA PreCheck is a must, yes, I hate effectively paying a bribe to bypass the security theatre, but I also hate dealing with getting undressed at the checkpoint - the fact is, the security theatre exists to keep the infrequently flying public feeling safe - and if that results in more relaxed travelers, that also makes my life better.

I mostly focus on Hotel Status over airlines, thats gonna change, I'll likely try for status this year or next at American.

[ghaff]

I don't find hotel status buys me a huge amount. I prioritize Marriott all other things being equal and I probably get upgraded more than the average joe as a result. But I don't find perks like lounges that big a deal and often stay in suite hotels anyway where they don't even exist.

I'd rather stay in a convenient location than do unnatural acts to stay with a specific chain. There also tend to be much bigger cost differences among hotels than airlines.

[rolltiide]

Hotel status doesn't do much, in isolation. Late checkouts and more reliable room upgrades aren't much incentive. They also let you accumulate points faster for... drumroll... more hotel stays and status chasing!

The thing I do like about Hotel rewards programs are that:

They are more likely to let you transfer your points to other services such as airlines

The points themselves can get your rooms at the tier exchange rates that are totally decoupled from dollars

And you still get progress towards your next status even while using the points. Something that airlines do not do.

Sometimes the status can be matched between other services. I like the MGM Resorts status match with Hyatt.

[Aloha]

Exactly, and marriott points are quite flexible too - I would rather do Hyatt if I'm being honest, but Hyatt doest have enough hotels to work for me.

[rolltiide]

But that Marriott portfolio is super broad now

[novok]

One thing I found out recently is that at some airports, pre-check has hours, and it can be somewhat hard to figure out when your leaving, and annoying that you have to. Found that out recently when I had a evening flight leaving from las vegas :/