[wemdyjreichert]

Beans, lentils, and chickpeas are not a substitute for meat, in terms of either nutrition or flavor. Vegetable protein does not equal meat protein in terms of amino acids. Plant proteins are typically low in methionene, tryptophan, lycine, and isoleucine [0]. My point is not that vegetarianism is completely impossible, but that it is hard to get everything necessary. This is especially true for anyone who is trying to build muscle or get in shape. It certainly doesn't taste as good, especially if you don't want to take tons of time cooking.

It still takes "gourmet" vegetarian food to compare to regular meat.

[0] https://www.healthline.com/nutrition/animal-vs-plant-protein

[dashundchen]

I don't know, looking at this chart is seems extremely easy to meet those amino acids with plant foods.

https://vegfaqs.com/important-vegan-amino-acids/

Just looking at lysine:

> There’s no official RDA for lysine, but according to research, you typically want to aim for about 12 mg per kg of bodyweight.

> For example, a 170 lb person needs 924 mg per day, or more.

So a cup of soybeans providers 1.33 grams, oats, lentils and any bean at least a gram per serving.

Oatmeal for breakfast, nuts for a snack and a mix of vegetables with some beans or tofu for dinner and you exceed the RDA for every one of those amino acids you've listed. All healthy things you should be incorporating into your diet anyway (fiber rich). So while a single food may not meet the RDA alone, it seems very easy to meet with a combination of common foods in a plant based diet.

Not to mention nutrients that are supplemented in vegan diets often are also supplemented in omni diets (B12 in meat and Vitamin D in milk, for example, are only because of supplementation and fortification).

> It certainly doesn't taste as good, especially if you don't want to take tons of time cooking. > It still takes "gourmet" vegetarian food to compare to regular meat.

I had plenty of terrible meat meals and many amazing vegan dishes. I would say the standard American diet lacks a lot of knowledge about tasty ways to cook plants, but they do exist and they aren't hard. Ethiopian and Indian cooking, for example, have a strong tradition of plant based dishes that are easy to make. Many other cuisines can easily be adapted.

[cmroanirgo]

Well said. I generally also like to point out that many meats are eaten with some kind of flavouring/ sauce to make them taste better. These flavourings and sauces are nearly entirely made of vegetables and fruits...

[jniedrauer]

> It certainly doesn't taste as good

I'd say that's pretty subjective. I haven't missed meat from a taste perspective. The smell actually starts to get a little bit repulsive when I go for months without it.

The rest of your point is very relevant though. I supplement with whey protein. But if it wasn't for that, I'd really be struggling to hit amino acid targets. Being an athletic vegan is borderline impossible in my opinion.

[spraak]

> Being an athletic vegan is borderline impossible in my opinion.

There are a great number of vegan athletes that disagree. E.g. Patrik Baboumian, one of the strongest people alive, is vegan. America's best Olympic weight lifter (maybe not currently but has been), Kendrick Ferris, is vegan. Keep an eye out for the release of the moving "The Game Changers" [1] for more.

[1] http://gamechangersmovie.com/

[tgarv]

Just copying and pasting this link from a sibling comment to yours to point out that oatmeal, nuts, and beans are generally good enough to cover the amino acids that are otherwise hard to get from a vegan diet https://vegfaqs.com/important-vegan-amino-acids/

Agreed that it's really hard to be an athletic vegan, but seems doable if you hit these amino targets and still supplement with pea protein or something.

[wemdyjreichert]

You're right that taste is subjective, and that what tastes good for one may not for another. That is a large part of the reason that I take issue when people self-righteously say I should be eating a vegan diet, eating insects, etc.