Ask HN: Have you started a business because nobody wanted to hire you?

[ccdev]

Also, how did that turn out? Did your business become profitable to the point where it replaced the need to look for a job?

I'm curious if you've ever been driven to start a business simply you had little or no alternative choice for making a living.

The business could be any kind of legitimate enterprise big or small. Doesn't need to necessarily be software or tech related, could be something from more traditional trades or disciplines.

[ryanjmo]

I’m trying to find a job right now and it isn’t going well. I have my PhD in computer science and I’ve run my own bootstraped company before and took it to over a million in profit for a couple years. I want to find a job as a engineering manager or something similar, but the feedback I’m getting is I don’t have enough corporate experience for that type of job, because I’ve just been doing my own thing for so long. I could find a job as a programmer, but I really don’t want to. After running my own company, I just like management better. And I know I wouldn’t enjoy programming for someone else for 8 hours a day.

So, I’m currently starting a tech business, but it is just going to take a bit to get started and it may not work. So in the mean time, I’m going to work on starting a plumbing company. I live in an affluent community and I think I can get the plumbing business to $400k-$500 a year, with just myself and a van. I’m going to just hire a plumber to take calls with me until I get comfortable going on calls on my own. I apprenticed this fall with a plumber; I like the work way more than programming and got an idea of how much I could expect to make. Which is way more than I could make programming for someone.

Thinking back on it, as my PhD was finishing up, I was having trouble finding a job, which was one of the things that pushed me to start my own thing anyway.

So I guess not being able to find a job and starting my own thing is something I have done a few times now. It is way more motivating to start something when you have no other good choice.

[anitil]

What a curious career! Trades in general, and plumbing in particular, seem pretty lucrative, particularly where I am (Sydney - we've had a crazy property and construction boom). And the path to small business ownership is fairly well trodden.

I'd say most 'entrepreneurs' are probably in trades, we just don't just that word for some reason.

[galfarragem]

Nowadays trades are lucrative everywhere.

The existent low competition is mind boggling but the career change is not that easy for people coming from intelectual challenging careers. It feels like a 'downgrade'. For the typical HNer selling is the only challenge there.

[ryanjmo]

It's funny it feels like a 'downgrade' as it is more lucrative. It is also really fun. You feel like a superhero when you show up at peoples house and rescue them from their problem (which if you are a plumber is often serious). I also noticed that we did a fair bit of almost counseling when we showed up at peoples houses, which also felt great. It got me out of the house and meeting people. To me it seems like a good noble career.

And let's not forget what Einstein said.. "If I would be a young man again and had to decide how to make my living, I would not try to become a scientist or scholar or teacher. I would rather choose to be a plumber or a peddler in the hope to find that modest degree of independence still available under present circumstances."

[JSeymourATL]

Upvote for Einstein quote.

BTW, Ryan Conway @ Digital Tradesman might be able to help out with a website for your new Plumbing Venture. Good guy, worth talking to > https://digitaltradesman.net/

[Aromasin]

I've been incredibly tempted to do an electricians apprenticeship, so it's cool to hear someone from an academic background that's actually done something similar and gone into a trade. My study was Electrical and Electronic Engineering so I imagine the career swap would be trivial, but it's a large time investment.

How did you find the time to do it? To become a licensed electrician in the UK apparently takes about 4 years, and I'd earn pittance until qualifying so that's the only thing stopping me currently. I assume plumber would be as similarly stringent.

[LastManStanding]

I had a roommate who had both and EE degree and was a licensed electrician. He could get a high paying job with just a phone interview. All the more amazing because he was a felon who served five years for drug smuggling and would reveal that in the interview right off the bat.

[ryanjmo]

In the US you can do "plumbing service" without a license. So that is any repair basically. You just can't do installation, so no new construction. However, there is plenty of business in service and I like the work better than installations.

[ham_sandwich]

A famous anecdote along these lines are the whatsapp founders.

I haven’t done so personally yet but it’s starting to look like I might consider this route.

Several years ago, I would have leaned toward a SaaS business targeting some super niche vertical, not to make 1000x VC style rocket-ship returns of course, but as a way to bootstrap into a nice business. I get the sense most verticals with a TAM worth going after are now very competitive.

Interested to see if people see opportunities in non-tech routes.

[alehul]

Another famous anecdote would be Elon Musk, who tried to get a job at Netscape in the '90s and failed [1], and claims that he created his first company because he couldn't get a job at any existing internet companies.

[1] https://www.cnbc.com/2018/06/18/how-elon-musk-tried-to-get-a...

[rmbryan]

You should read about the guy who sells onions. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=19728132

[dazc]

I worked in construction for 20 years. I thought I was doing the right thing by going back to college to advance my career but it didn't work out like that.

I only got half-way on my route to becoming a surveyor since I simply could not afford the time away from work. So I found myself in a situation where I was better qualified than my boss but not so well qualified that there were many alternatives other than looking for similar work elsewhere.

By then, at the age of 40, I was, in the eyes of potential employers, over qualified for the roles I was applying for or just too old. So I gave up.

After a spell of unemployment while tinkering around with different ideas I fell into web development and started earning a bit of money. I figured I may as well pursue this since there wasn't anyone around at the time to tell me not to. After struggling for a few years I got to the stage where I was earning as much as I was in my previous career so stuck with it.

Some years later I have a lifestyle business that enables me to travel whenever and wherever I like and work whatever hours I want to (within reason). I don't earn a huge amount of money but I do earn enough to live on and save for my retirement.

I'm reasonably happy with the way things worked out.

[superflit]

I did.

It was 2012. I was kind of 33.000 USD in debt, wife pregnant with the first baby.

Trying to interview at significant companies (Dell, HP, Atlassian, etc.) none was given me nothing.

One friend of mine who had access to the HR feedback said I was too confident and I should try to appear less skilled as the manager was kind of afraid.

The situation was so bad I had a google spreadsheet with places I sent resume, results and etc. Kinda my personal job analytics.

(checked the spreadsheet now...that was depressing)

No money, no jobs, a kid on the way and wife declared:

--- "It is very disappointing having to pay the bills for you."

Then I got one call from a person willing to do consulting, they had some problems with their billing system.

Solved the problem and watched them work thinking about how I can help them more. I saw two employees matching online payments with the billing system.

That struck me... The whole process was old and archaic and prone to errors. So I propose to them do a payment processor.

They had that idea before, and another specialist told it will cost 300K and 1 year to make it, so they are not sure about all that investment.

Well, I offered: 1. I do for you in 2 months; 2. I want X% of payments 3. If I fail, you don't pay anything; 4. Honesty

Now we are on the 3 years going strong, and I think I will expand it more. I am not rich but I can pay some bills, and my customers are pleased.

Six months ago I asked my customer: "When was the last time you had a billing or payment problem?"

And he really paused and realized that it was long ago.

Got my Cheque and sent a cake to their team. Win-WIn

Tl-Dr; Being a loser is a TEMPORARY stage keep fighting and looking for opportunities to serve and help your customers make more money.

[anthony_doan]

> One friend of mine who had access to the HR feedback said I was too confident and I should try to appear less skilled as the manager was kind of afraid.

I totally understand you. I had this experience in one interview. HR took me to the side after the interview and told me I was too confident. I was really passionate about web dev and their questions were good. They still schedule me for the next round, I ended up lying and saying that I have taken another offer. It felt like the HR was trying to lower my self esteem so they can pay me less or something. I have no idea why else they would do this. I was very respectful throughout the interview.

[jobapplsk]

> One friend of mine who had access to the HR feedback said I was too confident and I should try to appear less skilled as the manager was kind of afraid.

I just got reject from an interview even though I passed multiple technical interviews. I was more annoyed because they found people more junior to interview me (the job was to be their team lead). The third interviewer was asking such a simple question, I didn’t even understand what he was asking for 10 minutes until I realise I was over thinking it (it was a poorly formulated question that wasn’t well thought out). It was a question I didn’t expect because at my level, they shouldn’t be asking those questions. I would have expected that question for a boot camp graduate. So I already knew, their level was below par. And the interviewer felt so smart for stumping me. Needless to say, I wasn’t disappointed when they rejected me, but more relieved I dodged a bullet.

[superflit]

" And the interviewer felt so smart for stumping me. Needless to say, I wasn’t disappointed when they rejected me, but more relieved I dodged a bullet."

I got 3 interviews like that. On the last one when I openned the door and there was two guys looking at their hipchat channels talking about our interview in the middle of the interview it was clear it was a fail.

I try no to blame others so I can be more on charge of my destiny.

[blcArmadillo]

I don't think it's unreasonable to have people who will have to report to you interview you. If you're going to be managing people it's important to be able to tease out the root of poorly formulated questions. But yeah, it's annoying that the interviewer took joy in "stumping" you.

[darrenwestall]

Absolutely. I wanted to move away from the technical side of business as I really enjoy the commercial aspects too, but once you’re a CTO, it’s very hard (and unusual) to become a CEO in an established business.

Now I get to do a bit of everything I enjoy.

[thisisrajat]

Realizing the amount of value you can create as a programmer working for a company is an eye-opener.

I've worked at a startup making millions of dollar in revenue every quarter. Realized that I was just making someone else rich and got paid in pennies. Quit the job and took the plunge.

[charlie0]

I'm starting my own software consulting business. I only have about 1.5 years of experience (full time), mainly self taught. I just recently started to go look for clients and realizing that after learning programming, now I have to learn sales, lol.

[hluska]

If cold calling scares you, but you feel like you have to do it, feel free to reach out. My email is in my profile and I’d be glad to help you work on a script. You can even practice on me if you want.

Good luck! Sales can be a lot of fun and your programming mind will help you figure out a good sales system.

[chrisbennet]

I started consulting. Now it would be really hard to go back to doing a single aspect when as a consultant, I get to do many (GUI/computer vision/graphics/embedded).

[anitil]

What sort of customers? That's a similar set of skills to me, but I am struggling to see a path to consulting.

[chrisbennet]

Small companies and a couple of big ones.

The golf ball vision project was a small company, like 6 people. Another vision one is for a tiny medical startup. The laser product was for a large company. I’d worked for the director like 10 years earlier. The radar graphics is for a medium (50?) sized company.

3drocketsurgery.com

I get the gigs mostly through friends.

[anitil]

Interesting, thanks

[avichalp]

I am thinking about it a lot lately. I have worked with a high growth startup (outside SV) for 2 years. And another year with a SV based but slightly less growth startup in early stage. Last year I emigrated to EU for a new job. After few months I din't like the job. I stared looking for a new job and I am getting lowball offers from everywhere. I am thinking if it makes more sense to start my own business instead of finding that perfect job.