[gregholland]

I don't think it will change anytime soon.

1, The marketplace sucks compared to the app store in many ways. There are few ways to feature your apps on the marketplace vs apple which has the "what hot", "new and noteworthy", "top paid", "top grossing" categories. In comparison, the android marketplace doesn't.

2, On the apple app store, you are given more promotion room on your app page itself for more descriptive text and screenshots.

3, The android marketplace is FILLED with crap and spam apps, just go to the "whats new" section of your android marketplace and its filled with 95% crap-ware and those ringtone apps. There is no clear way for consumers to find good apps vs these garbage apps. This destroys the user's experience in the marketplace.

4, Related to above, the lack of regulation has fostered a system where comment spamming other apps's page and creating apps that does shady things with user's data is actually more profitable than creating quality apps. see here: http://tinyurl.com/2f3r4g9

5, There is a culture of "free" and "opensource" in the entire Android ecosystem and most apps are released for free or are ad-supported. Google seem to love this since if you use their ad system, they get a cut and therefore they don't seem to have an incentive to push paid apps to have wider availability.

On the other hand, I'm looking forward to what Meego and Win7MO will bring for us developers. I hope they will follow Apple's model of having tighter control over their app stores rather than the mess that the Android marketplace is.

[WilliamLP]

It's ironic that what developers hate about iPhone is precisely what makes it ideal for developers who want to make money. This being the walled garden, the inability to easily install free third party programs, and also the fact that there is a financial barrier to entry (a Mac, plus a dev fee) means that other developers are reluctant to make their apps free in the first place - meaning you don't have to compete with people giving their apps away!

It's a brilliant, (albeit arguably evil), strategy by Apple to create a viscous circle where developers bind themselves to iPhone, which means the good apps wind up there and thus users buy the product and pay for superior apps, which makes it more lucrative to develop for, and so on. And they sell some extra Macs and make money on dev fees, and take a cut out of every app store sale. It's really a simply ingenious grand strategy which has worked unbelievably well for them, however unethical or limiting some people might think it is.

[dejb]

> It's a brilliant, (albeit arguably evil), strategy by Apple to create a viscous circle where developers bind themselves to iPhone, which means the good apps wind up there and thus users buy the product

The only problem with your theory is the 'Android Sales Overtake iPhone in the U.S' part. Perhaps Android will need a bigger market share (double?) to really start stealing the higher quality developers from iOS but if the trend continues this will happen.

[demallien]

Not really. Firstly, if you're going to count all Android device sales against the iPhone, you're going to also have to count all iOS devices, such as the iPod Touch and the iPad. At this point, iOS is still well ahead of Android in the US.

Secondly, the US is not the whole world. Here in France I don't know anyone other than tech geeks that have Android phones, but a majority of my friends have iPhones or Blackberries.

Thirdly, you have to take into account the fact that Apple has created a culture of users paying for content. They have also made paying for content as painless as is humanly imaginable - select item, enter password, and it downloads straight to your phone. Android devs have a long wait ahead before they start to see the returns that iOS devs are seeing.

[steamboiler]

by Apple to create a viscous circle where developers bind themselves to iPhone

I think you mean a vicious cycle. Or a virtuous one depending on how you perceive Apple.

[WilliamLP]

Yes, indicative of positive mutual feedback, not a round area of slow and sticky fluid flow:) Thanks.

[napierzaza]

Evil circle of ...

Please stop. This is what every single company on the planet does. Few things are inter compatible and you'd be naive to hope that they would. Apple has solutions (implementations) to a problem which are different to everyone else's.

[paul9290]

I created this poll here http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1571592 to find out are iPhone users really more inclined to buy over Android users?

Appreciate u taking the poll.

[ben1040]

One thing that may address your first two points is that Google demoed at I/O a web presence for the Android Market that would work in conjunction with the push service on the phone. Buy an app on the web and it's pushed to the phone.

I imagine that if done right this would allow them to match Apple in terms of providing more real estate for promotional content from app developers, and reduce the barrier to buying since you can preview an app, hit "buy," and immediately have it on the phone.

I also think the lack of a good web presence for Android Market is holding back device adoption. I know of several people who are dissatisfied with their iPhones but are hesitant to jump to Android without being able to see if there are third-party apps out there that are analogous to what they've already got on their iPhones.

I agree that one of the major problems with the Android Market at present is certainly this culture of "I won't pay for an app -- and if I have to pay, I'll copy it to my SD card and delete it within the 24 hour return window." A developer has little incentive to make a really, really good paid app if a good proportion of their users would pirate it. There's a tipping point where you can instead make more money by making a mediocre ad-supported app.

[jra101]

> I'll copy it to my SD card and delete it within the 24 hour return window.

That should be fixed with the new Android licensing server that Google recently announced.

http://android-developers.blogspot.com/2010/07/licensing-ser...

Edit: Well, fixed when developers update their apps (which they have a big incentive to do).

[ben1040]

I think this is a good thing so long as developers are also generous enough with the grace periods that legitimate users aren't affected.

If you travel to a foreign country for a week and don't have international data roaming turned on, will you need to find a coffee shop and connect to wifi sometime in the middle of your trip to re-authorize your apps?

The nice thing is that it does leave these decisions in the developer's hands. If it's a network-centric app that accesses a web service that costs the developer money to operate (and thus piracy results in monetary loss), there's no reason not to have the license be strictly checked every time the app is opened. If it's just a game, maybe not so much, because someone probably will want to play it on an airplane.

[orangecat]

I agree that one of the major problems with the Android Market at present is certainly this culture of "I won't pay for an app -- and if I have to pay, I'll copy it to my SD card and delete it within the 24 hour return window."

I haven't seen any evidence that piracy on Android is worse than on iOS. My paid app has a 5-10% return rate; even if that's all piracy, it's not worth worrying about.

[gregholland]

The problem with piracy on android is how EASY it is to pull it off. On the iPhone, you have to jailbreak your phone, a step which many consumers are weary of doing in fear of bricking their phone, after this, they also have to find a cracked .ipa to download/install. On android, you simply need to buy an app, copy to SD, return it and viola! free app. Based on stats of my paid android app, there are about 3x as many pirated users as users who actually paid for it =(

[novum]

The new iOS 4 jailbreak doesn't require any of that. You don't even need a computer; everything happens in userland on the device.

Curious to see if this affects jailbreaking numbers.

[commandar]

>5, There is a culture of "free" and "opensource" in the entire Android ecosystem and most apps are released for free or are ad-supported. Google seem to love this since if you use their ad system, they get a cut and therefore they don't seem to have an incentive to push paid apps to have wider availability.

This isn't entirely consumer-driven, IMO. I have no problem supporting developers, and I've bought the "donation" version of a number of apps to support developers, but the fact is that often as not when I look for an app to do something, the free app is the best choice available.

There are times I find myself wishing there were more quality apps I need out there that the developer would take money for, just to help end this notion that Android users don't want to pay for software.

[RK]

1, The marketplace sucks compared to the app store in many ways. There are few ways to feature your apps on the marketplace vs apple which has the "what hot", "new and noteworthy", "top paid", "top grossing" categories. In comparison, the android marketplace doesn't.

Android Market does have "Top paid", "Top free", and "Just in" for the overall market and each app subcategory.

[jadedoto]

Marketplace does have a "Top Paid" and "Top Free" section for each genre similar to the App Store.

Most of the apps in App Store are crapware too

Apple gets a revenue from iAds as well. Notice that most of the Apps in App Store that are free are ad supported?

(I don't say this as a troll baiter, I own an iPad and an Android phone and love both equally)

[jan_g]

>I hope they will follow Apple's model of having tighter control over their app stores rather than the mess that the Android marketplace is.

It is really interesting that you hope for tight control, while I am waiting for a platform with as little carrier and/or platform vendor control as possible.

[gregholland]

In the ideal world, I want everything to be "open" and "free" too. However, there are simply too many spammers/unethical people out there who abuse such a system. Therefore I rather have a high quality app store over one that is filled with spam apps but is "open".

[jan_g]

I'm not referring to "free as in beer", but for freedom of choice. I want to be able to install & use apps (for which I paid) without carrier or platform vendor meddling. I don't want to root the phone, don't want to unlock the sim, don't want to be able to use only those apps that are approved by unseen/unknown authority. "Spam" apps as you call them are not a problem, as they are not in "pc land" unless you install everything you come across.

[rimantas]

6. Availability of Google Checkout (unless there are other ways to pay for the app already).

[ergo98]

1. I really don't think this is the job of a marketplace with tens of thousands of entrants. In the Android world there has been a heavy push for QR codes to apps, so I seldom ever browse the market, and instead read reviews and blog entries on apps, following the QR codes to those that sound interesting. I'm not sure why developers think that someone else should do the promotion for them, and all classic promotion vehicles are still necessary.

3. So is the Apple market. There are 300+ fart apps (probably much more by now). It is absolutely true that the Android market is full of junk, but don't say that as if it's the exception. 99% of iPhone apps are make money fast garbage.

4. Spam is definitely a problem, and it should embarrass Google that they haven't dealt with that. On the "shady things with data", sorry but your iPhone is far more susceptible to this.

5. Bullshit. On the iPhone there was a novelty aspect that is quickly fading away. I remember having peers gushing every day about all of the apps they purchased. That has faded away and now they use a very small cross-section of top tier apps.

"On the other hand, I'm looking forward to what Meego and Win7MO will bring for us developers"

Indeed.

"I hope they will follow Apple's model of having tighter control"

This is such a bullshit myth. Apple's "control" is superficial and facile. That you promote it shows that you're a bit gullible I suspect.