[mobiplayer]

What makes you think 10 years is not short term? Last crisis, that we're still recovering and suffering consequences (arguably Brexit is one) from, started 9 years ago.

What makes you think the UK can "win" anything in 10 years if it goes down the Brexit path? or 20 years for that matter, feel free to move the goal posts around. I'm curious.

[ZenoArrow]

> "Last crisis, that we're still recovering and suffering consequences"

The last crisis was extended by the actions of the government. Quantative easing to boost the wealth of the private banking sector + austerity in the public sector.

You can't save your way out of a recession, but if you are going to spend your way out of it, the money should end up with people who are willing to spend it in productive ways.

As for Brexit, what's your main economic concern? Imports? Exports? The domestic market?

[gcb0]

every company is already leaving.

IT has the blue collars (cheap engineers, sales, support, it) in Ireland and they are staying no matter what (zero tax ftw) while all the expensive ppl who refuses Ireland relocation were in london.

but if London is not EU, now it makes everything too complicated. France already started to glob startups. Germany got two big fortune 500 and Switzerland another.

it's a matter of time until they all move. and take all the service cascade with them.

so if you're afraid of crisis getting worse by fleeing investment, there you have it.

[ZenoArrow]

> "IT has the blue collars (cheap engineers, sales, support, it) in Ireland"

That was the case before Brexit, was it not? Companies like Google and Facebook had their European headquarters in Ireland before the Brexit referendum was announced.

> "Germany got two big fortune 500 and Switzerland another."

Interesting that you bring up an example linked to Switzerland, which isn't in the EU (it's not even part of the EEA). Despite that, it does have access to the European single market, something that some European bureaucrats are classing as 'impossible' for the UK post-Brexit. Let's wait and see.

> "it's a matter of time until they all move."

That's what's known as hyperbole. The UK has a large skilled/educated workforce with a strong work ethic. If incentives are made to mitigate against downsides of being out of the EU then I don't see every company leaving, and the ones that do leave will leave behind employees that they helped to train, ready for a competitor to make the most of.

[renaudg]

> Interesting that you bring up an example linked to Switzerland, which isn't in the EU (it's not even part of the EEA). Despite that, it does have access to the European single market, something that some European bureaucrats are classing as 'impossible' for the UK post-Brexit. Let's wait and see.

This is how Switzerland has access to the European single market :

- It pays into the EU budget

- It has freedom of movement for EU citizens

- It implements many EU regulations, without having a say in them.

http://blogs.lse.ac.uk/brexit/2016/07/20/how-much-do-non-eu-...

This has been hammered on and on during the campaign : the UK cannot possibly end up with a better deal than what it currently has as a full EU member (with a number of tailor-made opt-outs bordering on unfair to other members, to boot)

The issue is not with "some European bureaucrats", it is with some British people having difficulty coming to terms with reality at the moment.

[ZenoArrow]

Addressing your three main points:

- It pays into the EU budget

According to the article you linked to, Switzerland pays far less than the UK for access to the common market. Time will tell what agreements are reached here.

- It has freedom of movement for EU citizens

Which I have no problem with. Oh, did you think that people who voted for Brexit were racist? Surprise!

- It implements many EU regulations, without having a say in them.

Again, from the article you linked to, it states that Switzerland has around 100 bilateral agreements with the EU in order to get access to the single market. Having a multitude of agreements allow a certain level of control over which EU policies to take on and which ones to avoid. Can read more about those agreements here:

http://ec.europa.eu/trade/policy/countries-and-regions/count...

I do recognise that the bi-lateral deals with Switzerland took years to get ironed out, and I'm not expecting a quicker turnaround for the UK. What I predict is that we'll go for some form of soft Brexit where the divorce from the EU can happen gradually, which would be better for both sides.