[bryanlarsen]

I did the "uberman" sleep schedule for a few months about 10 years ago. It works; you can definitely survive and stay surprisingly functional on a 20 minute nap every 4 hours. You do lose some cognitive ability, though.

The advice in the OP is pretty bad, though. Any nap of more than 20 minutes will leave you feeling groggy when you wake up, especially if you're sleep deprived, which could be catastrophic for a pilot.

[bowlich]

I did uberman for a month when I was first starting out and just doing freelance. I could set whatever schedule I wanted so, I decided to give it a shot.

The big thing for me is, I really like the kind of concentration that the nigth brings, but I also like the early mornings. I've even been contemplating switching to a two-sleep cycle system again so I can enjoy both my mornings and nights.

Back to the uberman: week one was hell. Weeks two and three were amazing. I felt like I was getting so much done and I could fully enjoy any time of the day. Things started to fall apart around week four though. I began having difficulties with grasping at causation. I seemed to still be going through my day and somehow getting things done but I saw the world as just a snapshot of present moments and couldn't quite grasp how one moment transitioned into the next. So I gave it up.

[pavel_lishin]

I wonder if some people are just somehow (genetically?) more predisposed to functioning well on the Uberman sleep schedule.

[ska]

It seems more likely that we are all biologically predisposed to function badly on such a schedule.

Some people probably deal with the deficits better than others, but all of the "positive" results from something that extreme I've heard of are subjective and self-reported, so not worth much as evidence. There is, however, lots of empirical data about loss of cognitive function due to sleep deprivation; to be fair I don't think any of the studies I've seen targeted precisely that (self imposed, cyclic) sort of pattern. On the other hand, none of that research suggests a good outcome would be expected. I'm not referring to all sleep patterns here, just those that rely on very short cycles, e.g. 20 min.

[jerf]

I've posted this challenge a couple times here, so it's as good a time as any: Has anyone done the Uber sleep schedule for, say, at least a year, and preferably still doing it?

Last time I asked this was: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=6258098 (thanks https://hn.algolia.com ) and, well, the score I have for this remains at "zero accounts I trust", even from this relatively interested forum.

(Caveats: I recognize there is significant sleep variation in humans. Science has confirmed this, even if it doesn't know why. I also believe in "bi-phasic" sleep of shorter nights and significant naps, again, this has been established reasonably well. This isn't generalized skepticism, it's specifically the Uber & other variants that I've never heard even solid anecdotal evidence for.)

[dkersten]

I agree - I feel that trying it for a few weeks or even a month or two isn't long enough to really know if it works or not.

I tried a 28 hour day cycle (awake for 20 hours, asleep for 8; 6 day week) for a few weeks when I was in uni (as Mondays through Thursdays had me awake at relatively normal times and this suited my lecture schedule at the time) but then other obligations knocked me off schedule for a few days and I reverted back to normal. I feel like it could have been successful longer term, but I didn't do it long enough to know for sure. I guess the hardest part is making sure other things don't interfere.

[pavel_lishin]

As far as I can tell (without doing any sort of comprehensive survey), I think most people who do this regularly are people who cross oceans solo, and they only do it for that period of time.

[jerf]

I'm willing to tack on to my caveat list that it can be possible for a brief period of time. Since we know that no sleep leads to death, and people have clearly done Uber for longer than that threshold and not died, it can clearly be done for a period of time and you stay alive.

It's just that there does not seem to be any hope of doing it indefinitely. Sad. My personal biases and desires, like many here, lead me towards really wishing it could be, but I just don't see the evidence.

[sqldba]

I also did Uberman, a few times, for a few weeks at a time. The first week was always rough but once you get beyond that I felt like I was Superman.

It didn't last forever though. For me I was young and trying to fit work in with going out at night and perfecting my social skills. But once I had a partner, I found myself missing us sleeping together at night, and the long night hours being productive a little lonely compared to cuddling in bed. So I gave it up.

Of course pilots are in a different world. I don't think that would be a great idea.

[bryanlarsen]

I felt like Superman, too. My SO later told me I was more like stupid-man. It was still early enough in our relationship that she wasn't comfortable saying such things to my face.

[nimblegorilla]

I tried it for a few weeks and felt really unproductive. I think it is similar to being drunk. A lot of drunk people think they are awesome when they really aren't.

[DSMan195276]

That's not entire true. Getting a full sleep cycle is important - More over, the reason you don't feel groggy after sleeping for 20 minutes is because you didn't actually enter into the deeper levels of sleep, which are important for actually being rested.

If you sleep for aprox. 90 minutes, a full sleep cycle, then you also won't feel groggy.

[albemuth]

Isn't the theory around the uberman that in those 20 min you go straight into deep sleep?

[baby]

yup, parent is talking without knowledge of uberman

[bryanlarsen]

I still feel groggy after a 90 minute sleep; it's not as bad as waking up in the middle of the cycle, but I still feel groggy. If I nap for 3-15 minutes, I wake up feeling as awake as I am during exercise.

[bsummer4]

Are you sure you're not still waking up in the middle of the cycle? 90 minutes is just a loose generalization. Different people have different sleep cycles and take different amounts of time to fall asleep.

Personally, 2 hours works well for me but 90 minutes does not.

[drzaiusapelord]

How old were you? It seems like if you're in your teens or twenties you can pretty much do any crazy sleep schedule and be fine with it as you're in the "superpowers" stage of your life.

Its a little different in your 40s. As someone with sleep apnea, sleep quality is so important to me. I can't imagine messing with it, especially considering we don't fully understand sleep and if there may be long term consequences with weird sleep schedules. We do know that sufferers of apnea have increased risk of stroke, high blood pressure, diabetes, and depression.

[outworlder]

Another sufferer here (mid 30s). Latest exams are already showing a blood pressure increase (yay).

In my early twenties I could spend the whole night partying and drinking, then sleep half an hour and show up for work on time and still manage to do useful work.

Should I try these shenanigans now, I'll either be zombified and nauseated for the whole day or, if I try napping, collapse for the whole day, alarm clock or not. And that's without apnea.

My personal belief is that any schedule involving an alarm clock is wrong at best, and damaging at worst. The schedules may seem to 'work', but who knows what kind of damage they may be doing to the body.

[Dewie3]

Steve Pavlina did an experiment with polyphasic sleep when he was 34. It worked great for him. But he quit because that sleep schedule is unsociable. He is a personal development guy, though, so he isn't that keen on chanting the old "everything is hard or impossible after 40" which people on HN seem so keen on. "You did what? Oh, but you're probably young so it doesn't count. I could do anything too when I was your age."

http://www.stevepavlina.com/blog/2005/10/polyphasic-sleep/

[sfiles]

The reason uberman works is because you are getting REM sleep during those 20 minute naps. Your body adjusts to the 20 minute nap cycle and throws you into REM faster, hence why that first week or so adjust period is rather hellish. Before your body adjust there is a lack that much needed REM sleep.

It is a really crappy article though

[ska]

Do you have evidence (i.e. randomized, blinded) that uberman actually does work?

I'd be really interested to see it, all I have managed to find is evidence that some people who do it believe that it works well for them, which isn't at all the same thing.

Polyphasic sleep schedules are interesting, but I've always thought these extremely short cycles were problematic.

[tlb]

It's impossible to do double-blind experiments on behavior changes. But randomized, blind-evaluator experiments would be a good start.

[ska]

Of course you're right, behavioral studies make subject blinding (nearly?) impossible. Typing quicker than thinking there, I'll edit original for clarity.