[nathanb]

It seems like I see headlines every few months that a lab somewhere has created a paper-thin battery made out of unicorn horn which charges instantaneously when exposed to the sun and will run for a thousand years without recharging, and then it turns out to only work at absolute zero or to become unstable when three of them exist in the same area code or to emit radiation that kills anything smaller than a muskrat on contact.

I'm glad we've got labs researching battery technology, since I think that's one of the most important areas of research we can develop today. But forgive me if I'm skeptical until I see something show up on the shelves.

[lotsofmangos]

This looks as though it is escaping from the lab.

Power Japan Plus executives have years of experience overseeing battery manufacturing and supply chain at industry powerhouses like Sumitomo Metal Mining.

The company owns a battery production facility in Okinawa, Japan, where it will begin bench production testing of 18650 Ryden cells later this year. This facility will allow Power Japan Plus to meet demand for specialty energy storage markets such as medical devices and satellites.

http://powerjapanplus.com/battery/market.html

[SideburnsOfDoom]

> It seems like I see headlines every few months that a lab somewhere has created

Mostly because it is very much needed for a whole lot of things from mobile phones to cars to making solar energy work 24-7, so if someone gets there first they will become immensely wealthy capitalising on a shift of our civilisation.

But yeah, proof of concept is not path to market, press releases are not profits and all that.

I am also sceptical of claims that a new battery is both safer and energy-denser. These two things are not natural allies.

[bryanlarsen]

The press release says that it has an energy-density comparable to that of lithium-ion batteries, which in PR speak means "a little bit less than the worst lithium-ion batteries" which means "less energy-dense".

[mark-r]

Right. If it actually were better than lithium ion, they wouldn't be shy about saying so.

[netcan]

Skeptical.. sure.

Just like cancer or time travel or any kind of cool & urgent research projects, looking at it through the lens of pop science media on twitter is not ideal.

But.. I still want to hear about it.

[nathanb]

This article has a "path to market" section, which I appreciate. But that section raises its own questions, such as: if this technology is so amazing, why is it being deployed in satellites and medical devices but not cell phone batteries and laptops? Why would you put unproven technology into the most fault-intolerant sectors first? Maybe I'm too much of a skeptic, but that doesn't sound plausible.

Honestly, unlike you, I don't want to hear about it if it's going to turn into vaporware. Should it be published in a peer-reviewed journal? Absolutely. Do I want Apple and Tesla and Samsung looking into it? Definitely. Do I, personally, want to hear about it? Not particularly.

[danielweber]

When ramping up production, you would start with markets that are small, price-insensitive, and performance-sensitive. If it costs 10x as much as a normal battery but performs 5% better, that could be a value proposition that captures them the entire satellite market, letting them expand production into cars and consumer goods.

(I know squat about the satellite battery market; this is generic market wisdom.)

[coldtea]

>raises its own questions, such as: if this technology is so amazing, why is it being deployed in satellites and medical devices but not cell phone batteries and laptops? Why would you put unproven technology into the most fault-intolerant sectors first?

Don't know the specifics for this technology, but the answer is obvious in general.

Because new techologies are first put to use in expensive and demanding sectors, that can pay the top dollar needed for them (since they are not mass-market yet to have economies of scale).

That's why the army, NASA, industry etc had GPS, cellphones, etc before you had one, and the same for most other such technologies.

[JackFr]

First paragraph mentions a longer functional life, which presumably is of greater value in medical devices and satellites.

The batteries in phones often outlast the model of the phone.

However, it would be nice to see some numbers rather than just 'better', 'longer', etc.

[mark-r]

Unfortunately the markets they're targeting are going to need very thorough testing and characterization. And they're probably way too expensive for the other uses that come immediately to mind. It'll be years before you see these in action.

[mikeash]

Using it first in satellites and medical devices indicates to me that reliability has been sufficiently demonstrated, but that cost is high. If it was cheap but unproven, you'd first see it in toy helicopters or something. I don't think it's unreasonable that a new technology could be demonstrated to be reliable but not yet be cheap.

[mnw21cam]

Higher power density would be ideal for toy helicopters, as they typically have to use a different formulation of LiIon battery that compromises energy density and recharge cycle endurance in order to get a little bit more energy density.

[higherpurpose]

This one looks a little more promising. It will probably still take at least 3 years to see it in niche products on the market, though. But if I were Elon Musk, I'd keep a very close eye on this one, and if their claims are real, and won't take too long to appear on the market, I'd even buy them, and try to put the technology faster on the market.

[threeseed]

Tesla is bleeding money and only sells in a handful of countries. They need to sort themselves out before thinking of acquiring companies.

Toyota would be the far better choice especially since the CTO of PJP helped design the Prius battery.

[Bud]

Tesla actually doesn't seem to be bleeding money at all.

http://files.shareholder.com/downloads/ABEA-4CW8X0/318498670...

[protomyth]

The document you point to says they lost $50m in the quarter.

[baldfat]

YES just like the Fuel Cell batteries that you pop a pill in and it works for three days!!!

I want fuel cell!!!