[lutusp]

> Take an AA battery. Now go back in time 30 years and look at an AA battery. Identical. Why has battery technology not improved one bit in the last 30 years?

That's completely false. I might have said, "Look at a basic mousetrap 30 years ago. Now look at one today. Identical." What's missing is any examination of the alternatives. 30 years ago, there weren't any NiMH batteries, or commercial lithium-ion batteries (the latter were under active development), but they're now the primary power sources for portable devices, and lithium-ion batteries power the Tesla Model S.

> I don't think conventional batteries can improve all that much more.

And I don't think conventional thinking can improve all that much more. But I have high hopes for unconventional thinking.

"When a distinguished but elderly scientist states that something is possible, he is almost certainly right. When he states that something is impossible, he is very probably wrong." -- Arthur C. Clarke

[gargoiler00]

> lithium-ion batteries (the latter were under active development), but they're now the primary power sources for portable devices, and lithium-ion batteries power the Tesla Model S.

What does that mean for the user. Do batteries today last twice what they lasted 30 years ago? Nope. Are rechargeable batteries any more viable today? Nope.

Even batteries in laptops only last a year or so before they are just dead and need replacing.

If you think battery technology has really massively improved in the last 30 years, please let me know what real world improvements there have been...

[lutusp]

> What does that mean for the user. Do batteries today last twice what they lasted 30 years ago? Nope. Are rechargeable batteries any more viable today? Nope.

You are flat wrong on both counts. Modern batteries provide much more energy per size, weight and cost than their rechargeable predecessors. As to "viable", how can you make any kind of claim about batteries that didn't exist 30 years ago?

> Even batteries in laptops only last a year or so before they are just dead and need replacing.

Yes -- compared to no batteries and no laptops, 30 years ago. What kind of comparison do you think you're making?

> If you think battery technology has really massively improved in the last 30 years, please let me know what real world improvements there have been...

Today, batteries exist, and applications exist, that did not exist 30 years ago. Modern battery applications could not be filled by the technology that existed 30 years ago. How difficult is that to decode? Thirty years ago, the Tesla Model S could not exist, period, full stop. The battery technology didn't exist.

Chart of battery energy density by year:

http://www.akbars.net/images/battery%20energy%20density.png

[gargoiler00]

My first laptop was an Amstrad PPC512 in the mid 80s - almost 30 years ago. I'm still not convinced batteries have come that far since then.

I'm actually thinking of going back to my nokia which has a battery that lasts a week on standby. Compared to modern smartphones which last a day.

You're right though - Inefficient bloated buggy software is becoming the driving force for requiring more power from batteries - going back to my original point - I don't want software running my car.

Agree to disagree eh

[lutusp]

> I'm still not convinced batteries have come that far since then.

Then you're suffering from evidence immunity:

http://www.akbars.net/images/battery%20energy%20density.png

The above graph shows that batteries have improved enormously in the past 30 years -- they now have more than twice the energy density they had then. There are few products that have improved so dramatically. And more improvements are in the pipeline:

http://www.treehugger.com/clean-technology/new-lithium-ion-b...

Quote: "Breakthrough lithium-ion battery can recharge 1,000x faster than current tech"

> Agree to disagree eh ...

This is not a matter of opinion. It's a matter of fact.

[jccooper]

"I don't want software running my car."

Too late. Every car since about 1993 is entirely reliant on electronic computers, and many were even in 1980. Most of them reprogrammable, though usually cumbersome to do so.

[jccooper]

"I don't want software running my car."

Too late. Every car since about 1993 is entirely reliant on electronic computers--and many were much earlier. Most of them reprogrammable, though usually cumbersome to do so. Changing software during service is common these days--and the dealer may not even bother to mention it.

Tesla's use of software is pretty normal. Go sit in BMW 5 series, or a Ford Focus. All soft interface. Tesla's is just nicer, and not afraid of taking advantage of the fact that everything is software already.