[AnimalMuppet]

Freedom to say (almost) anything, publicly, including criticism of the elite and powerful.

Freedom to do, to create a business with far fewer roadblocks than in, say, Europe.

Freedom to go, to travel anywhere in a really large country, with no borders or restrictions.

Yeah, you can quote me all the caveats. They're there; I don't deny them. But: Freedom to say, freedom to do, and freedom to go. Those are really big deals.

[pixdamix]

> Freedom to say (almost) anything, publicly, including criticism of the elite and powerful.

Most European nations strongly protect free speech, allowing open public critique and satire of politicians, the wealthy, and the powerful.

> Freedom to do, to create a business with far fewer roadblocks than in, say, Europe.

Several European countries actually lead global easy business rankings, some offering fully digital, single-day company registration, very little bureaucracy (not mine, sadly)

> Freedom to go, to travel anywhere in a really large country, with no borders or restrictions.

The schengen zone grants passport-free travel across 29 nations, spanning thousands of miles without a single border checkpoint.

[artisinal]

> The schengen zone grants passport-free travel across 29 nations, spanning thousands of miles without a single border checkpoint.

Not anymore. I got stopped between The Netherlands and Germany, between France and Spain, Denmark and Sweden. Germany has border checkpoints with most of its bordering countries.

That is unheard of in the USA. You can travel thousands of kilometers without getting stopped by authorities for checking your passport or identity card.

[dgellow]

> Not anymore. I got stopped between The Netherlands and Germany, between France and Spain, Denmark and Sweden. Germany has border checkpoints with most of its bordering countries.

Schengen allows to have temporary border controls, you can see the, here: https://home-affairs.ec.europa.eu/policies/schengen/schengen...

I also was really surprised to get controlled between Germany and Denmark. But it’s not the same as the old border checkpoints. Though I wish that didn’t exist

[lovich]

Eh, we kinda can’t crow about that with ICE now, especially since it’s not just at known checkpoints where they are demanding papers.

Free speech is also on the outs since we’re having people getting jailed for not carrying the flame appropriately with regards to the late Mr Kirk.

Oh, and people getting prosecuted for 8647 as the powers at be decided to interpret that as a death threat instead of call to impeach.

[artisinal]

The numbers aren’t very clear but from what I can read online I see that the border checks in Germany resulted in a couple thousand deportations. Hundred of thousands of people checked.

Not comparing that to ICE as deportations in the EU are typically peaceful.

[lovich]

If you can be compelled to produce your papers or get arrested by ICE then everyone will have to have their papers on them. ICE and leaders in this admin are also stating that they are aiming for millions of deportations.

[dgellow]

Europe isn’t a single country. We have multiple countries where you can create a company in no time, with little capital. And have freedom of movement within the whole EU

[retired]

> And have freedom of movement within the whole EU

To a certain degree. In the US you can drive to another state thousands of kilometers away and decide to just live there for the rest of your life.

[dgellow]

I can do the same within the EU, what difference are you pointing at?

[retired]

I moved to Spain from The Netherlands as a Dutch citizen. It was a lot of paperwork, lots of planning, needed close to €10k in my bank account and needed to get private healthcare with a pretty serious health check. I had to do multiple trips to the national police office and municipalities.

That is not needed when you switch states in the US. You just need to update your address and tax records. You do not needed to show financial means and you do not need private healthcare.

[dgellow]

That’s surprising, I only had to announce my departure, arrival, and switch my insurance when moving between countries in the EU

Edit: looking into it I see that Spain has a more complicated process, indeed. thanks for the info, I didn’t know, I will need to read more about it