[nish1500]

I've run a tech business on three continents, and nothing comes close to the Kafkaesque labyrinth of the German world.

Everything is unbelievably complicated and over-engineered, and every layer is immune to change. Every rule was rational when it was added, and now everyone has a financial stake in continued complexity. The German notary is the highest-paid notary in the world, and the highest-earning professional in the country.

That said, I think a lot of the frustration comes from a mismatch of expectations. Germany wasn't designed for randos to start companies and thrust change on society. All the bureaucracy is a filter, and what it filters out is change itself.

You were never supposed to incorporate a company. You were supposed to get a job at Volkswagen.

[ghusto]

> You were never supposed to incorporate a company. You were supposed to get a job at Volkswagen.

This is it. They can't fathom a world in which people do their own thing.

What gives me pause for thought though, is the fact that the German economy does comparitively well within the EU.

[ivankra]

> German economy does comparitively well within the EU.

That's well in the past. It's at the bottom in the EU by GDP growth now, and little hope for a come back.

[selfmodruntime]

Germany is generally averse to any kind of social mobility.

[roncesvalles]

I would say Europe in general. And I get the sense they don't aspire to social mobility either, the way Americans do.

[1718627440]

Honestly why should I? As long as I have anything I want.

[roncesvalles]

The causality might not be what you think. You're happy with what you have because you don't see a path to getting substantially more.

[mlrtime]

Because other people aren't you, and it creates a ceiling of opportunity to the people that aspire to be more than average.

[selfmodruntime]

German notaries, unlike anywhere in the world, get a percantage of a done deal. That is just insane.

[SapporoChris]

Why is this insane?

"The notary serves as a neutral party ensuring both buyer and seller understand their obligations. In 2026, combined notary and land registry fees typically range from 1.5% to 2% of the property price."

This is actually lower than the real estate agent percentage in USA which can be 5 to 6% split between two agents.

Also, the GP "The German notary is the highest-paid notary in the world, and the highest-earning professional in the country."

I thought for sure pilots, aviation specialists, medical fields would earn more. I'm dubious of the claims that a notary is the highest earning profession. Perhaps some cherry picking is being done.

[selfmodruntime]

Notaries aren't real estate agents. Real estate agent's are optional, but if you use one you'll pay 3.5% to 7%. You can't skip a notary, even if you're doing a deal for many millions or even billions of Euros.

> I thought for sure pilots, aviation specialists, medical fields would earn more

You'd be thinking wrong. A notary in Germany's largest cities can earn in a day what a doctor earns in a year.

[trymas]

I am neither from Germany nor USA, thus can only assume it's similar to what I experienced elsewhere in EU.

Notary's job in real estate deals is (briefly) to check that property is good for sale (has all necessary documents, up to date drawings, liabilities (mortgages, upstanding payments for services), there's no court orders upon the property, etc.) and inform seller, buyer (and creditor if there's a mortgage), what documents to bring and who pays who by which date. Also sends copies to national registry of real estate.

It does not matter if property is a shack for 10k€ or mansion for 5M€ - you pay a percentage on the value. I'd even argue that more expensive properties are easier to work with, because rich owners have their papers up to date, etc. And notary gets cool 50-100k€ from such property deal just to go through a list of procedural checkboxes and filling in blanks in a standard contract.

I don't know what actual legal liability for notaries exist if there's serious disputes, but I haven't heard any. Biggest real estate scandals are when someone develops somewhere where it's not allowed, but got approval through corruption. Notaries neither help, nor care here, because their responsiblity is only check that papers are good (not that they were acquired through corruption).

I forgot what's the actual percentage in my country, but it's in ballpark as for OP (maybe less - around ~1%, which is still too much). To make it worse: this fee is mandated by law and has a cap. So if you are top 1% property owner - you get reduced rates for notary!

I don't know what real estate angents are responsible for in USA, but notary is not a real estate agent. Where I live you can buy/sell without real estate agent (but many people still do), notary is mandatory (with law mandated fees) though.

[nish1500]

"...notaries, historically the highest-paid freelancers in the country. On average, they earn €356,000 per year. Or, put another way: the equivalent of 37.4 years' salary for a childcare worker."

https://www.wiwo.de/erfolg/beruf/grosse-einkommensunterschie...

A German notary handling a €1 million residential purchase typically earns 3 to 6 times as much in fees as a Dutch notary handling an equivalent transaction and assuming the same legal responsibility.

[SapporoChris]

That's very strange, because I look at the highest paid professions in Germany and I consistently don't see notary in the top five.

https://www.ue-germany.com/blog/top-10-highest-paying-jobs-i... https://www.euronews.com/business/2025/06/21/highest-paying-...

Lastly, https://optisalary.com/salary?job=notary-public&country=germ... shows notarys making Estimated Yearly Salary: 34,593 EUR which is about 1/10th of what https://www.wiwo.de/erfolg/beruf/grosse-einkommensunterschie... is showing.

[selfmodruntime]

That's because the professions you're looking for are sorted by fixed income.

[ondra]

I do not know about this being the case in Germany only; I am in a nearby country and the system is very similar. I also do think it is insane, as the fee is on top of the real estate agent fees, it is specified by the law and unavoidable, and I get a service I do not really need or want and it costs a lot of money.

[markvdb]

Same here.

[m_fayer]

Hit the nail on the head. These bureaucratic obstacles are also a manifestation of a culture. A culture that will, in a subconscious and subtle manner, sneer bristle and balk at you, who dared to start a company. What’s wrong with you and who do you think you are, comes the message. Why isn’t what we all do good enough for you, comes the demand.

[selfmodruntime]

If in the slim chance of you making it big, the people around you will sneer and balk, calling you a rich tick who should be paying more into a failing system

[earcar]

Can't agree with you more.

[artemonster]

and just read these awful comments defending this nonsense and shifting the blame. so much arrogance its nauseating

[TulliusCicero]

Germans will say they're not very patriotic, but really the way German patriotism manifests is a resistance to outside criticism paired with a stubborn insistence that things ought not change.

[selfmodruntime]

More like a stubborn insistence that their way is right and ultimately, the only way.

[lazyasciiart]

I haven’t seen it manifest any differently elsewhere?

[TulliusCicero]

Americans on the Internet will often heartily agree with foreigners about all kinds of things that are shit in America and need to be changed: public transit, walkability, health care costs, university costs, money in politics, lack of basic geographic knowledge, etc.

Of course there are some more conservative folks who may be more resistant to those critiques, but the average American will just nod along. If you mention on this website that healthcare in the US can be insanely expensive, you'll mostly see agreement from Americans.

[mlrtime]

>f you mention on this website that healthcare in the US can be insanely expensive, you'll mostly see agreement from Americans.

Because conservatives/progressives agree on this. What they disagree on is how to fix it.

[lazyasciiart]

Americans on the internet don't have confederate flags up and vote for Trump either. If you wanted to talk about how patriotism manifests on the internet, say so.

[TulliusCicero]

Americans IRL only rarely have Confederate flags these days. If you want to discuss the extreme right, say so.

[DiscourseFan]

Yeah but those guys are also complaining about shit and agree with people from outside who make those same complaints. Its just that they are wackos.

[selfmodruntime]

There's a German proverb I enjoy. "Am deutschen Wesen soll die Welt genesen", which roughly means "The world shall be healed through the German spirit/nature."

It implies German cultural and/or moral superiority and was used in earnest during the 19th century by nationalists. It's use often has a more ironic character now, but it's proponents are alive and well.

[1718627440]

Yeah that is the idea which materialized in getting colonies at the turn of the previous century and in the actions of the third empire. I don't think that sentiment is shared by a sizable population anymore.

[selfmodruntime]

German arrogance, namely that we‘re doing it best and that our way is the only way, is still alive and kicking.

[1718627440]

Maybe, but also every past government has started with the promise of cutting bureaucracy down. One of the point is to improve the situation for startups. So this is a well-known issue and the idea that this is already the optimum is not believed in the general population.