[dsign]

Say what you may of Temu, and I do think more vetting of certain goods is a good idea, but they fill a very real need. In the part of Europe where I live, the choice is only between intermediaries for the same products coming from China. The local intermediaries sell a very limited picking at staggering margins. And when it comes to certain things, like electronic components, the choice is between importing (old) American stock with a German company as the intermediary, and that's $$$$ and many weeks of shipping, or using Temu or Aliexpress.

There's something unpleasantly snobbish with the way business is done here, a spirit of "if you have to ask the price, our business is not for you". For example, in Instagram, "Local offerings" pop up all the time in the feed. The ones which are truly local end up in a "call us to know more" button, no pricing info disclosed. The ones that show actual prices tend to be shell companies with no employees, no doubt a thin wrapper around an importer from Asia.

[BrtByte]

But I still think chargers and children's toys are exactly where the line should be drawn

[lopis]

My line is a little bit further back. Any electronics that will be plugged to a wall... Lots of appliances are not safe.

[ben_w]

Yup. I've even had an (Amazon rather than Temu) power-strip-and-USB combo noticeably sparking and tripping the apartment circuit breakers when plugged in just 6 months after purchase.

[aDyslecticCrow]

Could we interest you in some amazons choice fuses? never more be concerned about replacing a fuse! as these ones, simply wont need replacing! (they survive 5-10x their rated current)

https://youtu.be/B90_SNNbcoU

[Chaosvex]

It's a little amusing that he's seemingly linked to the dangerous fuses using his Amazon affiliate links. Hey, may well make a buck if someone's going to buy them anyway, right?

[xingped]

I think the affiliate links work such that any product bought when the lead into the site is the affiliate code will generate affiliate rewards. So even if you don't buy the crap that's linked, maybe you'll buy something else and that counts.

[alopha]

Amazon is does zero quality control on listings, it's just AliExpress which larger margins. At least the reviews at Aliexpress often include exhaustive detail & photos by the terminally skeptical.

[pseudohadamard]

I was wondering when the EU was going to fine Temu West, aka. Amazon, given they sell things that are just as dangerous.

[ben_w]

5 years ago.

Though after enough appeals, Amazon found a court willing to annul the verdict and force the regulator who issued the fine to reexamine: https://www.reuters.com/legal/government/win-amazon-luxembou...

[selfhoster1312]

I think the line should be much earlier than that. But even with this very thin line, like the parent said, the deficient products are everywhere. Just look at the recalls in any major store here (Carrefour, Action, Leclerc). And that's for the main brands/distributors, go into any bazaar or market and you'll find the exact same products you find on Aliexpress/Temu, but with 10x price markup, like the parent said.

Don't get me wrong. I think companies should be held to higher standards: i just don't understand why only Temu is being held responsible of the entire broken capitalist system.

[AnthonyMouse]

There are generally two ways governments hold companies accountable for dangerous products.

The first is liability. If they're selling chargers that burn down houses, they get sued, and they don't want to get sued, so they don't want to sell chargers that burn down houses.

The second is regulatory requirements. This one is generally worse. The incumbents capture the regulators to e.g. have the law require their technology or raise costs to exclude new entrants. The rules are often inefficient or poorly conceived with bad cost/benefit ratios. And companies making products that are dangerous but nevertheless comply with the rules will point to their checkbox compliance to dodge liability.

The problem with the first one is that it doesn't work well against companies outside the jurisdiction, because then you can't sue them, and the importer will be a small entity that just files for bankruptcy if you try to sue them. But the second one has the exact same problem. They sell products that don't comply with the rules; if you try to fine them they're outside the jurisdiction and the only thing in the jurisdiction is a fungible importer that will dissolve if you try to go after them.

In that environment the thing that actually works is the third thing. Customers expect some products to be dangerous and rely on product reviews to determine which ones. But this is the thing the second one inhibits, because then overpriced incumbents use their influence over the laws to target any new supplier that tries to establish a trusted brand, which causes the foreign suppliers to have to sell through dozens of unknown labels so they can continue to dissolve them if any of them get prosecuted. And then customers are stuck choosing between the overpriced incumbents and the far cheaper foreign suppliers that may or may not be safe, with many people risking the latter because they have so much lower margins.

[rcxdude]

EU CE requirements are generally (outside some universally more regulated domains like medical devices) pretty lightweight to deal with, and pretty sensible. I've gone through them, and honestly the biggest pain is finding the applicable standard. Otherwise you basically just need to follow the standard and write up how you think your design follows it, and stick it into a drawer, most likely never to be seen again. You usually have to cause a very notable problem or be very obviously breaking the rules to get the regulator's attention.

[AnthonyMouse]

How does that help you if someone is drop shipping fire hazards and trying to prosecute them means they just dissolve and create a new shell company?

Also, how does it get you anything over simple liability for fraud and harm? Why does the honest seller have to write a document if nobody is going to look at it and the dishonest one is going to skip doing it anyway?

[selfhoster1312]

I think the point of the parent, correct me if i'm wrong, was precisely that current EU regulations are insufficient in protecting customers and really not a burden to put any product on the market, and that anyone arguing regulation is against the little guy is talking in bad faith.

[croon]

We've already tried the third one in the US before the FDA. A ton of people kept dying.

Milk was filled with borax and formaldehyde, coffee was cut with sawdust/charred bone/lead, spices were often 100% counterfeit.

The market (heavily) incentivized fraud.

In New York, in one year (1857), 8000 infants died to "swill milk" [0].

The second option (FDA and regulation) wasn't lobbied for, and the Food Bill of 1902 actually failed through heavy (counter)lobbying initially [1], until the Pure Food and Drug Act of 1906 [2] passed.

[0] https://timesmachine.nytimes.com/timesmachine/1858/05/13/785...

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Harvey_Washington_Wiley

[2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pure_Food_and_Drug_Act

[broken-kebab]

Invoking 1857 is not a valid argument really, cause consumer priorities were different. Cheaper with some level of risk (which today's American, or German would consider excessive) was preferred option hence the market response as it was - at least it's a reasonable guess.

In less rich countries it is how things work right now.

[croon]

Industries dump toxic waste into waterways if they can get away with it in the US today (literally today [0]). I agree that I might not be specifically worried about borax milk if FDA was reversed, but I would absolutely expect risky shortcuts in food offerings.

The incentives in the market has never changed. That's what regulation is for, shifting market incentives/forces to favor consumers/society.

[0] https://www.kptv.com/2026/05/28/woman-sentenced-conspiring-d...

[pjc50]

> Customers expect some products to be dangerous and rely on product reviews to determine which ones.

.. which are of course the easiest thing to fake.

> then overpriced incumbents use their influence over the laws to target any new supplier that tries to establish a trusted brand, which causes the foreign suppliers to have to sell through dozens of unknown labels so they can continue to dissolve them if any of them get prosecuted.

This is not an accurate description of new market entry for .. well, anything? And what are the new entrants being prosecuted for? Is it by any chance unsafe products?

[AnthonyMouse]

> .. which are of course the easiest thing to fake.

How do you get Consumer Reports to publish a fake product review? Can you point to even one instance of that actually happening?

> This is not an accurate description of new market entry for .. well, anything?

Huawei is a pretty conspicuous example of it actually happening. They were starting to establish a brand and then regulatory destruction was imposed. Meanwhile there seem to be a huge number of other products from the same country with white labels or rotating unknown brands for some reason even though they probably come out of the same factory.

> And what are the new entrants being prosecuted for? Is it by any chance unsafe products?

That there is a difference between regulatory compliance and actual safety is obviously the point. All the incumbents need is for the rules to be complicated enough that compliance requires you to be a massive bureaucracy, or that nobody is really complying but selective enforcement gets imposed when someone undesirable is starting to look like a real challenger.

[selfhoster1312]

> How do you get Consumer Reports to publish a fake product review?

No need. Just have dozens of companies produce hundreds of new junk products every year. Then there's no way all products can be reviewed, and no way they can be properly reviewed: what's interesting about a review is the failure mode of the products, which you have no idea about when you have 10 new Samsung smartphones coming out every year.

> [Huawei] were starting to establish a brand and then regulatory destruction was imposed. selective enforcement gets imposed when someone undesirable is starting to look like a real challenger.

Yes, selective enforcement is the problem. Not regulations. Regulations are not strong enough. But they need to be applied evenly. Why is it legal for Apple and Samsung to produce junk, but not Huawei? (rhetorical question, please don't answer) We need proper consumer protection. Any company producing a product should have 10 years or 20 years warranty, and should be legally mandated to produce/sell spare parts for 20+ years (as in, real spare parts, not "replacement motherboard" which costs the entire smartphone).

Suddenly, the junk makers would produce less junk. Maybe there'd only be a new Samsung/iPhone every 5 years, but it would probably be as solid and repairable as older Nokias.

[idiotsecant]

You sure typed a lot to say 'a few kids are going to get the skin melted off their face by an exploding battery, that's just the cost of doing business!'

[AnthonyMouse]

Notice that you fail to present any argument and are only retreating into indignation at the existence of the problem. You present no viable solution or counterargument to the criticism of the status quo.

[selfhoster1312]

Jail the executives and engineers cutting corners. For some reason, you can spend years in jail for cannabis possession or an online post criticizing Macron or the police, but people who actually commit murder and ecocide by cutting costs in engineering products, or who import such bad-quality products face exactly zero consequences.

Then we can't drink our water, can't eat anything from our soil, sometimes can't even breathe our air. But we are the only ones facing consequences while the rich fuckers are partying on yachts.

[kergonath]

> i just don't understand why only Temu is being held responsible of the entire broken capitalist system

They are not really. If one of the big brand shop is found importing stuff with fake certificate, they’ll experience the same thing. One of the advantage of the stores you mention is that they have a procedure for recalls, and their responsibility is on the line if they sell faulty goods. Good luck getting anything from Temu or AliExpress in the same situation (at least Amazon is very good with this).

[selfhoster1312]

So, then again, i'm not defending Temu. That being said, i doubt my local supermarkets face any kind of consequences. I mean, i just have to look at the AMAZING list of industrial scandals here in Europe over the last 30 years to know consequences are zero: mad cow, horse meat scandal, Volkswagen emissions, Uber claiming to not be an employer, Nestlé's "mineral" water, Mediator scandal, 2008 subprime crisis, France Télécom management/suicide scandal, etc etc.

I can't name a single executive that was jailed over this period here in France. Yet if the law was applied justly thousands of executives and engineers would rot in jail and the world would arguably be a much better place because it would provide incentives for companies to actually behave and not destroy our planet and livelihoods. So are companies really taking responsibility for the lives they destroy? Not so sure.

[onesingleblast]

I got a charger with a bluetooth speaker once (not from temu) and it came apart inside the outlet with the prongs sticking out from it.

[AussieWog93]

I've bought both from AliExpress before and they were fine. Just required common sense.

[BobAliceInATree]

This is why we have UL listings in USA and Canada. So you don’t have to rely on “common sense” which is notoriously unreliable.

[Broken_Hippo]

Common sense? What sort of common sense allows you to remotely assess the safety and build of a product? Even if you get a charger in your hand, can you tell?

Can your family? How about your neibhbors? Does anyone you know have this ability?

There is no common sense to be had here. There are people with more specialized information that I have that look into this. There are laws to address this - and I'm pretty sure these laws were written with the blood of folks killed by faulty products.

[idiotsecant]

No, you rolled the dice and won. Don't attribute to wisdom that which is explainable by very, very dumb luck

[nick__m]

It's so cheaper that you can buy 2, disassemble one and inspect the electronic (spot thermometer and a cheap ESR tester). it's a charger not a nuclear power plant !

[retired]

If you ban Temu chargers, people will go to stores to buy the cheapest ones which are identical to the ones on Temu, just for 10x the price.

Edit: Reply to Scroll_Swe as I am rate-limited to posting new comments. The chargers in budget stores are identical to Temu chargers are are frequently recalled.

[tobz1000]

At least in the UK, the main high-street retailers will only stock goods from reputable brands with a (relatively) decent track record and safety standards. I don't believe there is any intersection between products sold on Temu and e.g. Argos, John Lewis.

[retired]

Not in The Netherlands. Plenty of stores that stock chargers identical to the ones on AliExpress and Temu. Action, Big Bazar, SoLow.

Edit: Reply to lozenge as I am still rate-limited by HN. Some of them get recalled, the vast majority of them are still being sold and could burn your house down.

[lozenge]

At least they get recalled. I don't think any Temu products are getting recalled.

[RobotToaster]

Identical chargers to temu ones are sold on amazon for 5x the price.

[justincormack]

So Amazon should be prosecuted too.

[shmeeed]

No no, it's third party sellers. There's absolutely nothing that can be done about that!

[kergonath]

This talking point is everywhere in this thread. But bear in mind that you have no clue whether two chargers (for example) are the same without disassembling them and checking. Noname Chinese manufacturers are very good at producing things that are superficially similar to other things. It does not mean that two widgets that look similar actually are.

The main difference with most physical stores is that those will accept responsibility for the stuff they sell, because otherwise regulations would put them out of business.

[ceejayoz]

> But bear in mind that you have no clue whether two chargers (for example) are the same without disassembling them and checking.

Frequently, the listing uses the exact same photo.

It's especially clear for clothes listings, as there's usually a model.

[Scroll_Swe]

Nope, Anker or store brand is NOT identical to Temu crap.

[Rohansi]

Dollar store stock is likely identical to Temu.

[bombcar]

No, dollar store is a rank above the rankest shit from Temu.

There’s name brand (Apple, Anker, etc → made in China but made well), then there’s off-brand (cheaper than above but still made decently), then store-brand (Harbor Freight and friends, too; cheaper but still functional, not quite as nice), then dollar-store brand (barely functional but usually still “safe”), then Temu-shit (often not fit for purpose and fake certifications, actually dangerous).

[Scroll_Swe]

Ok, well if it blows up the store is the importer and responsible.

In EU, if you buy Temu, you are the importer and you become responsible for CE marking breaches etc. 0 help for you.

*My bad this USED TO be the case but not anymore apparently

[DANmode]

No, let them suck on the poison Happy Meal toy instead.

The line should be drawn by parents.

The paternalism really has gone too far,

and people are (incorrectly and dangerously) expecting to be protected now.

[WheatMillington]

A major retailer in my country had to recall thousands of units of kids kinetic sand because it contained asbestos. Are you saying we'd be better off had they not been made to recall these? Or that we'd be worse off had there been more regulation preventing kids from inhaling asbestos in the first place?

[DANmode]

Nope.

[greggsy]

With that thinking, people would still be buying unlabelled arsenic wallpaper.

Consumer standards are a net benefit to society.

> and people are (incorrectly and dangerously) expecting to be protected now.

The general public hasn’t the faintest idea how to differentiate between a safe product and an unsafe one, and they shouldn’t have to

[AnthonyMouse]

> The general public hasn’t the faintest idea how to differentiate between a safe product and an unsafe one, and they shouldn’t have to

The problem being that a marketplace platform with millions of small sellers has no reasonable way to do this either.

[kergonath]

Then, that marketplace has no viable business. Society does not owe them anything. Seriously, if your business model requires you to sell illegal stuff, then your company does not deserve to survive. That’s the basics of regulation.

[AnthonyMouse]

You're assuming the conclusion. Why is it the marketplace platform who should be the police? Should banks have to audit your life before you can open a bank account? Should you be unable to transact with anyone if you're not rich enough for them to justify that expense?

It's not Walmart you're proposing to unperson here.

[DANmode]

And yet you still have children chewing toxic chunks of gypsum drywall,

because people now assume if you can buy it, it’s safe,

because their responsibility has been relieved of them.

[BenjiWiebe]

I'm not understanding your example; as far as I know gypsum/gypsum drywall isn't toxic.

[DANmode]

If you let your kid eat drywall compounds, and inhale drywall dust in the process, you’re not only missing my point, you’re proving it.

[Freak_NL]

It's all fun and games until your neighbour in a terraced house or apartment building unwittingly starts an uncontrollable battery fire. Electric scooters and those 'hoover boards' from a few years ago are notorious when it comes to that, but plenty of underspecced small electronics will fail spectacularly.

[DANmode]

That’s harder to disagree with,

but, you’re only going to achieve moving the cheapo builders stateside where they’re easier to enforce on.

That race to the bottom isn’t going anywhere - if someone can save a grand half-heartedly wrapping their own packs, they’re going to.

[davkan]

Personally I’m happy to not have to perform that level personal due diligence for all aspects of my consumption and engagement with society and to instead pay more to reduce my risk via regulation, even if that’s less effective.

And I think that sentiment is significantly more representative of the populace outside of some edge cases around speech and vices. The vast majority of people do not want to have to investigate if their food has too much rat shit in it. They want the rat shit out of the meat or the meat not to be on the shelves.

[ascorbic]

Are parents supposed to perform safety and toxicity testing on all products they buy?

[DANmode]

“Supposed to”?

I’ll do whatever reading, and due diligence keeps my family safe.

I’ll abstain from things until I’m sure.

Others might choose the same.

[Broken_Hippo]

How can you be sure? How can you get the information to know whether or not your children's toys, your medicines, your electic equipment, wall paint, food, and everything else you consume or use is safe?

You can't. So... abstain from everything? Make everything yourself - how will you have time with a job? Will you know the food you grow is safe and that your ground isn't polluted with things you can't test for at home? How about the equipment used to make that food - is the metal in that plow made of lead? Is the engine on the tractor safe?

Your due diligence is only possible because other people - usually with specialized education and/or experience - have made laws and standards to keep you safe. You don't have to personally check everything.

[DANmode]

I don’t need to know if the plow has lead - I just test the Cheerios.

Try again.

You can answer the questions the exact same ways the other path uses,

yes,

and often with more rigor/vigor than just “legal minimum”.

[kergonath]

There are markings that certify that some things are safe according to some standards. You are not in a situation to know what actually is safe or to be able to test it (really, you are not; if you think you are, go talk to your nearest electrical engineer, chemist, or molecular biologist who will provide you several examples of the limitations of your knowledge and abilities). Therefore, trusting those certifications is important, and companies that falsify them must be punished so they stop doing so. It’s not complicated and that’s the whole point of the procedure (and the fine).

[DANmode]

> whatever reading, and due diligence keeps my family safe.

We’re not disagreeing.

[kergonath]

> but they fill a very real need.

That is not a good reason to fudge certifications and sell dangerous goods. I sympathise with your use case, but the solution is not "let’s just import whatever, as long as it’s cheap".

[selcuka]

The GP also said "vetting of certain goods is a good idea".

[stdatomic]

Really hits hard when you have to go to Home Depot to buy 6 spade connectors for $7.99 to use in a project with 3.3V 300mA max, when you can buy about 500 of them from Aliexpress for the same price.

[handle584]

Until you learn the hard way that they are not up to the standard advertised, if they happen to be rated in the first place. It is common knowledge that Chinese manufacturers maintains at least three configs of the same product, the best one sent off for rating, the middle for knowledgeable buyers, the worst being the 500-for-$7.99 shit for the mass market, who buys nothing but the cheapest.

[theshrike79]

And this is how I ended up with bags full of resistors, transistors, leds etc.

I can buy 3 from the local store or a BAG OF ONE HUNDRED from Aliexpress.

Not a hard decision tbh.

[bombcar]

It’s not a hard decision - and I was making it wrong for many years.

Now I gladly pay Home Depot or friends to maintain stock for me so my house isn’t filled with bags of shit I’ll never practically use.

[munk-a]

I know your mileage may vary in different areas of Europe but in Italy and Spain you'll find a plethora of random general stores that resell Aliexpress sorts of goods at a very low markup over direct ordering. The stock variety is obviously more limited but those stores are amazing and fit a really key need.

[thesimon]

These stores are a big thing in Portugal as well, but doesn't really seem to be a thing in Germany. Closest I guess would be Action [1].

[1]: https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Action_Nederland

[leonhard]

What are these stores in Spain/Italy/Portugal?

[Doohickey-d]

The ones in Spain often market themselves with their Chinese-ness: "Hyper China", "Panda Bazaar", "Maxi Barato (super cheap)", etc. would be some representative names & signage you see outside.

They range in size from small shops to things with huge floor space.

One thing I've found is that they seem to sell very low quality stuff: e.g. on aliexpress you can buy a flashlight which is built out of metal, has usb-c charging, for $10, whereas in the physical shop, you get the plastic one that takes AA batteries for $2. So they're not a replacement for AliExpress, Temu & co.

[munk-a]

Most of the ones I'm thinking of are just corner stores - it's not a brand or chain to my knowledge. An example might be Bazar Gran Puerto, El Puerto de Sta Maria, CA, ES.

[nekzn]

How about TEDi?

[registeredcorn]

> The ones which are truly local end up in a "call us to know more" button, no pricing info disclosed.

I cannot speak for the specific part of Europe that you are in, but in the professional Photography community, it is common practice to not list prices and instead have a "contact us" option. The reason isn't a, "Look at us, we're so exclusive and fancy!" Rather, if you list a price for various packages, people get scared off or think they are a master negotiator and can essentially get the work done for free. All of the professionals I've spoken to are happy to work with customers to find a package at an affordable price for them, or at least recommend other professionals in whatever price range they have in mind. The issue is that its exceptionally hard to convey that in a sincere, real way because if someone only sees a price of say $10 000 or whatever, they are naturally going to assume that you cannot possibly get anything for $100-$1 000.

In truth though, many are glad to try and accommodate and get people something that they will be happy with. Perhaps it ends up being 1 or 2 photos instead of an album of photos or whatever, or perhaps the photoshoot is a little bit more "low budget" than a standard one, but there is still lots of opportunity to get the client something they will be happy with. People tend to get wrapped up in the bottom line though, and just assume that they can't afford to capture a happy memory because of the cost - that's something that photographers really want to avoid because (aside from scaring off paying customers! :) ) it means less photos existing, or making it feel impossibly hard to ever show an interest in photography, which is very sad for people who live and breath it.

[dingaling]

> Rather, if you list a price for various packages, people get scared off

Yet somehow other businesses manage to convey tiered pricing without scaring customers.

Imagine trying to book a hotel room but were told to contact them because they have a range of rooms from single bed to honeymoon suite. "We couldn't possibly list all the packages, it would confuse you!"

Or try to buy a car, but the dealer refused to list a base price because "we have so many options it's meaningless".

Withholding guideline or indicative pricing is a deliberate obfuscation designed to increase friction and reduce choice.

[ktallett]

There is some validity to a marketplace selling items from a larger range of retailers, however the quality is so poor for many items that it simply is no good for society in any way.

[everforward]

> the quality is so poor for many items that it simply is no good for society in any way.

There are some that are genuinely dangerous and bad for society, but there are tons of goods that are "the same thing but half the price because it lasts a quarter the time" that have genuine utility.

Harbor Freight has basically made a drop-shipping business out of it. I often have tools that I need but will probably use 4 times in my life, and the Harbor Freight stuff is crap but will probably work 4 times.

Copy that over a bunch of verticals and it starts to make sense. Clothing for a costume I'll wear maybe twice, niche cooking gadgets for very specific things, tools to do a one-time repair on a car, a flash drive to turn over photos to family members, yada yada.

[verall]

I think the dirty secret is that a lot of it is not "1/2 the price that lasts 1/4 the time" but "1/4 the price that lasts 9/10 the time" or "1/2 the price for the exact same product without half of the budget going to marketing".

It's not all of it. Some things are seriously worse quality. But really a ton of the "better quality" is just better marketing.

[retired]

> Clothing for a costume I'll wear maybe twice

There was a time where society didn't buy clothes to only wear once or twice but would instead rent them for those occasions.

[doubled112]

> some that are genuinely dangerous ... tools that I need but will probably use 4 times in my life, and the Harbor Freight stuff is crap but will probably work 4 times

Forehead hit hood, but I caught myself so it was a "gentle" reminder instead of a concussion. I should have splurged that time I broke a socket tightening an axle bolt. 150 ft-lbs + 180 degrees is a fair bit of torque.

[everforward]

There are definitely things I wouldn't roll the dice on from Harbor Freight.

Anything that unpredictably dumps large amounts of kinetic energy on failure is one of those.

I had a buddy that bought the tool for getting car suspension springs on from Harbor Freight, and I definitely wouldn't roll those dice.

[ktallett]

This assumes that we can't pass items on in life which we can or even repurpose, such as the USB key.

[runarberg]

My reaction to this sentiment is that they fill the same need in Europe as Uber did in the USA. They found a way to operate in a market while avoiding its regulations and are therefor able to offer much lower prices as their competitors who still follow the regulations.

Europe has historically had pretty strict consumer protection laws, and ever since the end of the Cold War these consumer protection laws have been slowly chipped away. When I was a kid for example companies were not allowed to target children in their marketing material. When American media became predominant in the continent, instead of enforcing our own consumer protection laws against American advertisers, regulators just ignored it and allowed it to proliferate, effectively making ads targeting children legal in the continent. Regulators have been showing the exact same inaction towards Chinese retailers breaking our own laws as they did towards American advertisers three decades ago. I foresee that consumer safety laws getting the same fate as the ban on ads targeting children.

[mytailorisrich]

There is a part of conservatism and resistance to change. Online commerce has been seen as "suspicious" by some from the beginning to the point that in, for instance, France free delivery of books is banned... of course this just means that amazon.fr charges 1 cent, instead but it is symptomatic of a state of mind.

[Barbing]

Interesting! They tried using lockers so it could still be free:

https://www.connexionfrance.com/news/amazon-is-wrong-to-use-...

[whimsicalism]

yes, i'm very in favor of the shift towards direct-to-consumer among chinese retailers, but that might be because i'm not actually all that sympathetic to small business

[ryandrake]

I recently bought some custom-built pool lighting directly from the manufacturer in Ningbo, and I have to say, the sales, delivery, and customer support I received was top notch. Their representatives were fluent in English and competent, the product quality was excellent (yes, I carefully inspected it upon receipt because it's going into water), and the entire process from measurement to delivery was fast and smooth. And, of course, the price was right.

[BrtByte]

In a way it makes the Temu problem more frustrating

[DANmode]

Because it’s not a Temu problem,

it’s a problem of allowing the collapse of your own civilization?

[markdown]

Isn't pool lighting low voltage (12v?) so not much of a risk even if faulty?

[ryandrake]

That's right, so I wasn't that worried about physical safety. Mostly worried about damage to the product that water ingress could cause.

[simplyluke]

I'm not all that sympathetic to small businesses that exist functionally as drop shippers for the same products with the same absence of support. Much in the same way I roll my eyes and go to 7/11 over the cute "local" markets that are supplied by the same suppliers nationwide, and you end up in a shiplap-walled coffee shop with $8 bags of chips that could exist anywhere.

Small businesses that do the work of curating a niche item, doing QA work that's absent on the shipments from china, and then offering much stronger aftermarket support/replacement/repair? That is often worth a (substantial) premium over wondering if the item showing up in a month is going to work as intended.

[londons_explore]

There is totally a market for a global website which instead of shipping goods direct from China by plane instead has local warehouses 1 per city and can deliver to your house within a few hours by motorbike.

Aka like Amazon but with much smaller margins.

The savings would come from the fact sea freight is so much cheaper than air freight.

[Someone]

And the losses from having warehouses storing zillions of products that do not get sold for a long time.

There’s a reason the likes of Aldi and Lidl have limited product choice.

[10000truths]

Aldi and Lidl deal with perishable goods. Temu (by and large) doesn't.

[dgellow]

Aldi and Lidl sell way more than just perishable goods. You can buy electronics from there

[avereveard]

But they are, especially those with batteries

[kergonath]

Fine, Action then.

[magicalhippo]

Several AliExpress sellers advertize warehouses in EU, so guess they basically do what you say already.

[trollbridge]

That’s called “Walmart”

[throw-the-towel]

Not in Europe.

[bibstha]

Europe has plenty of dollar store equivalent.

[beezlewax]

What part of Europe is that? Is it is in the EU?

[victorbjorklund]

Yea, worst is the retail people who clearly hated Temu/Aliexpress etc because they stand no chance at competing with them when they sell the same things but at 10 times the cost (I don’t blame them. Sucks for them) but instead of just saying the truth that they hate the competition they just make up these fake reasons ”oh it’s low quality stuff that will break” when it’s clearly the same stuff from the same factories etc.

[jeppester]

If you played a boardgame, wouldn't you be upset if someone won the game easily, because they decided to just break all the rules?

[victorbjorklund]

The rules where retail companies can extract value for no added value from consumers? And no the rules has not changed. It has always been allied to compete with importers trying to screw over consumers. Which law are you claiming was changed?

[jeppester]

The rules that make someone responsible for when a product is dangerous or broken.

How does that not add any value?

Temu is free to take the same responsibility, but they don't.

[slaw]

what kind of board game has rules buy for one coin, do nothing, sell for 10 coins?

[jeppester]

If it was that simple, surely someone would undercut all the retailers that follow the rules - while also following the rules.

Temu is just deliberately ignoring any rules.

[kalleboo]

Monopoly

[slaw]

So Temu/Aliexpress fixes the rules not breaks them. OP shouldn't be upset.

[jeppester]

How are the rules broken? How does Temu fix then?

We have rules that should prevent companies from selling broken and dangerous crap. Should I not be upset that Temu ignores those rules deliberately and floods the EU with exactly that?

[Symbiote]

> In the part of Europe where I live

I downvote comments like this, since they make the comment useless. No-one can vouch for or argue against the comment when it's some "part" of a continent of over 40 countries.

[cubefox]

Exactly. Europe is not a country. Some countries in Europe are more different from each other than others are from the US.

[Scroll_Swe]

Like what?

The clothes are all 100% plastic polyester shit with extra chemicals. If you have proof of otherwise, show me.

Yes I make enough to buy good clothes. If I REALLY need cheap clothes H&M basics are always there.

Same with anything else, IT and tech parts I shop in Sweden.

What else?

Like, what is so needed now that you did not need before but you need to buy plastic China crap from Temu now?

[Numerlor]

More niche hardware has been impossible for me to find in the EU marketplaces I got to with searches, with only availability from US ebay, and then Chinese marketplaces. Or if it does exist here it's the same used part but it costs 500€ instead of 40

[Scroll_Swe]

ah okay, I was more raging on the people buying fast fashion crap clothes, chargers and household items. All crap, all landfill quality.

[kergonath]

At least crap clothes do not risk setting your building on fire, unlike crap chargers. Some things are definitely more dangerous than others.