[M4v3R]

This kind of behavior should be met with swift and strong reaction from both the school authorities and the law enforcement. Kids responsible should be put on trial and face serious consequences including jail time for most egregious cases. Let the news cover it nationwide. "This is what will happen if you even think about creating and circulating nude pics of anyone" should be the message sent. This is the only way to prevent this behavior - not more censorship, not technical solutions

[oliwarner]

That's what we need. More children in prison. Now two lives are ruined. Just for the sake of retribution.

Redeemable children can make horrific mistakes. The job of parents, and pastoral adults is to maintain an environment where kids can exist without making irreparable, life-destroying mistakes. Let them learn, but limit the damage they can accidentally cajole themselves into doing.

That means limiting access to social media, phones and cameras. Turning the school clock back to 1995.

[barrkel]

Immature kids - and kids are by definition immature - make dumb decisions.

Certainly there needs to be repercussions, the kids need to learn, and need to be warned in advance, but kids will do dumb things.

You can talk about news coverage, but you can't force 12 year olds to watch the news, or understand how their actions have consequences. When the consequences do come, the focus needs to be primary on rehabilitation and restitution for the first instance.

[autoexec]

> "This is what will happen if you even think about creating and circulating nude pics of anyone" should be the message sent. This is the only way to prevent this behavior - not more censorship

Saying "don't make a fake picture of anybody naked or you'll go to jail and your life will be ruined forever" sure seems like a form of censorship

[Curosinono]

I do agree that shit behavour should be met with direct reaction but lets be honest here the time and effort of doing this is 5 minutes.

A proper society should educate people about things they can't get rid of anymore.

And no you can't just put teenager, which have not fully formed brains yet, into prison for fake nudity

[latexr]

> the time and effort of doing this is 5 minutes.

Yet the consequences for the victims may last a lifetime and be both intrinsic and extrinsic. Sexually forcing themselves on a drunk colleague at a party or taking their dad’s gun and shooting up their classmates also only takes a few minutes, but can scar a community for years.

I’m not going to opine on what the punishment should be, though it seems clear there should be one and more than a slap on the wrist. The community where this took place (i.e. those who are living through it) should probably have a say in it. There should also probably be an investigation of how this came to pass, i.e. has this kid always been an asshole with a pattern of behaviour or have they recently been indoctrinated by manosphere bullshit and should get counselling to understand their actions and that women are people too and deserving of respect?

[Curosinono]

The community should never have a say in this. A independent judge should do this to make sure its fair.

And there is a huge difference between clarifying with people what fake AI is vs. real nudity.

You can't just put a kid into prison because they copy pasted a head from someone onto some body.

[latexr]

> The community should never have a say in this.

Of course they should. I’m not saying they should get to unilaterally decide, but you should listen to the people who are affected. Don’t just ignore the people, the law is meant to serve them. Elected officials exist to represent the will of the constituents.

For example, let’s say you do something which is against the law but only affects the community you’re in and no one else, and the community not only doesn’t mind what you did, they are thankful. Should you be punished?

> A independent judge should do this to make sure its fair.

What do you think a judge does? They aren’t robots who only interpret a book, they listen to the people in a case and make a decision in context and within the framework of the law.

Furthermore, “independent judge” does in no way guarantee “fair”. Decades of interminably biased decisions aren’t going to stop now (definitely not with the current state of the US and its supreme court).

> You can't just put a kid into prison

Again, I’m not going to opine on what the punishment should be. I haven’t suggested a punishment, don’t argue as if I did.

> because they copy pasted a head from someone onto some body.

You’re misrepresenting what happened. The kid didn’t go in there with scissors and hastily pasted a head into a picture in a magazine. We know the state of generative AI, we can presume it was a competent fake.

[sirsinsalot]

I agree here. People are too quick to levy adult punishment and morality against children.

Teach them compassion and empathy. Teach them why their actions hurt.

[pibaker]

There are a lot more things we punish people for that take less than 5 minutes.

[Curosinono]

Thats not what i meant.

My point was that this type of technology is so easy to access and to do, its not easy to just make it illegal.

Take a picture out of the year book, copy it onto a body, done

[Henchman21]

Never a shortage of pedants on HN

[samlinnfer]

It used to be that if you wanted to see people naked you’d just use your imagination. If you really wanted you’d draw or use photoshop, but both actually required skill. AI made it too easy. Teenagers wanting to see each other naked is normal and part of the human experience.

I don’t agree with the nanny state approach. America is already too obsessed with violence being ok and any kind of sex/nudity being completely evil. I don’t have an actual answer but having a moral panic over it is not the solution.

[latexr]

> any kind of sex/nudity

Worth considering that this isn’t “any kind”, it’s a very specific kind. It’s nudity of minors they personally know, shared in their community. It’s on a different level than, say, consensual nudity from a stranger in a Playboy magazine.

[ndsipa_pomu]

I wonder if this kind of problem happens a lot less in societies that treat public nudity as normal (e.g. nude saunas, topless beaches in European/Scandinavian countries).

[ChoGGi]

If you think European kids aren't making deep fakes of other kids...

Surprise.

[GeoAtreides]

let me parse what you're saying: you're saying there are no issues with male teenagers generating deepfakes of their female friends. You're saying that's is " normal and part of the human experience."

Am I getting this wrong?

[samlinnfer]

Do you have an issue with male teenagers generating deepfakes of their female friends in their minds? What if they drew them? What if they photoshopped them? What if they had an AI make them? I suppose if I used such an uncharitable reading of your comment I would ask you're some kind of puritan supporter of thoughtcrime. Am I getting this wrong?

Being curious about other people's bodies is part of the human experience. Sharing unwanted graphic depictions of them, is not the most mature act, but doesn't rise to the level extreme punishment as advocated by the GP.

[archagon]

Rape culture starts young. This needs to be nipped in the bud.

[colpabar]

No you are correct. A lot of people seem to think that the solution is to tell all the girls who are affected by this to get over it and that they should be flattered.

[samlinnfer]

And that's still a better solution than telling them to be traumatized by fake depictions that never even happened, or allowing advocates to use this as a wedge to put more restriction on speech. At least the 2A supporters have the balls to say "from my cold dead hands", who is there stand for 1A?

[LocalH]

You misparsed. Should it be a crime for a person to imagine another person nude within their mind?

[GeoAtreides]

using AI to deepfake minors is beyond one's imagination

[LocalH]

That is not what the person you were responding to said. Let me quote the full context (emphasis mine):

> It used to be that if you wanted to see people naked you’d just use your imagination. If you really wanted you’d draw or use photoshop, but both actually required skill. AI made it too easy. Teenagers wanting to see each other naked is normal and part of the human experience.

[GeoAtreides]

I disagree, I think _you_ are misreading OP's comment and I genuinely think my interpretation is correct.

[ChoGGi]

To me the nudity isn't an issue, it's the bullying. Then again I'm not American.

[conductr]

I don’t think you understand the psychology of a teenage boys. If you do all this, all you accomplish is informing the entire nation of kids that making deepfake nudes of their classmates is possible. From there, it will proliferate much more rapidly than its current trajectory.

There’s really no way to close this Pandora’s box. So, I’d fight fire with fire instead of crying about it if I was a teen girl in this situation. Make deepfakes of the boys have micropenises and other potentially embarrassing things. And then just learn to laugh about it. If everyone is a target and victim the kids will find it boring fast enough and this will fizzle out. It’s not like these kids aren’t exposed to porn and all that early on. They all are, have been for years now, the victim here feel awful because they’re the only ones being targeted.

I know this sounds bat shit crazy but normalization of it is really all we can do now.

[noosphr]

Back in my father's day you'd get executed for drawing a dick on Stalin's forehead. It's nice to see people still care more about symbolic violence than actual violence.

[numbsafari]

These are teenage girls, not adult men. This isn’t graffiti, but highly realistic sexual depictions.

There’s a massive difference.

[bondarchuk]

Nevertheless there is almost a moral equivocation between images of sex and actual sex by some people. We are talking about restraining someone physically inside a 2 by 3 meter box for multiple years as a retribution for what is after all just pixels on a screen.

(And by the way the implicit comparison here between an image of stalin and an image of a teenage girl is more apt than most would care to admit given the ideological function fulfilled by sexualized images of young women in contemporary American society)

[orwin]

Yeah, 'pixel on a screen'. I will send deepfake video of your daughter (or sister, or mother) having sex to you, let's see how they appreciate it. It's only pixels after all. Or picture of you having sex to your friends, SO and parents, that's probably fine.

I don't have sex in front of my friends and family for a reason, and I would appreciate my privacy protected by the state. And yes, privacy breach of this magnitude is probably worth 2-3 years (which basically means nothing for the first offense, let's be realistic, but makes the second offense way more consequencial).

[noosphr]

Go ahead.

It's not like I can stop you from imagining it.

Adding a GPU to the mix does make it any worse given that you already thought about it.

[bigtex]

Not sure why you are being downvoted would a normal reaction to someone just saying it is a "pixel on a screen"

[numbsafari]

“Just pixels on a screen”

What is wrong with you?

[bondarchuk]

Isn't it true? You are reacting to me with a fervor that lends its intensity from the moral values around actual physical sex with actual minors, but nothing of that kind occured here.

[ChoGGi]

To you, it might be pixels on a screen, to someone else it's their life and dignity.

It wouldn't be the first time a high-schooler killed themself over bullying.

[Henchman21]

Wow. I’m thinking the most charitable reading of this is “You forgot the /s”

Otherwise this is insanity.

[reaperducer]

Otherwise this is insanity.

It's a disruption of an entire school and the learning process. Just like a bomb scare, or a fake fire alarm. Just because it's AI doesn't mean it gets a pass.

One of the points of punishment is to deter copycats.

[Henchman21]

You're talking about sending children into the US prison system because of some pictures they made?

I stand by my claim of insanity. I think your rebuttal says more about you than about the topic at hand.

[28304283409234]

Parents should be put on trial for giving their kids smartphones.