[rootusrootus]

Too many comments are trying to overanalyze, or just show off their insightful cynicism.

We do airshows because they are cool. Lots of us love airplanes. Humans do all kinds of activities for entertainment that are not strictly justifiable returns on investment. I hope we never get that boring, though every year we do seem to go that direction.

[bigyabai]

It's worth questioning what the costs are, though. I love military aviation more than the average Joe, and seeing these jets pushed to their limits is pretty gratifying. But this isn't a football/soccer pasttime, the E/A-18 is an expensive F/A-18 block and the aviators are an asset of national security that take decades of experience and millions of taxpayer dollars to train. The losses sustained by the Blue Angels alone is stomach-churning, and they're widely known as one of the most professional groups around: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blue_Angels#Team_accidents_and...

The net benefit is marketing, and little else. As much as I enjoy watching airshow jet maneuvers, I have to acknowledge that the USSR only sent their Sukhoi pilots on-tour as a publicity stunt to increase their exports. Same goes for the US, France and China.

[umbra07]

>https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blue_Angels#Team_accidents_and...

20 pilot deaths since 1946 (80 years ago), but only 2 pilot deaths since 2000 (25 years ago).

I wouldn't really call that "stomach-churning losses"?

[7952]

I guess aviation always has an element of risk and the real debate has to be around safety standards and training. A loss of aircraft, crew or worse people on the ground is never acceptable and seems to happen more than it should.

[wartywhoa23]

> Humans do all kinds of activities for entertainment that are not strictly justifiable returns on investment.

Military propaganda absolutely is about strictly justifiable returns on investments.

[operatingthetan]

No. They are for recruitment and showing other nations what is on hand in case they want to mess with them.

>insightful cynicism.

So in response you select the most naive take?

[NikolaNovak]

There are a LOT of air shows where military airplanes are a small or zero component.

I'm totally in agreement that armed forces are there for reasons you described. But an "air show" is a massive and sometimes separate Venn diagram. There are air shows where main thing is thousands of private airplanes coming from across the country to be together and meet up and have fun.

Put it other way, if armed forces decided it's not worth the recruitment investment and pulled out, air shows would still happen :). For most sizes air shows, the biplane aerobatic stunt done by a crazy local 50 year old real estate agent, is way more fun than the c5 galaxy transporter showing "short takeoff" :-)

[mlyle]

Yah.. the roaring sound and precision of military aerial display teams can't be denied, and are an awesome experience. But it's something you see someone doing in a Pitts or Extra or maybe even a Citabria or 150 that makes you question your understanding of the laws of physics :D

[NikolaNovak]

I love it when there is a little Cessna 150/152 with aerobatic designation even though it's engine cuts off when you go inverted (carburated design). The sheer pluck of those pilots! I was once given a Cessna 150 aerobatic experience as a birthday gift and the pilot was just cheerfully mad lol. He gave me the parachute, told me we are legally obliged to wear them, but not to worry about it too much - at heights and speeds and Gs we're at, they're absolutely useless. Gulp!

[ExoticPearTree]

It is not the same. Having a jet do a low pass is something that you will remember for a long time. Or having it go vertical with full after burners, especially close to sunset where you can see it better.

The other factor is showing how good you are: sure, you can do formation flying in an Extra 300 or a C150, but doing it in a fighter jet show precission and skill, because it will not forgive you as easy as a slower moving plane.

[NikolaNovak]

Let's recognize this is subjective :)

I've been to a few air shows and even f22 with its vector thrusting, is not (to me) as impressive as the little prop aerobatics doing things that make me (even with a bit of flight training) wonder how is that even possible :). They are typically closer & slower (so you can appreciate the action better), and just pack so much more stuff and maneuvers right there where you can see them - the density / bang for the buck is far greater. By necessity, military jets are fly bys - they zoom in, pull up and wheee go up fast, then they go away. Then 2 minutes later they zoom in, cross each other impressively closely, then they fly away for a bit. It's exciting and fun don't get me wrong, but when I plan my air show day, I plan it around cool little aerobatic planes, not the military jets.

YMMV :). But my point in this thread is:

1. Yes, absolutely, military is there for recruitment

2. Military recruitment flying is empathically not all there is to an air show to all the people, and there exist air shows with minimal to no armed force presence.

[mlyle]

> It is not the same.

I have seen so many military display teams. Yes, I like the roar. But they blur together.

> sure, you can do formation flying in an Extra 300 or a C150,

But that's not what we watch Extra 330s do. We watch them do other things that are nuts that are also not so easily forgiven. I have fond memories of seeing Patty Wagstaff, Sean Tucker, and Rob Holland (rip). (And before that, Amelia Reid in her 150...)

[MaciejR]

As an aerobatic pilot that owns an Extra and has flown with several fighter pilots, I can tell you flying an Extra requires a lot more talent than a fighter jet.

[ExoticPearTree]

Never got to do aerobatics, just “normal” flying.

I saw a RedBull race and was impressed about the agility of the pilots.

But I like jets more because they go faster. And they have afterburners. And they go vertical faster than any propeller plane will ever be able to. And the margin of error is smaller. Espcially closer to the ground.

[bigyabai]

I'm surprised to see people say this. There are prop plane maneuvers that make the jet maneuvers look like chopped liver: https://youtu.be/Fue96WsySn0

[kube-system]

Even the airshows that the military flies at are often primarily civilian shows. The military clearly has recruiting and power demonstration goals but airshows in general exist outside of those goals. The majority of the aviators at these shows are civilian hobbyists.

[flomo]

Sure, but the Air Force bills all this kinda stuff to Recruiting (having worked in an adjacent area. I support a voluntary military.)

[fluidcruft]

I like air shows and there's no chance I'm enlisting. Maybe citizens like to see the cool toys they pay for actually do cool things other than seeing them parked in museums.

Why do people go see rocket launches?

[justin66]

They work for recruitment because... they're cool.

[nearlyepic]

Sure, but the purpose is recruitment. They wouldn't do them if they didn't get anything out of them, and what they get out of them is PR and boosts to recruitment efforts.

[serf]

Why do small regional non military equivalents exist then?

People fly air shows with crop dusters.

[therein]

I mean, also statistically, it is bound to inspire young people who potentially might be interested in picking an aviation related future. Maybe they will invent something they otherwise wouldn't have.

[lelandbatey]

Sure that's why the bean counters wrote the checks for them, but that's not the reason people attend. People attend because they are a spectacle.

[BoorishBears]

I don't understand this comment. If you want to be the minimally charitable + maximally accurate commenter your tone suggests, then you're also wrong.

It's a superset of the reasons you poorly articulated, and those reasons would include the fact it's cool. Cool things can help both recruitment and morale, and the US military seems to recognize that: https://armedforcessports.defense.gov/Sports/Esports/

If this is just meant to be another comment on the situation which comes with an implicit grain of salt, then the browbeating doesn't make sense.

[operatingthetan]

Don't make things up or project based on your perception of tone.

[BoorishBears]

It's not (just) my perception, most socially aware people would interpret the sign off:

> So in response you select the most naive take?

As well as your reply to me now, as having an unduly negative tone... at least, given the lack of substance or importance.

(Ironically, I have less of hang up on meaningful arguments delivered with edge than most people.)

[bigyabai]

They're being rude, but right. Burying your head in the sand is not an intellectually gratifying response to barbazoo's comment, and the actual meat of their answer ("because they're cool") is obviously incorrect.

Both are unprofessional comments, but only the original was dishonest. The "too many comments" shtick is a thought terminating cliche that shouldn't be encouraged on HN.

[mlyle]

People demand airshows because they're cool.

The military participates in airshows because it's good for morale, because it helps showcase capabilities, because it's good PR for military expenditures, and because it's good for recruitment. All of these effects are mostly because it's cool.

The other people flying in airshows are flying there because they love aviation and because it's cool (not so much the money :)

[BoorishBears]

Again, they're not even right if we're going maximum correctness here...

Maximally correct answer is "there are many reasons with complex interplay", and those reasons do include the fact it's cool! Being cool has interplay with morale, recruitment, and even their ham-fisted attempt at referencing geopolitics.

They'd be "more right" if they said in addition, but they just straight up said "No."

(Also where did you read a too many comments shtick?)

[cs02rm0]

>> We do airshows because they are cool.

> No. They are for recruitment and showing other nations what is on hand in case they want to mess with them.

That's what he said.

[zelos]

Seeing and hearing the last remaining Avro Vulcan pull up over the chalk cliffs at Eastbourne a few years back is something I won't forget for a long time.

[yepyoukno]

I grew up in a time a whole lot more was spent on air shows.

They do it because it’s awesome and it is one of the few opportunities they get to show off their gear to the public!

[bulbar]

I would say it's part of the US culture. It's not a thing in Europe (one reason might be practical reasons. We have less space to do it safely).

[kuerbel]

Of course we have airshows and dedicated teams for that.

There are the patrouille Suisse, patrouille de France, Frecce Tricolori...

After the Ramstein Air Base disaster security was tightened a lot though.

[bulbar]

Never heard anybody mention them while in the US they seem to be common and well known.

As well as private aviation has a different standing in the US in my experience.

Saying "not a thing" might have been to absolute, but my impression is that flight shows are much more known and I would assume more common in the US.

[ExoticPearTree]

I’ve seen PdF perform, they are pretty impressive in the maneouvers they execute.

It is worth mentuoning though they do all that in trainer jets, not actual fighter jets. Which is not that cool. I would loved it more of they would fly actual fighters.

[baud147258]

> I would loved it more of they would fly actual fighters.

For that I'd say it's that France is saving its actual fighters for combat units because it doesn't has enough jets, unlike the US

[barnabee]

There are many airshows in Europe, including the world’s largest military airshow (RIAT in the UK).

UK list, for example: https://www.air-shows.org.uk/2025/04/uk-airshow-calendar-202...

Rest of Europe: https://www.air-shows.org.uk/2025/04/european-airshow-calend...

[dudul]

I guess the half dozen airshows my dad took me to as a kid just happened in my head.

[anomaly_]

Peak European comment

[__loam]

It has absolutely been a thing in Europe and there have been numerous accidents involving Russian and European aircraft at events like the Paris Airshow.