[xrd]

Does anyone have any suggestions on how to get started on projects like this, specifically alongside kids (very smart 9-13 in range)?

I got them a 3d printer to move them into more "physical" computing, with mixed results.

Any place to have a gentle introduction to PCB boards?

[kaipereira]

I personally love this macropad tutorial and it's how I got into doing circuit board design in highschool: https://hackpad.hackclub.com/. Before doing this, it's really helpful if they have experience messing around with breadboards, so getting them a kit can help them into a soft transition too!

I like to suggest making a macropad, then a keyboard, then going into a devboard, and then starting to make your own projects. But for kids that aren't quite in highschool yet, it can feel quite intimidating and the learning curve is moderately high, so getting them playing with breadboards first might be the best option ;)

Hack Club will also give you a grant to cover the entire cost if your kids are over 13 through their programs like stasis, fallout, or forge (you can check their site for more info)

[xrd]

Thanks so much.

Your blog is great, btw! I expect more great things from you!

I especially enjoyed your repo on your custom keyboard. My kids are crazy about keyboards. If you taught I class I would definitely sign them up!

[contingencies]

Strongly feel the logical progression is: (1) Wiring third party devices and modules to an existing MCU board and programming it (2) Making a PCB to plug modules and the MCU board in to (3) Making a PCB with integrated peripherals and only plugging the MCU board (4) Making making a whole board with everything.

The MCU is typically far more fiddly than the devices (eg. crystals, storage, buses with conditioning, power stages, etc.), so continuing to plug the MCU in to a PCB while integrating peripherals is a good. You really need to be able to read a datasheet to do a nontrivial board and that brings in quite a few elements of electronics which are nontrivial for kids to grok without hand-holding and a lot of explanation.

Pick an MCU with easy USB-C programming. RP2040 is a good modern option.

[poetaster]

Strongly agree. I have a number of projects (RP2040/RP2350) where I stick to using the piggy back mcu because it's actually cheaper than doing the whole design with small quantities (<50). Not to mention, much less complex.

[otaviogood]

for an introduction to the CAD software, Kicad, which this project uses, I really liked "Shine on you crazy Kicad": https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eMW9ohCbcik&t=27s It takes you from basics to buying a PCB from the manufacturer.

[poetaster]

I do workshops with kids occasionally. Last week, 4 13 year old boys. In this case I did breadboarding with them first and then showed them the transfer to fritzing -> breadboard -> schematic -> pcb. https://fritzing.org/ If you're looking for stuff they might find fun, logic noize (for instance https://hackaday.com/2015/03/09/logic-noise-sawing-away-with... ) has a bunch of fun cmos audio tutorials with great videos. Personally, I build audio toys, both analog and digital (mostly pi pico2) and still mostly use fritzing for the breadboard education element, but kicad if I need smd positioning and the like.

[zamalek]

Breadboards[1] with breakout boards[2] (the Pi Pico in particular is incredible, having an unusually detailed and correct datasheet). MicroPython is probably a great way for gets to get started on the compute side of things. Once you have something working on a breadboard then you can "graduate" to PCB design (and there's nothing wrong with designing the PCB to take a breakout daughterboard) - possibly perfboard as an intermediate step. Use KiCAD - it's Blender-tier open source software. A high quality breadboard and wires are very important - I guess diagnosing a loose connection is a learning experience, but it would be an overall hindrance to learning if encountered frequently.

Have many spares of all components (including breakout boards) handy - they will probably summon the magic smoke a few times.

They will likely quickly need to learn how to read data sheets. You can often get away with copying the "typical application" and avoiding the real technical stuff.

Friendly reminder: those brains are still developing. Adequate exhaust is extremely important (even if you are using solder-free, flux fumes are varying levels of toxic). You want those fumes going out of the window, not via a filter into the same room. Any complaints about headaches are serious: you aren't extracting the fumes correctly. There are a few important things to know about soldering: "there is no such thing as too much flux," "solder likes to flow towards heat," and "heat the thing and apply the solder to the thing (not to the iron)" (to keep the technique at its most basic).

The often recommended Hakko FX-888D is just plain awful. The Pinecil is way better (yes, even though its a fraction of the price) or the TS100/TS101.

[1]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Breadboard [2]: https://www.raspberrypi.com/products/raspberry-pi-pico/

[derefr]

I would point out that for the Pico (RP2040) and Pico 2 (RP2350) in particular, there's not only a datasheet, but also first-party tutorials that walk you through laying out a minimal reference board design:

Pico 1 (RP2040): https://pip.raspberrypi.com/documents/RP-008279-DS-hardware-...

Pico 2 (RP2350): https://pip.raspberrypi.com/documents/RP-008280-DS-hardware-...

These tutorials in turn contain links to KiCad schematics + layout files for the boards they walk you through developing, for you to check your work against.

[sitzkrieg]

the hakko fx-88 series is great. use one full time with zero issues. not sure what parent is on about, this is not a shared opinion in industry

[zamalek]

The FX-888D is known to have a significant time delay between tip temperature and reported temperature, which is a newbie landmine.

https://www.reddit.com/r/soldering/comments/1le2y4l/comment/...

https://www.eevblog.com/forum/beginners/is-the-hakko-fx-888d... (#7)

https://www.reddit.com/r/AskElectronics/comments/qcofiq/comm...

https://www.reddit.com/r/soldering/comments/1282gci/comment/...

It was maybe the best at the price tier 10 years ago, but smart tips make things much more predictable. The FX-888D is dated and suggesting it is bad advice; you overcame its shortcomings while learning and years later are left with "the good parts." Try do something with it when it reports that it's at temperature, bonus points for changing the calibration by mistake or straight into a large copper pour. Smart tips have a much more forgiving learning curve, and then the user might subsequently have more success with something like the FX-888D.

I personally ran into this when starting out, not knowing what I was doing wrong for literal months - until I got the Pinecil, which was night and day.

I just don't know why anyone would suggest something that's "good enough" over something that's genuinely good.

[ssl-3]

Indeed. I haven't ever heard any complaints about any Hakko irons, except for cost.

I'm a huge fan of the (now kind of old) version 1 Pinecil irons I have.

If someone put me at a bench to work on a project, I'd be very happy with either of these soldering irons. Both the FX-88 and the Pinecil are miles and miles ahead of the low-power, not-temperature-controlled soldering irons I used when I was a kid.

(I do want to buy a v2 Pinecil, since that can run directly on the 24v-nominal batteries that I use for everything from my power tools to my lawn mower. That would allow for very portable soldering using stuff I already have. v2 tips also have a lower resistance and that provides a bit more oomph at any given voltage, but lack of oomph hasn't been an issue for me at all with v1.)