[0xDEAFBEAD]

That actually changed recently, but The Economist (UK newspaper) whines that Americans will no longer be footing the bill for drug development:

https://archive.is/bWwP4

We're done with Europeans treating us as suckers. Doing nice things for Europe leads to nothing but contempt from Europeans.

[hermanzegerman]

They correctly point out that useless parasites like the Pharmacy Benefit Managers that I also mentioned to you, are a quite big part of your drug price problem. Yet you seem to refuse to acknowledge it

The system is packed with opaque middlemen such as pharmacy benefit managers, many of which are making big rents

[0xDEAFBEAD]

Certainly the US healthcare system needs reform. But I believe a big reason why we have paid such high drug prices for so long is because congresspeople in the US believed that it was good for us to subsidize drug innovation for the entire world. That era is over. Like I said, you Europeans had a good thing going, but you just couldn't let well enough alone.

[hermanzegerman]

If you really believe that Congressmen in the US thought they were subsidizing foreign nations while their own citizens suffer out of their goodness of their hearts, and not because some Lobbyists donated huge sums to their campaigns and "convinced" them in some meetings, Boy I do have a Bridge to sell you.

American Politicians are really famous worldwide for being selfless, defending other nations interests to the detriment of their own nation

Especially the Republican ones, which have blocked and still trying to block all efforts to bring drug prices down by negotiation.

They are known for being very caring people. Especially for the poor and disadvantaged

[0xDEAFBEAD]

The lobbyists probably said something like "it is good for drug companies to make profits so they can innovate new drugs for global benefit".

Same way the defense companies probably said something like "it is good to deter Russia so that Europe can remain free and democratic".

Hilarious, isn't it?

Anyways shouldn't you get back to work so you can afford all the new weapons you're going to have to buy?

"American Politicians are really famous worldwide for being selfless, defending other nations interests to the detriment of their own nation." Well yes, we did that for you guys for 80 years after WW2, a very peaceful and prosperous period for Europe by historical standards. We got nothing but hate and laughter for it. Now we're done.

[hermanzegerman]

* Well yes, we did that for you guys for 80 years after WW2, a very peaceful and prosperous period for Europe by historical standards. We got nothing but hate and laughter for it We got nothing but hate and laughter for it*

You're either very stupid believing that the American Engagement in Europe was just charity or just a very good troll.

I guess Vietnam, Iraq, Afghanistan, Iran (pre-Mullahs) and other countries that were gifted with democracy were also other selfless endeavours by the Americans.

[0xDEAFBEAD]

"You're either very stupid believing that the American Engagement in Europe was just charity or just a very good troll."

Europeans always imply that NATO is some sort of vast American conspiracy. But they are hardly ever able to give compelling examples of American benefit. The US benefit from NATO always remains a sort of esoteric wisdom which is mysteriously beyond the grasp of the average American. I suppose if we were more educated on European geography trivia, like you guys, that might help us understand why the US needs NATO so badly.

"Vietnam"

Yes, that was seen as analogous to another very recent war in Korea. If it wasn't for us, the state known as "North Korea" would cover the entire peninsula.

"Iraq"

One of the worst dictators in history, that Saddam Hussein. Europeans laughed at us for our opposition to him. It's why we now have little interest in opposing Putin, who is a herbivore by comparison.

"Afghanistan"

Depending on who you ask, we are either imperialists for displacing the Taliban, or complicit for allowing them to displace us right back. Typical double-bind.

"Iran"

You mean the country which is at this very moment crying out for American intervention, asking the Americans to protect protesters? It's fascinating to me how certain Europeans can simultaneously beg the US for protection, and also assume that the US must be up to no good in other countries where the US gets begged for protection.

Hopefully you can see why I support Massie's bill to withdraw the US from NATO at this point. I'm tired of it all. I want a Swiss foreign policy for the US. Do you also support Massie's bill? Maybe that's something we can agree on.

[Ylpertnodi]

> Well yes, we did that for you guys for 80 years after WW2, a very peaceful and prosperous period for Europe by historical standards. We got nothing but hate and laughter for it We got nothing but hate and laughter for it.

Have you thanked the French for getting involved in US wars?

And when you say "we", does that include yourself?

[0xDEAFBEAD]

Why would I personally thank Euros for "destabilizing the Middle East" when they demonize the US for "destabilizing the Middle East"? That doesn't make any sense. You know the Libya operation was Europe-initiated right? You gonna personally thank the US for going along with it? Lead the way amigo.

>And when you say "we", does that include yourself?

Yes, in the sense that me and my ancestors have been paying taxes to support a military which was supposed to be able to win against the USSR. That money should have stayed in the United States for peaceful purposes. Euros should've defended themselves. If the USSR took over the entire continent that's not our problem. We have to focus on our own problems instead of playing world police.

You can't both demonize the US for its every foreign policy move, and also demand the US protect you. That makes zero sense. You can't both trash the US for its every supposed problem, and also demand that the US pay more attention to Europe's problems. That also makes zero sense. There's nothing coherent in the European ideology beyond just "America Bad". Fine, we'll take our toys and go home. I sure hope it makes you happy.

[pixodaros]

No, that article has one paragraph which frets that if Medicare drives down drug prices in the USA, pharma companies might cut R&D spending, and might get less new drugs (note the conditional and hypothetical). A colleague in biomedical research says that its just a common misconception that R&D costs drive drug prices eg. https://doi.org/10.1136/bmj-2022-071710