[RickJWagner]

Of course they exist.

The immigrants that were sent to Martha’s Vineyard were immediately escorted elsewhere, under care of the National Guard. ( Money can do those sort of things. )

The desire to house immigrants often seems to apply to locales removed from the ‘good people’ espousing the immigration.

The truly evil ones are the hypocrites that want to seem virtuous, but don’t want to do any of the messy part themselves. The people who realistically say they don’t want to make the necessary sacrifices are only being honest, not evil. It seems very few people really want a great bunch of immigrants in their own back yard.

https://www.npr.org/2022/09/16/1123521033/marthas-vineyard-m...

[foogazi]

> The truly evil ones are the hypocrites that want to seem virtuous

No, the truly evil ones are the people that designed, approved and created alligator alcatraz

The people in charge of the abuse

[pupppet]

This is a juvenile take. You can’t ship a group of people to a random location in the US and say OK you live here now.

[RickJWagner]

Sure you can.

Just as easy as you can live in a wealthy enclave, far from the messy logistics of processing immigrants while virtue signaling that the unfortunate hosts are bad people for saying ‘slow down’. The level of entitlement is appalling.

Just exactly where do you propose the immigrants should live? Designated places far from the nice, wealthy enclaves?

[foogazi]

> where do you propose the immigrants should live?

Wherever they can afford to like everyone else.

Immigrants are just like us. In fact I was also an immigrant - nobody bussed us anywhere. Just find a place to rent and that’s it.

[RickJWagner]

I agree that random locations are appropriate.

When the immigrants become self-sufficient, locations of their choosing are ideal.

When the immigrants are not yet self-sufficient, it seems best to avoid large populations in concentrated areas. ( This brings overwhelmed schools, healthcare systems, and other shared infrastructure, to the disadvantage of both the immigrants and the citizen population.)

[pupppet]

>Just exactly where do you propose the immigrants should live? Designated places far from the nice, wealthy enclaves?

They live where they can afford, just like everyone else. Flying/busing people to some random neighborhood is nothing more than a political stunt at the expense of the lives these politicians are toying with.

[mindslight]

You're complaining about alleged hypocrisy of Martha's Vineyard finding places for people who were literally sent away from Texas as a political stunt. They were dropped off by one-way chartered flights, with no real destination, on an island with a small tourist economy where supplies basically arrive by boat. And then you're feigning outrage from the government having to get involved to provide them shelter and services!

There might have been a legitimate point if Tiny DickSantis had found them places to stay (paid or otherwise), but yet they were made to move on. But the only things you're demonstrating are your needs to stop being so gullible and to examine your own filter bubble.

[RickJWagner]

Here is a speech about illegal immigration from President Obama. He describes the problems caused by excess immigration. He also describes how he was stepping up efforts to stop illegal immigration and to deport those already over the border.

Do you think Obama was wrong, and was he evil in your eyes? Remember, he used ICE exactly the same way Trump is using ICE. ICE leadership is even the same team Obama used.

https://obamawhitehouse.archives.gov/the-press-office/2014/1...

[mindslight]

How is any of that related to what I said?

[RickJWagner]

It’s providing context. To understand DeSantis’ motivation, you have to understand the context.

Biden had sharply changed direction from what prior administrations had done, including Obamas. Biden did not only fail to secure the border ( he claimed only Congress could do that, which Trump definitively disproved ), but he even sold off materials being used to build the border. Remember the huge caravans of immigrants arriving and passing through the border? Governors of states most affected were doing their best to protect their constituents.

Biden would not listen to reason. He continued to defy precedent and logic ( again, completely reversing Obamas actions ). He needed a wake up call.

That’s why DeSantis did what he did. The people of Martha’s Vinyard played perfect stooges, using the National Guard to move the immigrants out of their back yard immediately.

Now for you. Was Obama evil for doing what every other president except Biden did? Were the people that voted for Obama evil?

[mindslight]

Sorry no, you don't get to dredge up "context" of something bad someone else did to set an emotional stage of urgency for justifying another bad thing. That is how we get a race to the bottom where things keep getting worse and worse, as half of the useful idiots cheer it on at any given time.

FWIW I did not vote for Obama either time. If you want to talk about the evil things that he did, a much easier starting touchstone is the extrajudicial drone assassinations.

Also FWIW I don't have strong feelings on the actual immigration issue here! If people were being arrested in an orderly fashion based on good faith investigation per case, by officers with public identities and systems of accountability, given due process opportunity to possibly show they are a citizen or otherwise here legally, held in clean humane conditions, with all of this publicly documented to show the whole process was above board - I'd have very little problem! The problem is exactly the manner in which this is being done - masked paramilitary gangs wholesale assaulting civil society in American cities, using some God-knows-what dowsing rod app to scan people and declare them uncitizens (thereby not worthy of human rights), then being disappeared from interested people (eg family, attorneys), and held in concentration camps or shipped off to foreign countries. This destroys the rule of law and Constitutional rights for all of us. And if you really can't understand this, then you need a crash course in individual Liberty to get your head screwed on quick. The way I see it, the immigration issue is essentially just a pretext.

[RickJWagner]

Well, some of what you have written is agreeable to me.

Remembering that Obama built the steel cages for immigrants, I believe you are not placing blame only on the present administration. I find that fair.

FWIW, the ACLU takes a similar stance. They condemn Trump strongly, and condemned Obama just as strongly. I find no fault with their reasoning there, either.

[conception]

“Exactly the same way” is doing a world class job of work as a phrase here.

[RickJWagner]

In what way do they differ? Tactics?