[4ndrewl]

The newspaper article referenced contains insinuation (linking GrapheneOS to the darkweb, criminal gangs etc), and unnamed sources quoting a police investigation.

But that sort of thing sells newspapers. There didn't appear to be anything about the French state taking specific action (eg passing a law) against Graphene.

[gowld]

The laws already exist. Graphene team is accusing the French law enforcement of this:

https://grapheneos.social/@GrapheneOS/115584160910016309

> This doesn't have anything to do with how French journalists have responded to the state actions against GrapheneOS but rather the actions and statements by France's state agencies and law enforcement which are highly concerning. They're making highly inaccurate and libelous claims about GrapheneOS while clearly actively trying to justify taking actions against us. They've shown their hand so we're leaving France including OVH prior to anything bad happening rather than waiting.

and more in the thread.

[4ndrewl]

That link references the newspaper article but there was no mention of any law in it. Will take your word for it, thanks.

[blueflow]

Which state actions? A police raid? Some mean papers delivered?

[thrance]

Can confirm, this is nothing but more scaremongering from right-wing rags: Le Figaro and Le Parisien, both owned by right-wing oligarchs (Dassault and Arnault respectively) trying to fuel this climate of fear to further their economic interests by getting a right-wing demagogue elected. Both papers are caught lying all the time, like Fox News. You shouldn't be taking this seriously.

What you should take seriously though, is this amping up of right-wing populist rhetoric, manufacturing a mass hysteria about crime (when it's at its lowest point in decades) that is then used to justify increasingly authoritarian policies.

[ipaddr]

Don't get trapped by right or left they are all owned by oligarchs trying to push or pull the public towards some agenda that benefits them, sometimes other oligarchs but rarely you.

The crime is down stat is a political stat that doesn't tell you are safer. It could mean police are not going after small crimes or people just stop reporting them or they are classified differently. It could say money spent on law enforcement is working and more is needed. On the other hand it could say community outreach and educational coapaigns are working. Many previous crimes reported thats changing with a more racially diverse force.

It tells you whatever you want to believe.

[thrance]

I don't know of any left-wing oligarchs. That almost sounds like an oxymoron. Don't get trapped in bothsideism or enlightened centrism, one sides is that much more aggressive with the lies and hate.

As for the crime stat, you can always control for such things, to an extent. If we can't trust the official statistics office, then what should we base our policies off? Vibes? There are certainly things to improve with how the stats are collected and used, but you can't just go around telling everyone they're useless and providing no alternatives.

[workfromspace]

Forgive me if I'm working but I thought all the socialist/communist/marxist country leaders and their friends were left oligarchs by definition?

[immibis]

There were no socialist/communist/marxist countries, but there were dictatorships that pretended to be socialist/communist/marxist. Kinda like Hitler did, actually.

[thrance]

No, they're dictators. And I don't know of many of them owning TV channels or newspapers in France, which is what we were talking about. There is no left-wing oligarch, because this is nonsensical. You can't have billionaires spending millions into influencing public opinion towards aggressive wealth redistribution. Those people don't exist.

[nickpp]

You just have bureaucrats and politicians doing that instead, securing their comfy jobs and reelection.

The equation is simple: tax one productive member of society 1000 euros - lose 1 vote. Redistribute 100 euro each - win 5 votes. The rest goes towards various government programs implemented by companies owned by friends that can redirect pay the profit in offshore accounts of relatives of said politician.

[cyanydeez]

Keep in mind, until the "liberals" create a proper state that isn't easily capitulated to the far right fear, the risk of these rags becoming defacto, and these threats becoming policy, like they did in America, it's a legitimate threat.

It's just not today, but tomorrow.

[perihelions]

> "Particularité de GraphèneOS : on peut se le procurer autant sur le darknet que sur des sites grand public." ⇒ "A distinctive feature of GrapheneOS is that it can be obtained both on the darknet and on mainstream websites."

[aussieguy1234]

You could probably get normal android roms on the darknet also. Maybe not a good idea, but this is not unique to grapheneos.

[bigfatkitten]

You can get Windows ISOs from the dark web. Maybe they’ll shut down Microsoft next.

[herbertgreen]

French newspapers are mostly french republic propaganda paid by the state, and laws and political decisions are tested with headlines like this.

This is public data, it's not a conspiracy. Lots of newspapers would not exist without the taxpayer money: https://www.culture.gouv.fr/thematiques/presse-ecrite/tablea...

[wiether]

Most of the big newspapers ARE propaganda tools and DO receive public money.

But they are not a State tool, they are the tools of they owners which are all private billionaires.

The public money is here to pretend that, because they receive it, they'll work for the interest of the public.

What it actually does is to lower the bill for their owners.

[bromuro]

So… taxpayers’ propaganda?

[sam_lowry_]

If you assume France is democracy )

[thrance]

Except the two newspapers here aren't public, they're right-wing rags: Le Figaro and Le Parisien, both owned by right-wing oligarchs (Dassault and Arnault respectively) trying to fuel this climate of fear and hate to further their economic interests by getting a right-wing demagogue elected. Both papers are caught lying all the time, like Fox News.

[chris_wot]

If they consider the country is making laws they can't accept, then the honourable thing is to no longer allow participation within that country.

[metadope]

The honourable thing?

More importantly this is the smart choice, the only thing, to do: Shake the dust from your sandals, walk away, don't look back.

This is the ongoing horror of the overbearing state, which wants to rule efficiently by knowing everything that everybody is doing all the time. Those who focus on and value law enforcement before freedom.

[mmooss]

> This

What? What is the French state doing in this case?

[betaby]

Owners of those newspapers are or were politicians. I would call that a politically motivated action against GrapheneOS.

[mmooss]

That doesn't follow: It's not their only motivation, nor are the author and editor drones who follow this one motivation.

People can write politically motivated things on HN too. That is very different than a law enforcement action of the government.

[betaby]

Then the law enforcement knocks the door it's already too late. Those articles is the intimidation tactics for now.

> People can write politically motivated things on HN too.

Sure, and that would be a problem if that was 1) targeted and 2) originated from the people with connections.

[jojobas]

Why would they want to stop French citizens from using their creation?

[chris_wot]

Because they would be violating the laws of another country. The fastest way to prevent this is to prevent access from France. The same way it is being done with the UK.

[jojobas]

I'm probably breaking some law of North Korea every couple of weeks and I don't give a fuck.

A foreign country can only threaten you if you depend on revenue from this country, or plan to go there. In theory one can even pull of a project like GrapheneOS completely anonymously (assuming you're in a proper free speech jurisdiction that won't rat you out), so people behind it can still travel freely.

French citizens deserve privacy no less than anyone else.

[mmooss]

That makes it very easy for any government or anyone with a little power - like influence over what a newspaper publishes - to shut down GrapheneOS. You don't need any law enforcement, law, process, etc. - GrapheneOS will shut down itself at a hint of criticism.

[chris_wot]

Not really. If GrapheneOS feels they will be prosecuted in a particular country, then they don’t need to allow participation in that country. It’s their choose and right to do so.

They have no obligation to do otherwise. - ~~~~

[mmooss]

I didn't talk about obligation; I don't understand your objection ?