[Lord-Jobo]

I don't think it's really possible for the average employee. You'll just do an interview, like the vibes, and get unbelievably lucky.

By the time their golden age is known outside of the company they are very likely near the decline phase; even if they aren't you are going to be competing with the best now.

For actual upper level leadership: they have the ability to make the golden age happen but studying the circumstances that allowed it to happen at other companies and being very selective about employee number 2-49. After that it's out of your hands.

[dreamcompiler]

> being very selective about employee number 2-49. After that it's out of your hands.

Indeed. There's an old saying that A-level people hire A-level people, but B-level people hire C-level people.

Obviously this is too simplistic: How do any B-level people get there in the first place? But there's still some truth to the idea that the overall talent level of a company tends to degrade as it gets larger unless very unusual structures are in place to work against that tendency.

[jtbayly]

The saying I’ve heard is about students, but similar enough and different enough o quote here:

“The A students work for the B students and the C students become federal judges.”

[NoMoreNicksLeft]

That's just a plain scaling issue, isn't it though? Eventually, the supply of A-level people dries up, no matter the compensation offered. If growth is to continue, B-level people must be hired.

[dreamcompiler]

Yes A-level people are rare and expensive. The mistake I see too often is companies not focusing on keeping their core revenue-generating team A-level. Put the B-level people in support roles. When you dilute the core revenue team with B- and C-level people, the As tend to leave and then you're in big trouble.

[crmd]

The quote is from Steve Jobs and is absolutely true. As soon as the first bozo infects your team, they will start hiring other bozos, and after a while your org has regressed to the mean. Therefore you should hold a ridiculously high bar for hiring. A temporarily empty seat is preferable to a non-A player.

[CaptainOfCoit]

> If growth is to continue

Maybe this is the crux of the issue.

[NoMoreNicksLeft]

For a small company, for one still trying to find its business model, growth is absolutely necessary. The alternative is lost investment, and everyone out of work.

[CaptainOfCoit]

> By the time their golden age is known outside of the company

Yeah, but that's the thing, when you're interviewing, you usually have some sort of access to talk to future potential colleagues, your boss and so on, and they're more open because you're not just "outside the company" but investigating if you'd like to join them. You'll get different answers compared to someone 100% outside the company.

[km144]

I think the problem is false positives, not false negatives. The people you interact with during the interview process have all sorts of reasons to embellish the experience of working at their company.

[CaptainOfCoit]

> The people you interact with during the interview process have all sorts of reasons to embellish the experience of working at their company.

That's true, but you have to be kind of smart about it. If you just ask the question "Is working here fulfilling?", of course they'll say "Yes, super!". But you cannot take that at face value, your questions need to shaped in a way so you can infer if working there is fulfilling, by asking other questions that can give you clues into that answer.