[AdieuToLogic]

> Amusing coincidence. I also wanted to be a rock star, or at least a successful working musician.

> I still play music, but not full time, and with the comfort of supporting myself with a day job.

Some people say;

  Pursue your dream or you will regret it.

This is said by people who regret their own choices.

Other people say;

  Don't make your dream a job, because all it will
  be is a job and no longer special.

This is said by people who had misconceptions about what pursuing their dream actually entailed.

I say;

  Happiness is found in neither a dream chased nor a chosen
  profession.  It is instead a choice we make each day in
  what we do, in how we view same, and if we allow
  ourselves to possess it.

  What constitutes each day is immaterial.

But that's just me.

[muzani]

I do think you need the dream to be happy. Money/career is a prerequisite of dreams.

Some want to live on the seas. They can be perfectly happy as a sailor, even if poor and single.

Some want a family, educated children, respect. They would likely need a nice house, enough resources to get a scholarship, a shot at retirement. This is obtainable working in public service, even without money.

But most have multiple dreams. That's what makes things complex. The man who wishes for a wife but also wishes to be on the seas will find much fewer paths available. Sailors also don't generally get respected by most in laws.

To mix the two, they try to find the dream-job. Perhaps work for a big oil company and be 'forced' to go offshore.

Eventually people learn that desire is suffering in some form and cut down on the number of dreams. They may even see this as mature and try to educate others that this is the way. Those who have kids often are forced to pick kids as the dream. So there's a selection bias as well.

[scrame]

vonnegut said:

"Don't put one foot in your job and the other in your dream, Ed. Go ahead and quit, or resign yourself to this life. It's just too much of a temptation for fate to split you right up the middle before you've made up your mind which way to go".

[dyauspitr]

I say if you have money to do whatever you want everyday, there’s an overwhelming chance you’ll be happy.

The rest of those sayings are just for us plebs that have to rationalize working 40-60 hours a week.

[Scarblac]

But that's a trap, the money you "need" is partly decided by how much you have available. Once you're used to the money from a 40 day job it's hard to do with less, but other people manage fine because they never got used to having a lot.

[AdieuToLogic]

My key point is that happiness is a choice. I hope everyone can find a way to choose it.

[balamatom]

That's wrong. Plenty of people have "found a way to choose happiness" already, and we've all seen what exactly they've wrought.

[totetsu]

I think PP's point was .. that even if you spend your whole life pressed into laboring to produce a surplus to satisfy the excessive consumption of the elites of your heretical society, in ways that create existential risk for future generations, and are at odds with your own inner values and moral compass.. you can still see the 'immateriality' of all that in the grand scheme of things and choose to be happy.

[AdieuToLogic]

No, my point is happiness is a choice.

There is no sociopolitical statement, no call-to-arms, no pontification as to the measure of one's life, no generational implications. There is an existential consideration, but not of the nature your post implies.

Happiness is an individual choice, available to us all at any time.

Full stop.

[bccdee]

If anyone at any time can simply choose to be happy, why do we care whether (for instance) our arms get chopped off? We are equally capable of choosing to be happy with or without arms. Why do we avoid harm?

[cardanome]

Thank you, your post cured my depression. (Sarcasm)

This is pure magical thinking. There are many reasons to be not happy. Being in pain, having lost a loved one, not having your physical needs met and well simply having depression or a myriad of other problems.

And people shouldn't be happy with all circumstances. It is not healthy to be happy all the time. Sometimes accepting the negative emotions is important for growth.

[AdieuToLogic]

> Thank you, your post cured my depression. (Sarcasm)

Your welcome. (Sarcasm returned)

> This is pure magical thinking. There are many reasons to be not happy. Being in pain, having lost a loved one, not having your physical needs met and well simply having depression or a myriad of other problems.

Of course there are many life situations where "being happy" is not what a person can or needs to experience at that moment, where "moment" is defined as some period of time determined by each person. And there are medical conditions where trying to choose happiness is simply not possible, such as "having depression or a myriad of other problems."

> And people shouldn't be happy with all circumstances. It is not healthy to be happy all the time. Sometimes accepting the negative emotions is important for growth.

I never wrote anything to that effect. What I wrote was:

  Happiness is an individual choice,
  available to us all at any time.

Just because a choice is available does not mandate it must be chosen immediately and unconditionally.

But you go ahead and mischaracterize what I wrote to serve whatever agenda you have and I will reiterate what I posted earlier in this thread:

  My key point is that happiness is a choice.
  I hope everyone can find a way to choose it.

[mbesto]

> Thank you, your post cured my depression. (Sarcasm)

I understand what both of you are saying, but I think its disingenuous to assume that happiness is simply the opposite of depression.

[dyauspitr]

If you have your basic needs met, have no physical ailments etc. I would agree with you. Your statement applies to a certain subset of folks that are defeatist, pessimistic etc. but not everyone.

[balamatom]

Yeah, no.

What you're promoting is a deeply narcissistic worldview, and I hope either the cure or the consequences reach you soon.

Though maybe those are going to present as the same thing.

[braebo]

They’re not entirely wrong, and your comment is seemingly unhinged and unprovoked… but there’s a lot of literature on stuff like mindfulness, CBT, and the impact thoughts can have on one’s emotions, especially happiness.

[cardanome]

CBT and mindfulness can help with SOME problems. It is great when it does but it also can work less well or even harmful for other problems. Especially people that are prone to rumination don't benefit much from it, they need the opposite of mindfulness.

The unhinged part was to imply that people can just choose to be happy under any circumstance which is obviously magical thinking.

[balamatom]

>unhinged and unprovoked

I could of course explain exactly what my words "hinge" on, and what "provokes" them. I've found that this does not create understanding where previously it was lacking. So instead let's talk about what you said.

Two of your words I consider harmful and insulting:

>is seemingly

What the hell?!

...oh, right:

- If you say "X is Y", you gotta back it up. Scary!

- If you say "X seems to me Y", you gotta justify your perceptions. Nasty!

- But saying "X is, seemingly, Y", that's totally safe! Because it's bullshit. It posits a statement as true knowledge and elidies the need for justification outright, on the syntactic level.

What's worse, you probably didn't even notice you were doing this. You just picked up the pattern from people who looked like they had what you wanted.

That cognitive habits like yours are so widely accepted as "normal", is exactly why I'm guessing that CBT (or, for that matter, parent poster's wireheading suggestions) are probably going to be super effective on you, not kidding.

If you were to give those a shot, anyway. Instead of, you know, just stating existences of literatures at people. Also unless your current state of mind wasn't already achieved by similar methods. In any case, do report back!

[Scarblac]

I really don't see how your comment has to do with his at all. You're both talking about completely different things, I think.

[balamatom]

OK, just to make sure we're on the same page here: you've already tried trying to make the connection, right?

[gverrilla]

Easy to say it's immaterial when you're probably an american or european with plenty of material comfort. When was the last time you didn't eat for lack of food, for instance? Adieu to logic, indeed.

[balamatom]

Please step right into this here experience machine, it won't hurt you one bit