[techjamie]

The voice recordings at the drive thru without disclaimers of recording seem like maybe a two party state lawyer's wet dream?

I guess they could argue shouting into a machine in public carries no expectation of privacy, but it seems like a liability to me.

[nerdsniper]

There’s no liability or exposure for recording non-consensually. It’s a public space. There’s not even an edge case. If a random member if the public could walk into the drive-thru (which they can) then anything can be recorded without notification or consent.

Edit: Another commenter has made me aware that some states do ban non-consensual audio recordings in public: https://www.dmlp.org/legal-guide/massachusetts-recording-law

The laws prohibiting these recordings have neither been upheld nor overturned by the US Supreme Court.

[exegete]

A restaurant drive thru is private property open to the public. I think there may be a legal difference there.

[nerdsniper]

There's generally not been held to be any difference for the purposes of expectation of privacy. If it's open to the public, the expectation is that anyone could overhear you.

[mixdup]

>There’s no liability or exposure for recording non-consensually. It’s a public space.

That is not how wiretapping laws work in every state.

[flimflamm]

Creating a database of recordings without user being able to know/influence is clearly violation of GDPR IF there is PII. That's going to be costly for BK.

[nerdsniper]

GDPR only exists in Europe. Are they doing this there too?

[newhotelowner]

Do you need 2 party consent for recording in a public space?

[nerdsniper]

Edit: Another commenter has made me aware that some states do ban non-consensual audio recordings in public: https://www.dmlp.org/legal-guide/massachusetts-recording-law

The laws prohibiting these recordings have neither been upheld nor overturned by the US Supreme Court.

[wordglyph]

I think the real issue in this case is if they are marrying your voice data (personal preferences) to you. They get your name when you pay with credit card. And they get your license plate. And now with AI are they selling this married information?

[techjamie]

That's what I'm getting at with the expectation of privacy part. Talking into a drive thru speaker isn't really a private activity since everyone around can kinda hear it, but it'd probably be better to disclaim it anyway since someone attempting to file on you for it still costs money.

[thimkerbell]

Is there an easy effective way to tell a company not to ask its customers' phone numbers if someone parked nearby can overhear them?

[smcin]

They steer you towards ordering on the mobile app instead, which typically gives you a 4-6 digit confirmation code which you then use combined with your name, when you pick up. And/or your receipt in the app.

[ssl-3]

Strolling down the sidewalk at a park with a friend and chatting with them isn't necessarily a private activity either: We're in a very public space. Anyone within earshot can hear whatever we're talking about. If the sounds of our conversation winds up being incidentally in the background of someone filming the squirrels the tree frogs or something, then there's probably nothing to be done about that.

But (in some states), it seems that it would be a very different can of worms if I were to elect to deliberately record the conversation I have with my friend without their consent. Even in a public space, that would appear to run directly afoul of the applicable laws.

[flimflamm]

Depends on the country. In Finland, it's ok to record your own discussions. Whether the recorder is BK (a third party) or the cashier is an interesting question, though.

[unyttigfjelltol]

You don’t get to secretly record voices in public spaces.

[newhotelowner]

Yes, You can in America. Video recording is permitted without consent in the public places. Example CCTVs.

[EvanAnderson]

Different states have differing laws regarding recording conversations. In some states both parties in conversation must consent to recording: https://www.justia.com/50-state-surveys/recording-phone-call...

[nerdsniper]

Thats only for private phone calls not for public spaces.

Edit: Another commenter has made me aware that some states do ban non-consensual audio recordings in public: https://www.dmlp.org/legal-guide/massachusetts-recording-law

The laws prohibiting these recordings have neither been upheld nor overturned by the US Supreme Court.

[EvanAnderson]

I could easily see a judge regarding the conversation over a drive thru speaker as not a public space and more like a telephone call.

[LMYahooTFY]

This is not related to public spaces.

[parineum]

Audio cannot be recorded without consent in CA. Security cameras have an option to disable audio for this reason. People never do it but it's the case.

It's related to wiretapping laws that are very broad.

[lazide]

Only if there is an expectation of privacy.

If there is a big obvious security camera staring at you, in a public place, that is the opposite of an expectation of privacy.

[JKCalhoun]

California or Canada?

[natebc]

<nerdsniped> and removed so that i don't get sued for gross misinterpretation, ignorance and misinformation spreading.

What was here was a link to a California statute that is apparently misinformation somehow. Who knows, I'm just some igorant redneck apparently.

[bigiain]

In Australia, at least in the late 90s, you were allowed to record voice and video without consent or notification of all parties, but you were not permitted to play/show the recordings to anyone else.

This was well know amongst the sort of people who regularly got harassed by police (in my circle of friends, riders of sportsbikes). There was well known legal advice saying to record every interaction you had with police, and if it turned out badly in any way, as soon as you got home write down the transcript of the conversation as "contemporaneous notes" and email them to your gmail account to establish a timestamp. But the only time you ever even mentioned your recording would be to your lawyer, so that if the cop challenged or contradicted your notes in court, your lawyer could then offer the recording as evidence.

These days, dashcams are pretty ubiquitous, and demonstrate that whatever the legal technicalities are, video recording in public without consent is not only widespread, but bashcam footage is also something police regularly request from the public.

[nycpig]

That is a farily broad statement.

How would you reconcile your statement against state laws that require all-party consent for audio recordings? e.g. CISA, or FSCA

[nerdsniper]

Those don’t apply to public spaces in the USA. This is super well-established law. If you needed consent to record in public there would be nearly zero YouTube videos recorded in public. And security cameras would generally not be allowed to record audio. And Tesla’s “Sentry mode” would be illegal.

In the USA, there is no right or legal expectation of privacy in public spaces, which includes fast food restaurants that are open to the public (indoors or outdoors)

Edit: Another commenter has made me aware that some states do ban non-consensual audio recordings in public: https://www.dmlp.org/legal-guide/massachusetts-recording-law

The laws prohibiting these recordings have neither been upheld nor overturned by the US Supreme Court.

[redserk]

Sentry mode doesn’t record audio.

[pessimizer]

> You don’t get to secretly record voices in public spaces.

> Video recording is permitted without consent in the public places.

I have no idea why you would think that these two statements are related, or why people would continue this conversation. Fishing and skateboarding are two other things that are often allowed, but neither are related to recording audio.

And for anyone who thinks this is a nitpick, please look it up.

edit: also, saying that you can record people when you're obviously recording people is also not relevant. The problem is recording people without their knowledge or consent. I cannot put an audio recorder in my pocket in many places (such as Illinois) and record you, whether in a private space or in a public space. If I put my audio recorder on the table, and you can choose whether you want to speak or not, it's legally an entirely different scenario, whether we are in a public space or not.

[LadyCailin]

Apparently the system was global, and BK has locations in GDPR countries.

[singleshot_]

I've had some challenges recording voices with video, but I salute your efforts.

[unyttigfjelltol]

Funny, whenever they show the CCTV footage it doesn't seem to have any sound....

Secretly recording voices is a felony is many places in 'merica.

[nerdsniper]

Please stop spreading misinformation . There are so many court cases about this. A quick google will give you dozens you can read.

Legally there is no “reasonable expectation of privacy” in public spaces and the only limit on that are extreme telephoto lenses looking from public spaces into private spaces.

Edit: Another commenter has made me aware that some states do ban non-consensual audio recordings in public: https://www.dmlp.org/legal-guide/massachusetts-recording-law

The laws prohibiting these recordings have neither been upheld nor overturned by the US Supreme Court.

[unyttigfjelltol]

Unfortunately, you are not correct.[1] Recording police in a public place-- sure. Otherwise, eh, at best you're over-extrapolating (and ungenerously!) from your local circumstance.

[1] https://www.dmlp.org/legal-guide/massachusetts-recording-law