[nicce]

> It's really old.

Funny, how 2 years old car is really old. For combustion engines, old is like 15+?

EVs will have the same problems as mobile phones. Maybe manufactures want that. But software will define the age of your car and I don’t like it. What if the car requires internet connection and the company dies?

[rsynnott]

For practical purposes it is a 15 year old design; it had a minor update 8 years ago, but was not brought up to date with the norms of the time (in particular, the passively cooled battery).

This was the very first mass-market electric car, with only minor tweaks. It's not surprising that it's a bit rough around the edges. That's part of why they're cheap second-hand (along with the fact that the 3rd gen, which actually is a proper redesign, is coming out this year).

[nicce]

I don't think that we can use the general "old" here. The statement should have been more explicit and include the design of the battery.

If the model gets even minor updates, manufacturing is happening right now, the car is either good enough or new enough in general, and we cannot use old as negative quality.

Electric motors existed before the combustion engine, and people keep talking about "rapidly evolving area", while the only thing that is rapidly evolving and specific to EVs is the power source. A battery, to be precise. It is all about battery, and nothing else.

[rsynnott]

The problems with this car are all around the battery pack (though honestly these problems are a little exaggerated). The battery pack is, for practical purposes, a 15 year old design. This car is no longer made. When it was being made, it was the only electric car you could buy with such an old battery pack design.

Buying a 2nd-gen Leaf in 2025 would be a bit silly, unless you were getting a major discount.

[illegalsmile]

I have a 2025 2nd gen on lease because the deals in Colorado were insane and the previous cost of my gas basically pays for the lease + insurance + electricity. That said, unless they give me a killer deal with a major discount at the end of the lease it's going back to the dealer. I love the car and it's been perfect for around town and the region but with 70% of the lease left they want $18000 for buy out. For that price you're well within a nice used EV with active thermal management, modern charge connectors not requiring an expensive adapter, etc...

There's probably going to be a surplus of off-lease Leafs coming up over the next one to three years which might make a great deal for people who can charge at home.

[floxy]

I got 42% off of the MSRP when buying a new 2025 SV+.

[rsynnott]

Yeah, I think this is the only way the could sell them, at this point, with the 3rd gen about to come out. Though, where did you even buy it? I vaguely thought they had stopped making them entirely last year in preparation for the third gen (and if I go to Nissan's website it just offers me a third-gen).

[floxy]

Bought it at my local Nissan dealer back in June.

[numpad0]

ZE1 Leaf(2017) was electronically a big minor update over ZE0(2010). IIRC so much so that ZE1 battery packs almost work on ZE0 body with only minor hack efforts.

So they're basically 15 years old, technologically older than the Model S. Windows 7 was 1 year old when its basic systems shipped.

[Tade0]

To add to what others said: back in 2017 40kWh was the standard, now people scoff at 55kWh. Cars also charge faster, which greatly increases their highway driving potential.

> What if the car requires internet connection and the company dies?

That's not a problem specific to EVs and with Chinese combustion car brands coming and going all the time, it's obvious.

[padjo]

First generation Leaf was launched in 2010 second gen in 2017. That’s quite an old design for any tech that’s still advancing.

[tpm]

It's a 2 years old car, but the model and technology (2nd generation Nissan Leaf) is from 2017, so it's 8 years old in a rapidly evolving field.