[toastal]

> Electrolux washing machine

I had to buy one a couple of years ago. Snarkily I asked the floor salesman if I could get the washer “without all the smart features”. He said “let me check”, which had me puzzled. He came back to inform me that they still had last year’s model which was before the “smart” features were rolled out. He said they can sell it on the same warranty, & since it was older I would get a significant discount. I cherish that machine for its dumbness.

…No such luck for TVs.

[qwerpy]

It was a pain to do, but I have a Sony "Google TV" that I fixed to remove or hide the Sony bloatware and Google adware. I hated how the home screen would display full screen loud ads and the TV would constantly want to update so that it could display an even more obnoxious screen layout with more ads, so I loaded a simple launcher that always displays a static list of hand-picked apps. It required (or successfully dark patterned) me to sign in with a Google account, so I created a dedicated burner account. Google really didn't want to let me create one "please provide a working phone number to verify" but I managed to create one.

Of course I'd prefer a plain dumb TV but there weren't any cheaply and conveniently available at the time. Second best thing is a de-Googled TV. Now if only I could figure out a way to disable the Google buttons on the remote so that kids don't accidentally get into the app store (ads!) or activate the voice control.

[edoceo]

Open the remote, put insulator over the contacts. Works on Roku/Samsung - voids warranty but, it looks like you're already past that (or moving in that (correct) direction)

[vorpalhex]

A bit of kapton tape under the button works and is reversible if you change your mind. Also works well for childrens toys that produce music.

[com2kid]

The annoying part is if you disable all the ads and recommendations, they disable voice search. Feels like they are punishing me for opting out of ads...

[genewitch]

super glue the buttons in place

[Night_Thastus]

I don't get why people care about about whether a TV is "Smart". I have a "Smart" TV and never use the features, and it doesn't bother me.

I have a PiHole in case it tries to do anything funny, and that's good enough for me.

[ajsnigrutin]

Some tv's bother you with popups and notifications and all the other crap related to its "smart features".

And yes, even when not connected to the internet, then they show you popups to connect it to the internet, updates may be waiting, new features may be in a new update, you software has been last updated 726 days ago, click here to troubleshoot the internet connection, etc.

[genewitch]

mine used to strobe the light underneath when it lost internet connectivity. used to.

[chrisweekly]

On powering up, my TV often switches to its default "smart features, prepackaged video streaming service integrations" mode from the HDMI input (the only source I ever want, given my AV receiver manages everything). If it weren't a "smart" tv, I doubt it would keep trying to switch from the configured settings. /anecdote

[danielodievich]

My smart TV is not on wifi and physically unplugged from the internet except for when I deign to upgrade its firmware. Which I've done once since I bought it 5 years ago. I use 0 (zero) smart features and it is unable to report whatever it may have collected. This seems like a good way to handle them to me.

[bitwize]

If I have to take defensive maneuvers against an appliance, I don't want the makers of that appliance getting my money.

Sceptre dumb TVs from Walmart's web site. That's the cheat code. If they run out of those, I'll use a large computer monitor. Attach an outboard HTPC or Apple TV and you're set.

[dwedge]

5G is in large part designed to fix this. Eventually these devices will only ask for wifi as a formality.

[happymellon]

That will last until the TV manufacturers get the phone bill...

[Night_Thastus]

They'll more than make up for it by selling user data and serving ads.

[AuthAuth]

My smart TV is more annoying than helpful. When I plug in my steamdeck or raspberry pi it thinks a windows computer is being plugged in an tries to run Samsung dex/windows thing and register the computer. I have to wait 10s for it to finish then press back on the remote.

So annoying and there is no way to remove this or toggle it off. Oh yeah and when I open the menu to scroll the different inputs or apps there are ads. Paid a few thousand for this thing and it still shows me ads.

[sceptic123]

What counts as funny? Have you connected it to the internet? If so it's probably still spying on you and that is why people care.

[Night_Thastus]

To be honest, looking at the PiHole logs the TV itself hasn't tried to do much of anything. The apps on my streaming device (namely Netflix before I uninstalled it) tried, but the PiHole always caught it.

[redserk]

At this point I wouldn’t rely on PiHole DNS logs alone. You’d need to check network traffic from the device in general, it could use DoT/DoH.

And I suppose there’s the even-creeper Amazon Sidewalk: https://www.amazon.com/gp/help/customer/display.html?nodeId=...

I hate sounding like I’m wearing a foil hat but there are a lot of easy ways to get around trying to neuter smart devices now.

[SAI_Peregrinus]

And DoT/DoH don't even add new capabilities, it's been possible to use a VPN to a popular shared hosting provider (e.g. AWS) to hide traffic for a long time before DoT & DoH became standards.

[soperj]

You don't use the features, but those features use you. Gobble up all your data to sell to the highest bidder.

[publicdaniel]

Don’t forget about DNS over HTTPS which bypasses PiHole

[Night_Thastus]

Is there a way to set up the modem, router, pihole, or any other part of the network to close that loophole?

[inetknght]

Yes. Put your TV behind a second router, manually assign IP address and route to your local network, and don't give the router an upstream gateway. Then any packets the TV might send even to a plain IP address will be dropped at its router before reaching your main router.

[wpm]

One can also just run an open source router/firewall software and do this by clicking a few buttons. OPNsense or OpenWRT get the job done wonderfully.

[inetknght]

Wait until TVs come with their own cellular modems so they can give the corporate middle finger to people like us.

[inejge]

Someday I'm going to download one of HN data dumps and find the earliest mention of this particular scare story. It must be ten or even fifteen years old by now, ever since Amazon started offering 3G equipped Kindles with an always-on connection.

Sneaky cellular access hasn't happened so far, not because the vendors wouldn't like the capability, but (IMO) because it would introduce enough of its own costs and complications to be unprofitable. It's easier to piggyback on customers' internet and disregard the small fraction of privacy-conscious buyers.

[Analemma_]

This is the actual reason there was all that hysteria around the "race to 5G" with the dire warnings that we'd be buried by China if we didn't roll out 5G ASAP. The actual reason is that 5G works better with congested cells and large numbers of clients than 4G, so it's a lot easier to put cellular modems in every device and bypass those pesky users.

[com2kid]

Except many TV models are already sold at a loss. Throwing a $20/month cellular modem in there isn't going to help any.

The number of users who opt out of connecting their smart TV to Wi-Fi is so damn tiny that it is a rounding error for TV makers. They just don't care.

[jkestner]

I personally like the ad-subsidized TVs. The money I save easily covers a used Apple TV on eBay, and I never connect the TV itself. Regardless of TV brand my interface stays the same. Bring back modularity!

[benbenolson]

I got a Spectre TV (pretty cheap, they sell it at Walmart). It's a little more expensive than other TVs in the same class, but has no smart features: you plug HDMI into it and it displays it. You hit "Source" and are greeted with a no-nonsense menu that lets you choose the HDMI port, composite input, etc. It's great.

[edoceo]

I've got one too! I hope it lasts.

[joezydeco]

My LG washer and dryer send a push notification to my phone when the load is done, or I can check on the minutes remaining from anywhere. The other stuff I don't care about, but that feature is pretty useful for me. Having an open API would be better, but I know 99% of their customers wouldn't know what to do with that.

[vorpalhex]

$10 smart home vibration sensor works great for this. I have it all fancy in HomeAssistant so I can toggle if I want to be notified or not. You can also cue off the light if it has an led to indicate it's running.

[dwedge]

I bought a projector mostly to avoid the smart stuff. Large monitors are also an option to some extent.

[sifar]

Try the Spectre TVs. They are normal oled TVS, not smart. Been using one for a few years now, am very glad they exist.

[toastal]

That brand isn’t for sale in my country

[Workaccount2]

They are called "Commercial TVs", selection is more limited and the cost a bit higher, but no smart-TV BS.

[toastal]

Do they come in OLED now?

[mschuster91]

Yup, at least from LG: https://www.lg.com/global/business/oled-signage

[chipotle_coyote]

The parent post saying they “cost a bit higher” is, AFAICT, understating it a wee bit. LG’s consumer 65-inch 4K OLED TVs run between $1200 and $2500 at retail, from a quick search; the 65-inch 4K OLED “professional monitor” linked on that page—e.g., the one that’s closest to an actual TV—retails for around $8000 at B&H. The cheapest OLED commercial TV I could find at b&H was a 55” LG for $3K…and as far as I can tell it’s really just a Smart TV, complete with all internet connectivity, for twice the price because it has the word “commercial” in its name.

[seany]

The other specs are often different. Things like 100% duty cycle, uv resistant coatings, ipx ratings, serial ports for control etc etc