[Mindless2112]

When an optometrist chose to file a claim against my medical insurance (which did not pay) rather than my vision insurance (which would), the only way I was able to get them to fix it was by filing a complaint with the BBB. Multiple calls with customer service only resulted in "there is nothing we can do to change it", but somehow they figured out how to fix it when they got the BBB complaint letter.

How else can private citizens keep businesses honest? Complaining on the internet only works if you have lots of followers.

[decimalenough]

> How else can private citizens keep businesses honest?

I know this was a rhetorical question, but in many countries there is some type of Fair Trading Office, meaning a government body with power to adjudicate consumer complaints about businesses and the legal teeth to enforce its judgements.

[cwmma]

Depending on where you live your state may actually have one of these, in mine it's in the office of the state Attorney General.

[acaloiar]

In Colorado, this is how it's supposed to work.

But then you have companies like Parking Revenue Recovery Services (PRRS), who have already had to settle [1] with the AG once before, and yet the AG refuses to take action on additional complaints, for years.

PRRS sent me a sham parking fee two weeks after their settlement with the AG in 2022.

The AG's response to my complaint

> We have investigated your complaint and based on the information we have received to date, we are taking no further action at this time.

This was three years ago. And Coloradans, faced with an AG that won't do anything for them, have taken to PRRS's non-accredited BBB page to file thousands of complaints [2].

I don't think the BBB would have any effect in this situation either, because PRRS doesn't rely on reputation for its business. They simply rely on having conveniently placed parking lots throughout the city with people needing a place to park.

This was three years ago, and here we are in 2025 and Denver is still dealing with this situation [3] and as far as I know, the AG still hasn't done anything about it.

/vent

[1] https://coag.gov/press-releases/attorney-general-phil-weiser... [2] https://www.bbb.org/us/co/englewood/profile/parking-attendan... [3] https://www.9news.com/article/money/consumer/steve-on-your-s...

[monocasa]

And don't get me started with Wyatt's Towing and the Public Utility Commission (which the CEO of Wyatt's was on the board of).

[QuantumGood]

Letter to the Attorney General is the first step in many states. And often the last.

[happymellon]

Because they normally sort it, or because there are no other customer protections?

[QuantumGood]

You are formally documenting for all future processes that you have filed a complaint, and should include relevant contracts, receipts, correspondence, and support materials. This can be enough to encourage the business to be more responsive.

So it's a low-cost first step that can trigger mediation or settlement and help resolve your dispute (and contribute to broader consumer protection). It's a quick way to signal to the business to work with you.

Submitting a letter or formal complaint can prompt the AG (sometimes) to contact the business in an attempt to mediate or resolve the issue informally. The AG also often offers informal mediation services though some division. The AG’s office sometimes starts investigations based on complaints from the public.

[Eddy_Viscosity2]

> government body with power to adjudicate consumer complaints about businesses and the legal teeth to enforce its judgements

These would in fact be great thing. The problem being that if this existed and did what it was supposed to do, it would only be a matter of time before Trump appointed someone to either destroy it or weaponize it against perceived enemies.

The bigger question is how can we have a body that can both protect consumers from bad businesses AND can also be itself protected from the purchased political influence of those bad businesses.

[smegger001]

Like the consumer financial protection bureau. Twas great while itlasted but it got doge'ed early on.

[ghusto]

> The bigger question is how can we have a body that can both protect consumers from bad businesses AND can also be itself protected from the purchased political influence of those bad businesses

I don't have an answer, but one could be found by looking at places that have just that. In the UK we have the Citizens Advice bureau and the Trading Standards organisation which are safely independent.

Though I have a feeling the answer may be; "Don't live in the USA".

[charlesabarnes]

The BBB complaints list is a glorified internet post. It's not keeping a business any more honest than posting a review on Google or Yelp.

[kstrauser]

That’s exactly right. BBB is Yelp for boomers, and that’s it. I’ve heard plenty of older family and acquaintances wave it around like a weapon: “if they don’t honor my (ridiculous) request, I’ll sic the BBB on them!” And then… what? I’m sure someone, somewhere checks BBB before doing business with a company, but I’ve never personally seen someone do it, and without that feedback loop, the BBB is just another private review site with zero teeth.

[TeMPOraL]

People don't look businesses up on Facebook or X much here either, and yet many times I've witnessed my SO break through being stonewalled by some business with just a simple line, delivered in calm voice: "okay, I'll take it to Facebook, we'll see if you like a drama there" (or "X" more recently). Just like that, 90% success rate, and no actual public drama on social media.

Don't know how that works. It's Poland, approximately nobody here even used Twitter, nor do they use X - and yet, businesses big and small seem super sensitive to that.

[forgotoldacc]

I think a lot of older people really thought the BBB was an arm of the government and had power to enforce things.

[kstrauser]

I think they were clever with the name “Bureau”. It has a connotation of officialness, like “Agency” or “Administration”.

[firesteelrain]

You can still hear on the local news here: “Or you can file a complaint with the Better Business Bureau.”

[drdeadringer]

Speaking for myself, I know that I have never looked up a business for BBB accreditation. (I am 43 and a half).

Yelp reviews, TripAdvisor, Google reviews, yes.

And as honestly never crossed my mind to check with BBB about anything.

But I haven't done any major purchasing like with property, land, or similar.

[kstrauser]

I’m a bit older than you, but same. I’ve bought property and land, and it never occurred to me to check BBB for anything, ever. I know it’s a thing that exists, and that’s about the extent of it.

[potato3732842]

>. BBB is Yelp for boomers,

Complete with undeserved reputability and "pay to remove" system to extract $ on the business facing side.

[bigmattystyles]

And in the same vein, yelp is bbb for millennials.

[kstrauser]

No argument from me on that one. The main difference is that I’ve actually steered away from businesses with bad Yelp reviews.

[izacus]

The person you're responding to literally claims otherwise. Are you calling them a liar or do you have something to substantiate your claims?

[jerbearito]

I don't understand why they need to "substantiate" their opinion, but the commenter they're replying to wouldn't need to substantiate their anecdotal evidence. They can "literally" claim anything.

I do think Mindless2112's experience is common with larger businesses, making the BBB potentially more effective in those cases than online review sites like Google or Yelp. Also, do those sites send complaint letters? I don't know.

[elashri]

There is a miles of difference between providing one specific claim based on experience that does not claim that this happens with all businesses. Vs the other claim that BBB complaints doesn't work and is no more than a glorified lists in general.

[jerbearito]

Agreed! My question remains – why does one need to be substantiated while the other doesn’t?

[anton-c]

They mean inherently I think. As in it doesn't enforce any "better business" practices. The only threat is public shaming through them. But they themselves won't actually solve it.

[bitshiftfaced]

I don't see anything to indicate that Mindless2112 is "lying," but it does look like they might be a bit confused. BBB really is just another review website like Yelp and Google reviews (with the added step of sending the business a letter in the mail).

[BoredPositron]

Small claims usually works quite well.

[jimmydddd]

This must be some sort of weird optometrist thing. Mine always asks for my medical insurance, and after I tell them they have my vision plan info, they still want my medical plan info. Then they try to bill me medical plan instead of the vision plan. I then correct the situation, but it takes time and several phone calls. Maybe it's some sort of scam where they think the medical insurance will pay more?