[zarldev]

>That's it mostly...

Whole kubernetes, docker, traefik and many other cloud native tools are written in go.

[Yasuraka]

They are my daily bread and I sloppily lumped them in with "web [...] services", but in hindsight they ought to be a separate category - fundamentally about a different layer,infrastructure, and might not even be networked.

[pjmlp]

Many tools on DevOps ecosystem are now going through the RIIR phenomenon, and I bet, had Rust 1.0 been available when Kubernetes decided to migrate away from Java, after Go heads joined the team (see FOSDEM talk on the matter), or Docker moving away from Python, most of those tools would have been written in Rust instead.

[Yasuraka]

> most of those tools would have been written in Rust

I seriously doubt it for the same reason that Google, with all of its expertise and tooling for it, didn't choose C++, twice.

[pjmlp]

You may doubt it, I keep my certainty, given how much Go is being used at Google, versus Java, Kotlin, C++ and Rust.

[Yasuraka]

The Rust of today wouldn't be chosen over the Go of a decade ago, it is fundamentally a bad fit, for similar reasons that the already mature C++ wasn't. Java (similar to C#) would've been viable mainly due to maturity and ecosystem effects, Kotlin/Native might be a contender in another half decade, sooner if the team were to shift priorities.

I say this not just for Kubernetes etc., but greenfield projects today as well.

[pjmlp]

Meanwhile on the field,

https://deislabs.io/posts/still-rusting-one-year-later/

I gather you are aware of Deis Labs history, Microsoft acquisition and such, do you want other CNCF companies that have pivoted into Rust?

[Yasuraka]

More like, an attempt in the field from 2 years ago

> [Warning] This project is currently not actively maintained.

But there is a library by them to build containerd shims with which is maintained: https://github.com/containerd/runwasi

Let's just entertain the idea and pretend that this is a notable project and that one would count it as DevOps tooling. Here are the top 10 across the CNCF in terms of size, courtesy of GitHub's API:

    C++: 3195829832
    Java: 2908175049
    Go: 2005598094
    C: 1225503783
    Python: 931070259
    LLVM: 594277917
    C#: 484071185
    Rust: 460427159
    TypeScript: 428904119
    JavaScript: 273074800

This is the best-case scenario, including irrelevant categories like databases and VMMs that ought to be written in Rust (or C++).

As far as Microsoft itself goes, they have a new push to ~~lock-in~~ embrace and extend cloud customers:

https://blog.radapp.io/posts/2024/04/16/radius-accepted-as-c...

As far as recent projects that gained traction with the CNCF go, I found some nice write-ups:

https://blog.palark.com/cncf-sandbox-2023-h1/

https://blog.palark.com/cncf-sandbox-2023-h2/

https://blog.palark.com/cncf-sandbox-2024-h1/

    Go: 30
    Rust: 4 (once to implement another lang)
    Python: 2
    Java: 1
    and 2 that are mixed (Go+{C,Rust})

Fun fact, one of the 30 is Eraser - by Deis Labs.