[nanoxide]

It's for streaming on platforms like YouTube or Twitch, usually when streaming games or doing art. Instead of using a webcam to show yourself (mostly in a small overlay in a corner), you show a PNG image of yourself or an avatar. To give these static images for variety, you can change them based on voice input (i.e. as if the PNG was talking), or emotions like laughing. Related: V-Tubers which use 3D models or more intricate methods like motion capturing to animate a virtual version of themselves.

[DidYaWipe]

So... an avatar.

Why must people churn out an endless parade of non-descriptive BS, when we already have the necessary words? Depressing.

[pjc50]

See "do not post shallow dismissals to HN" rule.

Etymology is youtuber -> virtual youtuber (Kizuna Ai et al) using motion tracked 3D models -> shorten to vtuber -> people develop 2D models as cost reduction -> even further cost reduction by just representing yourself with a static image -> "pngtuber".

It also places things in a cultural context, like most language. Nobody would describe a news broadcast with a static image of the news anchor as a "pngtuber" even if technically it's similar.

[DidYaWipe]

How about "do not post meaningless titles?"

Pointing out intentional obscurity that degrades the usefulness of headlines is not "shallow dismissal." But thanks for the citation, hall monitor.

[6P58r3MXJSLi]

nitpicking but etymology isn't exactly what you think it is, what you did is explaining how a slang came to be, which is not etymology.

Anyway, according to your definition Max Headroom should be regarded as a virtual Television host or a "Vhost", except a host is a host, so a vtuber is just a youtuber and a youtuber is just a host.

> Nobody would describe a news broadcast with a static image of the news anchor as a "pngtuber" even if technically it's similar

exactly the point: a host is a host, an anchor is an anchor, that's why nobody would use "pngtuber" for "a news broadcast with a static image of the news anchor" because we already have a name for that that is good enough and generic enough to be understandable by anybody.

Instead now we got terms that are so specific that are useless in any general sense

and that's why etymology doesn't fit here, the word pngtuber is not "in the language" it's a slang and it wants to stay like that, if it eventually reaches mainstream status, pngtubers will start calling themselves jpeg2000vimeoers to separate themselves from the peasants

p.s. anyway this is nothing new, it's just a new name for something old, there was a time when internet and the computing devices in general were very limited resource wise and you had to do sh*t like this because it was the only way to do it.

[rcxdude]

Because that's how language works. vtuber/pngtuber describe a specific form of avatar, and people aren't gonna say 'they're a streamer that uses a 2D reactively animated animator' when they can say 'they're a pngtuber' and be perfectly well understood by the audience that is actually going to watch them instead of telling them to get off their lawn.

[maverwa]

I may be using the terms incorrect, but in my understanding the pngtuber/vtuber is "the person doing the streaming/video", while the "avatar" refers to their representation in video. So saying "pngtuber is different term for avatar" would be like saying "person is a old term for selfi" right?

[boredhedgehog]

This discussion is complicated by the fact that a vtuber in character is identical with his avatar, so he will refer to his avatar in first person, e.g. "My camera broke, I'll be a png-tuber today."

[rcxdude]

The {png,v}tuber is the character. For many such streamers there's relatively little difference, but some of the bigger vtubers are actually a team of people who may take turns playing the character. (Think like Hatsune Miku)

[DidYaWipe]

>people aren't gonna say 'they're a streamer that uses a 2D reactively animated animator'

And? Nobody suggested that they should.

[chiffaa]

Because "avatar" isn't specific enough - some creators use fully dynamic rigged models with motion controls (those got a name of VTubers, because they started as Virtual YouTubers, see: Kizuna Ai), some use static images (so your traditional avatars, often being commissioned artwork of their OCs) to just fill the video feed while discussing topics with no relevant footage to show (often seen with content creators covering animation). PNG-tubers, being dynamically controlled static images, are in the middle of the two, and the term appeared somewhat naturally as a result. It has a very clear definition in the area it's being used in so I wouldn't call it non-descriptive honestly

[DidYaWipe]

If you're asserting that "avatar" doesn't account for animation, why not just say "animated avatar?" That would be immediately understood by all.

[chiffaa]

"vtuber" as a term describes both the avatar used by the person and the person themselves, so it's fairly specific. Avatar is much more general

[6P58r3MXJSLi]

> some creators use fully dynamic rigged models with motion controls

> some use static images

you mean avatars?

[chiffaa]

Yep, that is exactly why I added the "your traditional avatars" part to the static images

[mqus]

"an avatar" would also cover vtubers so png-tuber is actually more accurate here

[atoav]

So its a minimalist stop motion avatar using a specific image file format (for its ability to embed an alpha channel aka transparency I guess).

I prefer minimalist stop motion avatar to "PNG-Tuber" which sounds more like a slang description of the person that relias on said avatar variant.

Also avatars in early games were exactly that simple, so that name was here before.

[TazeTSchnitzel]

It is wise to show at least a little deference to the field a term comes from. If you are not already deeply familiar with the subject matter, it is going to be hard to appreciate why particular names have caught on and why your own ideas might not be better. Immediate comprehensibility by outsiders with no prior familiarity is usually not the most important criterion.

[starkparker]

> If you are not already deeply familiar with the subject matter, it is going to be hard to appreciate why particular names have caught on

and if you're introducing a niche term to a broader audience who might lack that context, in an asynchronous or static medium like an HN post or repo README, providing a definition that describes it in more widely used terms is a low-effort way to help unfamiliar people learn about it without forcing them to ask

[DidYaWipe]

Forcing people to ask or expecting them to perform a Web search for the meaningless jargon in your title is a cornerstone of HN posting.

As is complaining and "flagging" when someone calls it out.

[mubou]

> which sounds more like a slang description of the person

Pretty sure that's the intent, since it's a play on the name "vtuber", which is used as you describe.

[0x073]

They missed the chance for the gif/jiff discussions when they choosed png fir the prefix.

[timeon]

Never too late to make png/pnj one.

[ForTheKidz]

I don't think it's depressing—every generation has to find their own voice.

[DidYaWipe]

Not really. And "finding one's voice" doesn't require a galling display of ignorance of already-available words. Fun slang makes sense; but now we have an upwelling of slang that's just ignorant.

Here and there we see exceptions; take "rizz," for example. You can see that this comes from "charisma." OK, cool. But that's an outlier now.

[throawayonthe]

It's more specific, and useful to the people using it.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jargon