[kibwen]

> if you can't appreciate how Elon managed to turn Tesla at concept car stage to current mass manufacturing capacities and being more valuable than next 7 car companies combined

So government bailouts followed by cultivating a breathless cult who throw money at making your stock the most overvalued asset in history?

[treme]

Tesla took government loans and paid them all back with interest. there was never any bailout but I can tell you just hate the man regardless of facts.

Feel free to put your money where your mouth is by shorting TESLA if you feel like it's so overvalued. and get crushed like everyone that did just that along the way.

[kibwen]

> Feel free to put your money where your mouth is by shorting TESLA if you feel like it's so overvalued

As a smart man once said: "the market can remain irrational longer than you can remain solvent".

[treme]

As a smart man once said: 'A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes.'

https://www.quora.com/Was-Tesla-bailed-out-by-the-US-governm...

No, Tesla did not receive any funds under the 2009 auto industry bailout.[1] The $80.7 billion went to Chrysler and GM.

Tesla did receive a government loan of $465 million under the Advanced Technology Vehicle Manufacturing program, a program signed into law by Bush in 2008. Tesla subsequently repaid that loan.

[arcticbull]

> Tesla took government loans and paid them all back with interest. there was never any bailout but I can tell you just hate the man regardless of facts.

Many people don't know this but the vast majority of the money that was spent in 2008 was actually given out as loans, and those loans have been repaid with interest, netting the Treasury over $100B in profit, with billions more in quarterly dividends continuing to this day from Fannie and Freddie.

Do you think the 2008 TARP package was "not a bailout" also, because it was repaid with interest?

https://projects.propublica.org/bailout/

Or would you define it more by business outlook if they hadn’t received the funds in the first place?

[jjav]

> Feel free to put your money where your mouth is by shorting TESLA if you feel like it's so overvalued. and get crushed like everyone that did just that along the way.

Selling put options on TSLA has been one of my more profitable plays for a long while, so maybe not.

[arcticbull]

Selling puts is a long position :)

[jjav]

Sorry, I meant buying puts. I mostly sell puts on other things, but on TSLA I buy puts.

[bilvar]

Selling puts is a volatility play and doesn't mean anything. Putting your money were your mouth is would be shorting the stock, good luck with that.

[arcticbull]

Only people who don't understand stock trading fundamentally would say that. You have a completely different risk profile when you sell short vs when you take a long position. You pay market interest on borrowed shares (which can eat you alive), you may get your position recalled by the lender, you may take a margin call. Being right at the wrong time is the same thing as being wrong when you're short -- not when you're long. Intelligent traders would take a short position involving options as a hedge - or would sit on the sidelines and not bother.