[kbknight]

> I don’t think this is quite as guaranteed as people think.

It is, actually. People have infinite wants. Productivity increases lead to lower prices in the sector where the productivity increases happened.

Lower prices lead people to spend the difference on something else ("private taxi for my burrito" is the meme example.)

Spending the money on something else creates the other jobs.

This is why we have 150 years of unemployment and labor force participation data, and the peaks and valleys have zero correlation with internal-combustion, electrification, or IT.

Now....are those other jobs ones represented by a 100 year old union that is used to having the entire US economy in stranglehold?

No, probably not. The overall economy gets vastly wealthier.

But, if you are a 50 year old longshoreman, that's small comfort.

[lesuorac]

> People have infinite wants.

idk, citation needed.

Plenty of people I've met had pretty finite wants. A lot of people really are very happy with their small apartment in the city, going to work, doing misc recreation, and then drinking a bit. They don't need a Rolls-Royce or a couple of yachts.

A big problem with the argument that everybody wins from trading is that sure a pair of countries can go from 5 apples and 5 pears combined to 10 apples and 10 pears combined but what happens when there's only demand for 8 apples and 8 pears? People don't work as much.

Perhaps a 50 year old longshoreman can be retrained to install solar panels or w/e. But I suspect much more they'll find an early retirement or a greeter job somewhere and the up and coming 18 yr old will install solar panels and the labor stats will show a decrease in longshoreman and an increase in installers even if the population isn't transferring between them.

[kbknight]

> Plenty of people I've met had pretty finite wants.

It was hyperbole, I'm sure there is a limit, but most people are nowhere near it. Your hypothetical content person with a small apartment isn't prepared to sacrifice for more money to buy a fancier car, sure yeah.

But, don't they sound exactly like the sort of person who saw that they could hire a taxi for their burrito at a reasonable price said "Sign me up?"

> what happens when there's only demand for 8 apples and 8 pears? People don't work as much.

I think what happens when there's only demand for 8 apples and 8 pears is people stop dreaming about finally getting enough to eat and start dreaming about having a car. And when they have the car, they dream about having 2, so mom and dad can both go somewhere. And then, they dream about having karate lessons for their kids. And once their kids are in karate and soccer and dance and track (this is where I'm at right now), the kids want to add horse-riding lessons to the mix.

Edit: I think your broader point really was that an individual, especially mid and late career can really get screwed by it. And yeah, I agree. Let's help them with the extra taxes we collect from modernizing our infrastructure.

[Uehreka]

> But, don't they sound exactly like the sort of person who saw that they could hire a taxi for their burrito at a reasonable price said "Sign me up?"

Are you talking about fact that people order take out? That’s not exactly a new or innovative phenomenon and I’m not sure what it has to do with this conversation.

Overall it sounds like you underestimate the magnitude of the issue. There are millions of Americans who have trouble making rent/mortgage while paying for groceries and healthcare costs. The current solutions aren’t working, we can’t just pour neoliberalism on this situation and expect it to solve itself.

[charliea0]

I think the point is that human demand isn't the limiting factor. Americans having trouble making rent, paying for groceries, and healthcare indicates that they need more - not that neoliberalism is a solution to anything.

[Uehreka]

If you lose your $90k/yr job at the factory and end up with a $24k/yr job flipping burgers, you won’t show up in the unemployment or labor participation stats, but your quality of life has massively decreased. That’s a problem, especially when it happens on a large scale.

It doesn’t matter if the overall economy gets wealthier if the median laborer is suffering.