[ygjb]

> Their spam filters are awful and are harming what I feel is a very important project.

Cried every marketer in history when individuals, groups, or governments implemented rules to make it hard to reach people.

> They're allowing the 1% lowest common denominator to determine what the other 99% are allowed to see.

Conversely, think of it from the perspective that those 1% of users are fed up with receiving marketing emails, and the result is that they are taking the measure they feel is effective to reduce the amount of spam they receive.

> "60% of the population have an IQ under 85; this is not a small issue." > For $25/mo, which is a 50% increase in my monthly SES cost. (pulled from your reply)

Look in the mirror. If you are attacking the intelligence of your users because they are doing the best they can with the limited tools that advertising driven companies use to manage their email, it may be worth taking some time to reflect on why that is. You want to send marketing email; you opted to use a cheaper service that has documented considerations for reputation impact. You know the correct solution, you just think you are entitled to a lower cost service to get your product in front of other people. You aren't, and it isn't the users who are the problem, it's the ecosystem.

[MaximilianKohlr]

>Conversely, think of it from the perspective that those 1% of users are fed up with receiving marketing emails

You may have missed the part where I described how I open emails with "You're receiving this email because of xyz. Please blocklist your email if you don't want any more". The link to unsubscribe/blocklist is at the top of the email. They are simply abusing the "report spam" button. They applied for something, or someone used their email to apply. Getting a response to that application is not spam.

>If you are attacking the intelligence of your users

I'm listing supporting facts for why it's insane to let less than 1% of the population to dictate something for everyone else.

> You want to send marketing email

Email. Not marketing email.

>you opted to use a cheaper service that has documented considerations for reputation impact. You know the correct solution, you just think you are entitled to a lower cost service

This is incorrect. I addressed it in a previous comment: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=41708652

[ygjb]

I didn't miss that part. I am telling you that users hitting report spam on emails (yours, or others) that they don't want to see are not abusing the button. They are sending a signal that they don't want to see (or receive) those emails anymore. They are using the user interface of their client to control their user experience because they have decided that your workflow (or others workflows) to stop receiving the messages is more annoying than hitting that button. It's not a user problem, it's an ecosystem problem, and developers and product owners like you are continuing to drive the problem by insisting that "No, it's the users who are wrong!".

> I'm listing supporting facts for why it's insane to let less than 1% of the population to dictate something for everyone else.

I would argue that there are less than 0.01% of email users in general that own or manage private or commercial distribution lists. Expecting that owners of those lists can dictate to users how the owners can access users limited attention is even more ridiculous.

Either way, you are still attacking or insulting not only your users, but also all of the people who may have or will receive unsolicited email address from a service adjacent (in a shared cloud service sense) to yours.

> Email. Not marketing email.

It appears you believe that there is a distinction. It is still a marketing email because you are using email to drive engagement or deliver service. Marketing isn't limited to a direct offer of a product or service, especially if you depend on those emails from growth or retention.

[MaximilianKohlr]

>developers and product owners like you are continuing to drive the problem by insisting that "No, it's the users who are wrong!".

This makes no sense. I'm the problem for responding to people who signed up for something?

>I am telling you that users hitting report spam on emails (yours, or others) that they don't want to see are not abusing the button. They are sending a signal that they don't want to see (or receive) those emails anymore. They are using the user interface of their client to control their user experience because they have decided that your workflow (or others workflows) to stop receiving the messages is more annoying than hitting that button. It's not a user problem, it's an ecosystem problem

The email providers need to account for that and not send emails to spam because less than half of 1% of users mark them as spam. Email providers are already taking steps (unsubscribe header) to make things easier. And as I saId, I've done everything in my power to do so as well.

>you are still attacking or insulting not only your users, but also all of the people who may have or will receive unsolicited email address from a service adjacent (in a shared cloud service sense) to yours.

I don't see how.

This doesn't appear to be useful to continue if you're insisting there are no differences between types of emails.