What do you mean "No" ? I am asking if it's traversing red lights while they are otherwise safe to traverse (no lateral traffic). What's with this amazing pessimism infecting this forum lately.
You asked whether or not the FSD ran the red lights safely. You were given the answer of "No". You never, at any point, asked whether or not "it's traversing red lights while they are otherwise safe to traverse (no lateral traffic)" which is a question that contradicts itself.
If you ask a question, someone answers, and you start berating them because they were either not able to read your mind to determine what the actual question you're asking is or gave you an answer you did not like, then why ask the question?
The article you posted a comment to shows a video of numerous instances of the FSD trying to run a red light when it is absolutely "not safe" to do so.
Usually HN engineers are able to compartmentalize and correctly answer questions like this, but it’s a lost cause with Tesla for some reason. They’re unable to separate “it did a dangerous thing, but did not cause harm” in their minds.
Yes, it has problems. Yes, it has regressions. Yes, sometimes it does dangerous things. But it drove me 400 miles, door to door, last week and did fine. There’s clearly something historic happening here, but all HN can talk about is flaws.
If someone developed a warp drive, and 25% of the time it turned the operator into jelly, we wouldn’t sit here talking exclusively about jelly. We’d talk about how warp drive is cool and what the path to fixing stuff is.
This is a good point. HN posters have some difficulty looking at the objective reality of this situation, for example some are missing the obvious comparison to a completely unrelated sci-fi hypothetical that exists in your head.
Breaking my own rule only once: My car, that I own as a consumer, drove me through town, on the freeway, through another town, and into a parking lot four hundred miles away.
Twenty years ago, that was sci-fi. HN would have been able to reason clearly about it twenty years ago.
(Yes, I know HN wasn’t around in 2004. You don’t need to nitpick that)
I actually generally agree with you. It’s amazing. And I actually feel safer with waymo than human drivers. But the idea that running a stop sign is safe because there aren’t other cars is the issue here.
> If someone developed a warp drive, and 25% of the time it turned the operator into jelly, we wouldn’t sit here talking exclusively about jelly. We’d talk about how warp drive is cool and what the path to fixing stuff is
What? Who? We'd ask why the hell people are being put in it.
The hackers of yore, the ones we respect, weren't terrorists. When they phreaked the phone company they didn't try to take down 911.
> did not cause harm
Tesla's FSD has killed people [1]. It's also been the subject of multiple recalls by federal agencies.
I looked at the very first one on the list and it says someone drunk in a non-Tesla hit a Tesla and resulted in a death of the Tesla driver.
> According to the Albuquerque Police Department, on July 1, Sandoval-Martinez was driving drunk, speeding, and without a license when he ran a red light and hit Tiger Gutierrez’s Tesla, as well as a Toyota Corolla.
Not sure why the website is putting that under a Tesla death, probably to inflate counts since there aren't many Tesla deaths due to them being very safe cars.
Why are you attributing and referencing these incidents as FSD killing people?
> it drove me 400 miles, door to door, last week and did fine
I call BS. Even in perfect weather on perfect roads with perfect visibility, 400 miles is at least 10 times as long as FSD can go without a disengagement.
I dunno what to tell you. It did it. A disengagement every 40 miles is not what I’m seeing on my car.
(By the way, this is part of the reason Tesla owners get called Elon-worshipers: we see the sentiment in places like this, it doesn’t line up with the reality we’re seeing every day, and trying to correct the discrepancy comes across as worship. It’s not, it’s just that it seems like something other than truth is driving these conversations.)
It doesn't even have to run over a pedestrian to be dangerous, such a move could very well lead to the driver being pulled over and extrajudicially executed by a trigger happy cop