[leetcrew]

idk, I honestly think congestion pricing would still be a good idea even if they just lit all the toll proceeds on fire. I almost wonder if it was a political blunder to couple "reduce cars in lower manhatten" with "more funding for MTA" in the first place.

[walterbell]

Congestion pricing has little impact on the unlimited number of cars (unlike regulated taxis) that can enter Manhattan and drive around for hours for Uber/Lyft.

[leetcrew]

I haven't yet chosen a side in the great uber vs taxi debate. but in general, driving lots of different people around all day sounds like a pretty good use of a car. it would be great to have a more comprehensive approach for pricing the least productive vehicle uses out of the most congested areas, but setting up tolls in a few choke points is a good start.

[walterbell]

> driving lots of different people around all day

Perhaps academics or NYC can analyze and publish data from Uber/Lyft on average rideshare occupancy by time of day and GPS location, e.g. what percentage of time is spent driving around empty (consuming energy, polluting), carrying a paid passenger, or parked in an area close to expected customers.

[paulgb]

Unlike in other cities, Uber/Lyft in NYC are regulated like taxis and limos. NYC has been paying a congestion surcharge on each ride since 2019, which was set to go up as part of the new congestion pricing program.

[woodruffw]

Sure it does, if they enter and leave the CBD. Cars coming and going from the UES and UWS, for example, would be subject to the charge.

(But at the same time: I don't think anybody has claimed that it's a panacea. Congestion pricing can be both good policy and still have gaps.)

[walterbell]

> still have gaps

There's always the opportunity for street/sector level surveillance via automated license plate readers. Your favorite neighborhood or street has too many cars? Impose quotas, vary the quota by time/season that only a computer can decipher, then sell "Fast Pass" exceptions to generate more revenue. Win for neo-feudal middleman, without brand licensing fees for the "environment" that justified a new digital on-demand toll economy.

[woodruffw]

I don’t understand what this has to do with congestion pricing, which AFAICT had a very simple (arguably too simple, per complaints about charging blue collar workers) fare schedule.

(I also don’t think anybody would describe Manhattan’s CBD as their favorite neighborhood.)

[walterbell]

> what this has to do with congestion pricing

Try a web search for geo-fencing, which is closely coupled to modern technology for enforcement of geo boundaries that are not gated by a physical barrier.

Manhattan Central Business District (CBD) is defined as "Manhattan south of and inclusive of 60th St" excluding some through-traffic highways.

> don't think anybody would described Manhattan’s CBD as their favorite neighborhood

It includes neighborhoods such as these, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Manhattan_neighborhood...

  Chelsea
  Chinatown
  Flatiron
  Greenwich Village
  Koreatown
  Little Italy
  Lower East Side
  NoLita
  SoHo
  Tribeca

[kevin_thibedeau]

Rideshares were capped in 2018. Only EVs are exempt from the limit.

[walterbell]

Thanks. Do you know how the limit is enforced?

[paulgb]

Uber/Lyft drivers in NYC need special plates (that start with a "T"). The commission that regulates them can simply restrict how many plates it issues/renews.

[Arainach]

Source? It absolutely has impact, as shown in other cities which have implemented congestion pricing.

[walterbell]

Impact on Uber/Lyft drivers?