[robryk]

HOAs require more than (or a very specific extension of) freedom of association to exist: they require an ability to bind any future owners of a piece of land to join the HOA (regardless of how they acquired that land: via sale, inheritance, bankruptcy, ...). For property that's not real estate that's usually not possible (see e.g. inability of companies to provide binding promises on how the data they have are used after they go bankrupt). Given that this ability applies very inconsistently across types of property, it doesn't seem like an essential part of freedom of association.

[throw0101c]

> HOAs require more than […] freedom of association to exist: they require an ability to bind any future owners of a piece of land to join the HOA […].

You are often not buying a piece of land when you move to a HOA-linked residence, rather you can be buying a particular unit, but there are also 'common areas' that are the property of the legal entity of the HOA.

If you do not want to be part of an HOA then you have to purchase what is called (at least in Canada) freehold land.

> While most people hear the word “condo” and think of an apartment style unit, that’s not always the case. Some townhouses (and even certain detached homes) are considered condos too.

* https://teamkate.ca/difference-freehold-condo-home

* https://www.squareyards.ca/blog/freehold-vs-leasehold-regart...

* https://wowa.ca/freehold-meaning

* https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freehold_(law)

If you do not want to be part of an HOA tell your real estate broker that this is one of the criteria for where you want to live.

[anymouse123456]

I have no idea about Canada, but in the US, there are lots of single-family home neighborhoods that have, "Home Owner's Associations".

[skeeter2020]

the GP wasn't talking about the type of structure but the legal organization of the property ownership. Canadian provinces have a Condominium Property Act that defines the legislative framework. The implementation can vary by types of units (ranging from apartment-style to single family homes) and the ownership - typically "you own the inside; communal outside" or "you own the inside & dirt; communal outside and shared public spaces". You don't hear talk of "The HOA" but rather "The Condo Board"

[anymouse123456]

Thanks for the clarification.

[javagram]

The local government in many areas is often requiring an HOA to be formed for new developments to manage stormwater and road maintenance that they don’t want to be responsible for.

In those situations the HOA could be seen as government imposed rather than purely “freedom of association”.

I own a 100 year old home so there is no HOA but it’s difficult for most people to afford such homes since there’s a limited supply and they’re often either in highly desirable or blighted city centers.

[NoMoreNicksLeft]

> If you do not want to be part of an HOA tell your real estate broker that this is one of the criteria for where you want to live.

Yes, tell your realtor "I don't want to look at any of the properties you have for sale, or any properties within the greater [insert city here] metro area, or for that matter any geographical location within 100 miles of here". He'd look at you less strangely, and might even chuckle instead of telling you to go fuck yourself and to not waste his time.

And the best part of all is that these two requests are essentially identical.

[marssaxman]

Where do you live? That sounds terrible.

I would never consider any house encumbered with an HOA, and I would fire any realtor who ignored my wishes by showing one - but it's never been an issue, here in Seattle.

[jghn]

At least where I live such a request would barely remove any houses from your search. Your response is very location dependent.

I for one would not only not by an HOA encumbered home but I’d not move to an area where that would be an issue

[nilamo]

People talk to real estate agents? I thought things like Zillow completely eliminated that step...

[insane_dreamer]

All Zillow does is put you in touch with a real estate agent.

[BobaFloutist]

In all fairness, if the majority of the members of the HOA don't like them, surely they could vote to disband it?

[db48x]

It can be done, yes. If the HOA owns and maintains common property then it has to dispose of that somehow. For example, it might need to sell the pool, get the city’s parks department to maintain the playground, and the wastewater department to maintain the drainage pond first.