[stetrain]

> I think we all can understand the situation here unless people are really dense.. the Artemis program was setup at a time when the private space companies were still very new.

SLS's design and shuttle-derived components were basically stipulated by Congress, specifically representatives from states where these shuttle-derived components are built and tested.

The goal here is to achieve something, yes, but doing so with billions spent in specific states is a large part of it as well. These representatives and senators also tend to still be loudly skeptical of commercial launch providers like SpaceX despite their successful track record, likely for the same reasons.

[pfdietz]

They also suppressed propellant depot work.

[stetrain]

Yep. Even taking SpaceX off the table, we could have built a lunar program based on existing launchers like the Atlas and Delta class of rockets, using smaller modules docked in orbit, and orbital refueling.

Instead we have a giant rocket that costs billions per launch whose only purpose is to launch Orion to the moon in one shot, and it can't even deliver Orion to a conventional lunar orbit.