Is the Remote Work Future?

[hiddenusername]

Hi Guys,

I have remote job from last 3 yrs and planning to go full remote. My only worry is that i shouldnt have to go back to Office based job again.

Recently all companies started calling people back to office.

What is future for the remote work? I dont think it will go away.

What is your thought?

[karaterobot]

Remote work was around before covid, and it will still be around after covid. More companies are remote-only or remote first now than were around before 2020.

I have no statistics. I'm basing this on looking for remote jobs in 2017 and 2024, and there's no comparison on what I'm seeing, really. There are so many more open positions than there were.

I imagine (again, without hard data) that it would be easier to negotiate a position listed as on-site into being remote, compared to doing that 10 years ago. Why? Because it's not considered crazy and impossible anymore, now that we've all done it.

On the other hand, more people (like yourself) want remote jobs, so there's more people going after that supply of remote work than there was before.

Still, I think on balance it's quite a bit easier to find a WFH position than it used to be, and I would not worry about the future.

[tejohnso]

> Recently all companies started calling people back to office.

This is not true. Some companies that were never remote to begin with played around with trying to go remote for some years without getting serious about it, and then stopped playing that game.

I think there are still, and will always be companies that can organize around online collaboration and communication as part of the core functioning of the organization. Done properly, a physical location will only be a hindrance because it will result in some section of the organization that is not fully engaged in the online dynamics.

When the organization is fully committed to being remote, there is no "calling people back" because there is nowhere to call back to.

[RestlessMind]

My prediction after observing the last 3 years - remote work will go away for the average worker in the US (or other high cost areas) with mediocre talents, and for the average junior engineers. Reasons are as follows.

First of all, people have genuinely different preferences when it comes to remote - some thrive in that environment, some need other people around. Same with companies too. Some companies will thrive in a fully remote setup because of remote-friendly cultures, and some won't who will be doing RTO. So I see a high chance of sortition between fully remote and hybrid/RTO companies.

Second, the hybrid/RTO companies will necessarily be present in tech hubs (like SV). For fully remote ones, there are again a few types. There are ones who see workers as mere replaceable cogs, and they will hire in the cheapest possible areas (India, Easter Europe, West Africa etc). For cogs-seekers, if timezone is a constraint, they might go to LATAM. Then there are other remote-first companies which will look for "culture fit" and language skills - they will first hire in Canada or UK/Ireland, depending on their timezone needs. A Canadian worker in Toronto is much cheaper than an American one in Nowhere, US[1]

Finally, if one is a superstar, then they will be in demand no matter where they are or what working style they prefer. Companies will always bend over backwards to accommodate their preferences.

[1] Across my entire company, 75% of the new eng headcount in the last year is in Canada or Ireland. We laid off multiple US eng as well. Canadian pay rate is much lower than even the lowest tier US rates.

[josephmosby]

For early stage growth companies (say <100 employees), I think in-person will come back unless you're planning to take a massive pay cut.

Middle stage (anywhere from 100 to 1000 employees), I think there's a lot of space for remote. You're competing for talent with everyone at that point, and you're not cash-rich... the amount you spend on office space could also be spent on another engineer or couple of salespeople.

Large stage, I feel like Stripe's hybrid approach will be the model. There will be in-office roles in key geographies where pay is better, and there's an expectation of being in the office at least a few days each week. There will also be a "remote" option, and entire teams will be remote. Salaries will probably be a bit lower and promotions beyond a certain level will be tougher.

What's influencing my perspective: I'm at a mostly remote company with ~500 employees, and while ICs are generally remote all the time, there's some expectation on managers and above to occasionally travel into the office. And I've got some friends working at Salesforce in Denver who see it's tough to get beyond manager level in any non-hub office, and the few Directors are regularly traveling to SF. No VPs based in the non-hub offices.

[e_i_pi_2]

COVID of course influenced this a bunch, but I've been at a company a few years and saw it grow from 30->130 employees - originally we were fully in office, then remote for covid, now it's settling back in to a hybrid approach where teams decide for themselves what works best (sales is generally in every day, dev is a few days a month if they're local), and then we have some requests to all come in to the office if the board/clients are coming in.

My hope for the future is that we basically pay for commuting time, so then employers can decide if it's worth asking someone to come in when they live farther away. Also seems like management does go in more for political reasons but I think that's specific to the org. I'm a huge fan of the way Automattic sets up their culture where it's remote-first so you don't end up with that two-tiered system - you can go in to an office if you want but everything has to be done online so there's a record to look back on later

[ckdarby]

Early stage companies seem to have a huge benefit from the ad-hoc communication and ease of communication the office provides.

More mature and larger companies can cut huge expenses by getting rid of their offices and then outpace any of their competitors not doing that.

[usrusr]

Lots of openings that offer in-country full remote (or something like full except for a quarterly meetup) in Germany. The impression I get is that the reasoning goes "if we tap the country-wide remote pool the perfect skillset match will become a reality" (but the aggregate supply/demand mismatch won't really change for non-niche demand, it just means even less acceptance for not quite perfect matches)

[friend_and_foe]

Remote work is the future of work that you don't need to be physically present at a location to do. You'd be surprised by some things you do need to be physically present to do, even if it's only sometimes, so there will be a lot of "remote but you must live within X miles of location" type jobs.

For the rest, it's kind of like uber. Anyone with the right skills and equipment can do the job from anywhere, but you're self employed. This doesn't work out for everybody, it drives pay down. Why pay SF wages when workers don't have SF cost of living? It's going to work a lot like call center outsourcing, information workers will be where they're competent and cheap, and it doesn't matter where in the world that is. If you've been freelancing a while you know what's coming. If you've been a salaried employee, get ready to make trade offs. Sounds great to be remote, and it is, but you're competing with people all over the world for that job, and many of them don't need a quarter million dollars a year to do the job.

I personally think it's a fantastic thing. A lot of people don't like it when pay goes down. I personally don't care what my pay is, only what my standard of living is, and if I live somewhere cheap and have a higher standard of living with lower pay I'm happy. Costs do need to go down, and some of you reading this are ridiculously overpaid (and many of you know it) which is not sustainable and wasn't going to last forever no matter what happened. A good effect of this is that if you do work that requires you to be somewhere it will come with a premium, physical workers are going to be getting a pay bump without having to have a union negotiate it for them or a cartel agreement to keep pay high.

A lot of people don't like change. Any change creates some who benefit and some who lose out. But it's happening and can't be stopped.

[noashavit]

I think it really depends on the market- industry and location. In the Bay Area startup scene, I've been seeing more of the larger orgs transition to a hybrid workflorce, following the FAANG trend. The smaller startups (<50) will still be remote with a preference for hybrid, and the earlier staged (ones <25) will opt for on-site if they have an office, and remote if they don't have an office location.

I've been hearing murmurs that perhaps the future will hold rate cuts for remote employees, or standardization of wages regardless of location (at least in the US, which will lead to rate cuts in CA, NY, WA, and a hand full of others).

There are companies that have always been remote, even before COVID. So fully remote work won't go away. My recommendation to you is to focus on earlier-staged startups, if you have an interest in that and the necessary grit. There are also sites that focus on remote jobs that can help guide your search.

[blovescoffee]

Maybe larger companies are calling back remote workers but many small-medium companies still offer remote for a variety of reasons (competition, savings, etc). I just accepted an offer at a 500ish person company working fully remote.

[al_borland]

There is no universal answer. I’ve been remote for the last 4 years, and will be as long as I work at my current job. However, when I was looking to buy a house, I decided not to move to the middle of nowhere, because I didn’t want to lock myself into remote jobs being the only option for the rest of my life. No one knows what the future holds. I’m sure some jobs will always be remote, but that doesn’t mean mine always will be. It’s good to have options.

[that_guy_iain]

Remote is it was the past few years was always going to be a short term thing.

Companies see more benefits to them to have people in office. And at the end of the day, the point of us working for them is for the benefit of the company.

[dc3k]

> Recently all companies started calling people back to office.

This is such an odd thing to say. It's very plainly untrue.

[wslh]

I think the future is hybrid. Remote work is not for anyone nor for any company. In many cases remote work is in favor of the worker for not work. I think, philosophically and legally speaking, we should review remote work fully to give a protection to workers and companies alight.

[ultrablack]

I love working remote, but in my current management position, it is really hard to know what people are doing.

We have 4 developers. 2 are just performing. 1 is Ok. 1 does whatever he feels like. And one seems to be focused on something else.

So, its not clearcut if remote is good or bad. It depends on the developer.

[ketanmaheshwari]

How would this be different if they all were physically in the same office? Would you stop by their office and tell them to do what you prefer them to be doing? If so, is it not possible to tell them remotely over a Zoom call?

[hiddenusername]

True, I have been managing team remotely. Its entirely depend on the developer. Some developers doesnt work in the remote. The remote is entirely trust based.

My team was entirely remote who was performing better then the team which was entirely working from office.

[e_i_pi_2]

I agree there's somewhat more trust involved, e.g. you don't know if they go to the park for the day and just check notifications on their phone, but you still have all the performance metrics to look at. If the person is doing all their work then it might be better to let them take that day at the park when they feel like it, especially if it's a salary position then you're more expected to do a certain amount of work then to be working a certain amount of hours.

Worst case you can always ask someone "hey can you show me what you did last week?" and it should be clear if someone isn't handling their responsibilities.

[StopShitposting]

Go to work.