[randomdata]

> What you're saying is like can you work for a Canadian company while living in the U.S?

Yes, of course. You do need government approval, but generally they are willing.

However, one of the supposed goals of the EU's creation was to allow free movement of labour across member countries. Exactly so you can work in another EU country without having to secure government approval.

It is interesting that you say not only did the EU fail on that front, but that it has managed to create a situation worse than countries that have never made a formal attempt to go down that road.

[lm28469]

Well yes, free movement of labor, aka people _moving_ to their job. Not people fleeing their country to enjoy cheap Greek beaches on German salaries

[FirmwareBurner]

The EU "freedom of movement" for work was drafted something like 60 years ago, well before the advent of remote work or even the internet itself, and is in a dire need of an update to modern times and modern ways of work.

Labor mobility doesn't just mean me being free to moving across countries for work.

Labor mobility means me being free to work for whichever company I want in the EU as an EU citizen, it doesn't have to mandate that I have to physically be there in that country for that particular job if physical presence is not required for that job (aka the majority of the white collar laptop-class, which we learned in the pandemic)

Does my code run better at my German employer if run from a German home wifi instead of a Romanian or Bulgarian home wifi? Then why should I have to be in Germany to do that job and not any other EU state suffice?

Yes, I know about all the different laws and taxes of each country and all that legal mumbo-jumbo, but those laws that hinder this can always be changed in order to facilitate this, same how we changed them to have free trade of goods, free EU wide emergency healthcare for EU members, or how we abolished GSM roaming fees such that my SIM hooks on to any cell tower on EU soil and I don't have to pay extra, ain't that amazing.

So then why aren't we(the EU) doing it? Eu-wide remote work labor regualtions(or more like de-regualtuions) would bring more benefits to the block as a whole.

[lm28469]

Again, it's already possible. The EU's job isn't to please a couple thousands of code monkeys who want to get German salaries and Spanish lifestyle. The IT sector is one of the least impacted here, because it's already possible for companies to hire from other EU countries if they really want to

[meheleventyone]

Whilst I agree with you in principle it’s also employers being lazy, they absolutely can take on the burden of paying someone in a different country as an employee.

I work for a US based company in Iceland and they pay me as a FTE here and have done/do so in multiple other European countries.

[FirmwareBurner]

>it’s also employers being lazy, they absolutely can take on the burden of paying someone in a different country as an employee

It's less about being lazy and more about the financial, law and tax overhead that comes with legally employing someone in another EU country as a FTE, as in most cases it means opening up a subsidiary/legal entity in that country which means another country who's laws you have to comply with. Not a huge issue for large enterprises which are already present in most countries anyway, but a big problem for small and medium sized companies. Unlike when doing business, a single EU legal entity is not enough to hire people remotely, you need a presence in each country where your workforce resides.

>I work for a US based company in Iceland and they pay me as a FTE here and have done/do so in multiple other European countries.

May I ask how? Did your employer open up an Iceland entitty or did they use some employer of record?

[randomdata]

"You have free movement to any country in the EU you want... Unless you want to keep your job, then you've another thing coming!" is not a freedom.

Which is fine. The people of the EU can make whatever decisions they want. But it is funny that it has ended up with less freedom, after wanting to provide more freedom, than countries that have never tried to give more freedom.

[meheleventyone]

Arguably most people’s jobs don’t let them move countries and being able to do so is largely the preserve of the fortunate. I imagine most people would also find it hard to move any significant internal distance.

You’d be amazed at how many people make use of this freedom in the EU though despite the cultural, linguistic and bureaucratic barriers. It was pretty mind blowing to me when I could just move my life from Scotland to Iceland. Particularly as that’s a significantly different transition than moving from one state in the US to another.

[randomdata]

Generally, if you have work authorization in a given country, it is unlikely that country cares where you actually do the work. In fact, it is normally considered beneficial for a country to allow domestic work to happen outside of its borders in order to grease international trade.

In a vacuum it may not be surprising that EU member countries have chosen to be more protectionist. However, the EU was created specifically to allow free movement of labour. For it to explicitly deny free movement of labour is... interesting.

[FirmwareBurner]

>Generally, if you have work authorization in a given country, it is unlikely that country cares where you actually do the work. In fact, it is normally considered beneficial for a country to allow domestic work to happen outside of its borders in order to grease international trade.

That's false for a lot of the EU. It's usally the opposite. They force you to do the work within gthe country's premises so you contribute to the taxes and busineses there instead of abroad.

[randomdata]

Yes, we know. That is what the entire discussion has been about...