[latency-guy2]

> If we’re just going to be forced to work for rich people 7 days a week we may as well make our own stuff, barter with our community 7 days week.

You've always had that option, you just can't force other people into your system.

Freedom to choose, and I choose to not be in whatever unformed economic idealistic system you come up with.

[ngoro7bd]

No I don’t have that choice; I have to play fiat wealth accumulation to buy land. An ideal system for fiat wealth game players.

I can’t force you, but society at large can put upon you whatever it wants and you have no choice but to accept it.

For example; status quo socialized meme of your ideal society is none of us have to lift finger to heal or feed someone in need. Including you should you find yourself penniless in alleyway.

You don’t define for others where “idealistic” applies. This is an ideal system for some and I don’t have to accept that. You don’t define language associations for others.

You might go meditate on the depth to which physics like relativity and entropy apply to social life. Also how socialized discovery of goods, services and prices our system is ostensibly built around isn’t at all hardcore free market capitalism.

Whatever message wins over the aggregate wins. Gen Alpha is just a few years from graduating HS and running into the same systemic issues as GenZ and Millennials based upon politically contrived ideals that insulate a minority from real work keeping themselves alive. If that is all Gen Alpha is going to get out of the system after watching the same put upon their elder siblings, good luck keeping your ideal system in place.

Inline with the logic of the system you prefer, if you end up in the gutter; oh well.

[sokoloff]

> No I don’t have that choice; I have to play fiat wealth accumulation to buy land.

Why can you not barter within the community for the land you need?

If you’d talked about needing to break out of the barter economy to trade for fiat to pay government taxes on income or land, I’d agree that you can’t have a fully closed barter economy, but for the acquisition of land itself, you can barter.

[ngoro7bd]

I have tried. Landholders these days are locked into loans; be it initial mortgage or equity loans. They can’t barter land away, as the banks (with government backing) demand fiat capital.

Most cannot afford to own anything; most rent from a back but semantically claim ownership. The rich propagate hallucination their portfolio of assets gives them greater leverage via the sycophancy of their large flock… er… shareholders.

Take the metaphor, analogy, poetry out of the Bible and you’re left with rudimentary framework that became capitalism. A few shekels and goats for a daughter.

Makes sense. In the US sense of obligation, participation in religious activities only began to decline in the early 2000s.

Brainwave sync with prior generations, true believers, was embedded implicitly.

That signal is being attenuated by generational churn.

[sokoloff]

That seems likely that you didn’t offer enough in barter for them to satisfy their obligations to others, in other words not that “bartering for land can’t work” but rather “bartering for land doesn’t work if the goods offered for land is too low”.

[influx]

Your ideal system forces people to involuntarily provide labor for others at no cost.

No thanks.

[ngoro7bd]

Ah no; it requires people to learn how to, and do more towards, their real survival, take demand off others bodies.

Grab a shovel and grow some carrots and potatoes for yourself.

No one owes beating up their body to feed you. I had a friend commit suicide rather than spend the rest of his life in chronic pain acquired by via a construction career.

Your ideal system seems to be extract as much as possible no matter the cost to others (fiat or real). If you end the same way; oh well.

[latency-guy2]

> You don’t define for others where “idealistic” applies. This is an ideal system for some and I don’t have to accept that. You don’t define language associations for others.

If I can't do it, then who gave you authority? Rules for thee is all it seems to be these days.

Anyways, I think I've had enough of communists for the remainder of the year.